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Old 04-02-2019, 12:15 PM   #1
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F53 - Replace ignition switch

Every now and then when I went to start the engine, I'd turn the key and nothing.. It would always start on attempt number 2 or three. The previous owner warned me about this and said it was like that when he bought it..

Last week I had the steering column apart to change the shift lever OD button. so I decided to while I had things apart, I'd install a new ignition switch. The new switch cost $10 from Rock Auto.

The job took about 10 minutes, remove the connector, and then remove the two screws that hold the switch in.

I did a short write-up with a couple photos and links.

F53 replace ignition switch – 1999 Southwind 35S


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1999 Fleetwood Southwind 35S (Ford F53 6.8L V10 275hp 4R100 4 spd trans) - Toad 2003 Saturn Vue.
(www.1999Southwind.com)

It won't do MACH 2, but I can get a sandwich and take a pee.
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Old 04-02-2019, 09:32 PM   #2
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Nice job! I hope that it helps someone down the road. Thanks for posting!
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Old 07-15-2019, 07:43 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waiter21 View Post
Every now and then when I went to start the engine, I'd turn the key and nothing.. It would always start on attempt number 2 or three. The previous owner warned me about this and said it was like that when he bought it..

Last week I had the steering column apart to change the shift lever OD button. so I decided to while I had things apart, I'd install a new ignition switch. The new switch cost $10 from Rock Auto.

The job took about 10 minutes, remove the connector, and then remove the two screws that hold the switch in.

I did a short write-up with a couple photos and links.

F53 replace ignition switch – 1999 Southwind 35S


..
Many thanks for pictures and all the details.

Just ordered the Ignition switch.

I can only start if I short my starter solenoid. Seems like my Ignition switch has a problem. I tested my DTR and I receive like 15V on pin 10. And my DTR does what it is suppose to do to send pin 10 to pin 12. Then my pin 12 of DTR send this signal to the solenoid. This 15V is probably ghost power with almost 0 amperes since it can't activate my solenoid. So I am all mixed up and just ordered the Ignition Switch.
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Fleetwood Pace Arrow vision 36.5 on Ford F53 1999 gas, V10, 6.8l with 4R100 Transmission
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Old 07-15-2019, 12:01 PM   #4
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When I write DTR I mean: Transmission Range Sensor TRS or DTR Sensor.

The DTR Sensor on the transmission must be adjusted correctly so that when the transmission is in P or in N the circuit between pin 10 and 12 will be closed. This system is to make sure we can NOT start the starter when in "Drive".

The DTR sensor can be ajusted by making sure the lines are together when the transmission is in N like on this picture:



See this thread to read about the DTR.

The pins for the connector on the DTR Sensor are :



The wire connected to pin 12 goes to the Starter Solenoid to activate it. Normally pin 10 receive power from the PCM when we start the key.

How I did my testing of the DTR sensor:

1 - I disconnected the connector on the DTR.
2 - Then when the motorhome is in P I test with a ohmmeter that pin 10 on the sensor let the power go to pin 12. This was ok and tells me that the DTR sensor is not the problem.
3 - When someone try to start with the key I check pin 10 on the DTR sensor harness to see if I receive power on start. It's weird, I got 15 volts and was expecting 12.4V. So I have ordered a new Ignition Switch. I suppose my 15V was a ghost signal with 0 amperes since my solenoid is not activated by it.
4 - I tested to make sure the wire on the harness for pin 12 correctly goes to the solenoid. I did this verification by sending +12V on the this pin and the starter worked. This means this wire between the DTR sensor and the Starter Solenoid is ok.

Since I don't have the wiring diagram for my F53 I could not test the wire on the DTR sensor harness for the pin 10. Maybe this wire is bad. Maybe the Ignition Switch is bad. So next week when I receive my Ignition Switch from Rockauto I will see if my problem is solved. If the problem is not solved then I will be looking for the wiring diagram for my F53. I have ordered the Repair manual that Rockauto sells for my F53. Hope it will show the wiring.

I must say that the first action I did before testing my DTR sensor was to clean all my various grounds cables (engine and chassis ground), battery cables, starter connectors, solenoid connectors, ground and Battery cables on the BCC (Battery Control Center) etc. I wanted to make sure it was not a loose connection or a bad connection or a dirty connector that was causing my problem.

N.B.: You can click on the links to see the parts I bought on rockauto.
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Fleetwood Pace Arrow vision 36.5 on Ford F53 1999 gas, V10, 6.8l with 4R100 Transmission
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Old 07-19-2019, 10:46 AM   #5
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Just received the repair manual. There is more than 60 pages out of probably 4000 to 6000 pages just for ignition-start. Eveybody should have it. Full of pictures. Very easy to diagnose! See the link on my previous post for this Repair Manual 1999 on Rockauto. 27$CAD or probably 20$US. They have probably your year model too!

My previous posts were right about DTR testing. In the repair manual they show also how to test PCM to Ignition switch connections. But when the Ignition switch is so old, so easy to change and so cheap it's not a bad idea to just change it right away. Took 10 minutes to remove. I should receive new one next tuesday.
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Old 07-19-2019, 12:13 PM   #6
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Quote:
My previous posts were right about DTR testing. In the repair manual they show also how to test PCM to Ignition switch connections. But when the Ignition switch is so old, so easy to change and so cheap it's not a bad idea to just change it right away. Took 10 minutes to remove. I should receive new one next tuesday.
Yah, that's kind of how I look at it.. Its 20 years old, its cost $10. If it fails while on the road, I'm dead in the water. So its one of those things that I replaced as a preventative measure.

I went through mine and did this with most inexpensive sensors, i.e. cam position, crank position, speed, OD shifting stalk, etc..
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1999 Fleetwood Southwind 35S (Ford F53 6.8L V10 275hp 4R100 4 spd trans) - Toad 2003 Saturn Vue.
(www.1999Southwind.com)

It won't do MACH 2, but I can get a sandwich and take a pee.
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Old 07-19-2019, 01:35 PM   #7
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Yah, that's kind of how I look at it.. Its 20 years old, its cost $10. If it fails while on the road, I'm dead in the water. So its one of those things that I replaced as a preventative measure.

I went through mine and did this with most inexpensive sensors, i.e. cam position, crank position, speed, OD shifting stalk, etc..
In fact if someone has an old motorhome and doesn't know the age of the various parts, then when he need to change the starter he should change also the Solenoid Relay for 15$, the DTR for 20$ and the Ignition Switch. He would then be ok for another 10 more years for the starting system.
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Fleetwood Pace Arrow vision 36.5 on Ford F53 1999 gas, V10, 6.8l with 4R100 Transmission
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Old 07-29-2019, 11:26 AM   #8
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Does anybody know where the Clutch Pedal Position connector is on the F53?

Does anybody know where the Clutch Pedal Position connector is on the F53? It is also called the Clutch Interlock Switch. It prevent starting the motor when the clutch is not in use.

I received and changed my "Ignition Switch" but it did not solved my problem.

So now that I have the Repair Manual I need to go tru all the STEPS to troubleshoot my problem.

The repair manual wants me to test the wire from the CPP to the transmission DTR sensor. The CPP is the Cluth Pedal Position harness connector. Since we don't have a Clutch Pedal (automatic transmission) they simply put a Jumper Connector I guess. I need also to test a wire from the Ignition Switch to the CPP.

Here is a picture of the harness connector that I am looking for:

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