Ford V-10 Overheating

[SEAVIEW 33]

We have a 99 National Sea View 33 with the Ford Triton V-10 with 60,000 miles. Runs great, does not use oil or lose coolant. When climbing a long hill the temp gauge rises to the red, though by turning the dash heat on full the temp rise stops, and as soon as you top the hill the temp returns to normal quickly. This happens even when not towing another vehicle, and with the outside air temp at 80. I have changed the thermostat and replaced the coolant with the same (red) type that came out, mix is correct. All hoses have been checked and are fine. Cooling system has been flushed. I see that there was a thread on this a few years ago, but nothing conclusive about the problem or fix, though there was discussion about a high flow water pump, fan clutch, air dam, etc. We just returned from San Diego and the problem remains, and are heading to Arizona soon, so I would like to resolve this before we go. Does anyone know how the previous fellows problem was resolved?

[ga traveler]

You have the wrong type antifreeze in your coach. Ford says to use E2FZ-19549-AA This antifreeze is green in color. You can call Prestone and half of their people will tell you that it is OK to use long life antifreeze, but this is wrong. Ford says the green antifreeze makes a coating on the inside of the cooling system. It must have this to work correctly. This is not something I heard or something a friend told me. This is from the Ford head engine engineer at the Louisville Dealer show.

[LVJ58]

You rarely hear of an overheating issue with the v10, when climbing grades, do you hear your radiator fan engage, it tends to roar a bit?

If not, probably bad fan clutch. If it does, then it's something else. Normally the v10 will begin shutting down when coolant temp becomes excessive, you start to lose power.

When the temp gets that high, do you notice a loss of power? If not, you could have a bad temp sending unit or temp gauge.

Let us know what you find. If I'm not mistaken, Ford has changed and now using a coolant that's yellow in color in their newer chassis.

[justimagination]

...Seaview 33, first let me welcome you to IRV2, a great place to share your stories, problems, and learn a lot of good information. With that said, sounds like you have done your homework with what you have already done.
1st and so important, do you ever have to add coolant to your burp coolant tank ? If so, there is a leak somewhere. Find a pressure tester if need be and pressure test the system to the correct lbs. noted on the radiator cap. When the temp starts to rise, as someone already has noted, the engine fan should begin to ROAR until temperature starts to fall, if not, replace the clutch fan. Be sure you replace it with the correct one from Ford. There should be a STAMPED CODE on the front of the clutch fan, usually two letters. Don't be mistaken by replacement parts by outside vendor's. Last but not least, don't forget to replace the radiator cap, unless you already have, hopefully with the correct one. JMHO, good luck,
David G.

[ga traveler]

Quote:

Originally Posted by LVJ58 You rarely hear of an overheating issue with the v10, when climbing grades, do you hear your radiator fan engage, it tends to roar a bit? If not, probably bad fan clutch. If it does, then it's something else. Normally the v10 will begin shutting down when coolant temp becomes excessive, you start to lose power. When the temp gets that high, do you notice a loss of power? If not, you could have a bad temp sending unit or temp gauge. Let us know what you find. If I'm not mistaken, Ford has changed and now using a coolant that's yellow in color in their newer chassis.

LVJ58 is correct about the yellow antifreeze. The V10 thru 2005 used green antifreeze. From 2006-2011 uses gold. The problem with switching an earlier engine to the long life antifreeze,If I remember correctly, is that the coating breaks loose and stops up the small cooling tubes in the radiator.

[SEAVIEW 33]

First thanks to everyone for the advice, this really is a great way to get help and support! We bought our motorhome in 2008 and in the three years since have put over 35,000 miles on it and really enjoy it. It seems like we are either on the road or planning our next trip. This is our first motorhome, and with the miles we've travelled and the places it has taken us with very little trouble, I think its a great unit.

As our motorhome was 9 years old when we bought it, I dont know if it has the original engine, or if it was replaced with a unit that would require the "red" anti freeze, though I doubt it but will check. The only other reason I can think of for someone to use the wrong anti freeze would be a boo boo. We have never boiled over or lost any coolant, or had to top up the reservoir. I always watch the gauges pretty close, and the first time this happened and every time since when the gauge gets close to the red I dump heat through the heater or pull over if we have to and leave the engine run while it cools down so I dont beleive we have ever hurt the engine or cooling system. I will change the fan, flush the system and the rad, install the correct anti freeze, and see if we have the cure. Here's hoping!!

[Aguyfromcalg]

I wonder if the temperature sensor should be changed at the same time. It may be giving a false reading

[koda59]

I have a 2005 Georgie Boy on a 2004 chassis. My manual calls for Ford engine coolant part number VC-7A spec WSS-M97B51-A1. This is yellow colored. I recommend you check with a ford dealer to be on the safe side.

[She and I]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SEAVIEW 33 First thanks to everyone for the advice, this really is a great way to get help and support! We bought our motorhome in 2008 and in the three years since have put over 35,000 miles on it and really enjoy it. It seems like we are either on the road or planning our next trip. This is our first motorhome, and with the miles we've travelled and the places it has taken us with very little trouble, I think its a great unit. As our motorhome was 9 years old when we bought it, I dont know if it has the original engine, or if it was replaced with a unit that would require the "red" anti freeze, though I doubt it but will check. The only other reason I can think of for someone to use the wrong anti freeze would be a boo boo. We have never boiled over or lost any coolant, or had to top up the reservoir. I always watch the gauges pretty close, and the first time this happened and every time since when the gauge gets close to the red I dump heat through the heater or pull over if we have to and leave the engine run while it cools down so I dont beleive we have ever hurt the engine or cooling system. I will change the fan, flush the system and the rad, install the correct anti freeze, and see if we have the cure. Here's hoping!!

Hi All, You are loosing pressure! radiator that is....thats why when you turn on the heat it gives the cooling system more cooling.....think about it heater core is anouther radiator....pressure test your system and don't forget the cap! you are sucking air or some reason you are not holding pressure....maybe even water pump...........easy test, good luck
Richard

[Capt. Flipper]

Seaview 33, I have a 99 Dolphin with exactly the same situation. 75,000 miles on odo and problem has existed for as long as I have owned the coach (10 years & 70,000 miles).

Here is what I have done:
Flush and replace green coolant
Replace pressure cap
Replace thermostat
Replace fan clutch
Replace radiator
Replace serpentine belt

Nothing has made a bit of difference

Here is what I do know:
Factory temp gauge has a very non-linear calibration by design for reasons I can only guess. It reads about one third of full scale at the normal operating temp of 195 -205. As temp rises, it doesn't budge until 230. At 240 the needle is just entering the red zone. These readings are from the computer via a Scan Gauge which I use to monitor water temp, cylinder head temp, trans fluid temp and inlet air temp.

Like you, I would back off when the needle approached the red zone or turn on the heater. Recently, I decided "screw it" and didn't back off and found something very interesting. The temp never went over 240 and after sitting ther for a minute or so began to fall slowly all the way back to 220. All the while, I was still pulling an 11 mile long steep grade, towing and at max GVW, 90F ambient, 4500 rpm. It would appear the only reason for the drop is the fan clutch kicking in.

I have repeated this a couple times over the past year with similar results.

At this point, here is what I believe:
There are no defective parts and the system is performing as designed and is slightly under cooled. Remember, it has never exceeded 240F. The engine protection circuitry which is calibrated to kick in above 250F, has never done so and I have never boiled over.

My plan:
Experiment with baffling behind the grille to get more airflow thru the radiator. Adding a pusher fan might work but noisy and actually blocks some airflow when not running. Mostly, I am going to ignor the issue and have fun RVing.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

[tderonne]

Finally got to an answer I like (above).

It's a 3 position gauge: Cold, OK, Hot. Just because you are "in the red" doesn't mean it has "overheated", just hot.

My fan clutch kicks on at like 210. It's activated by air temp, not coolant temp, so it does vary a bit. Need to verify yours is coming on.

I added an air dam / chin spoiler under my radiator. Before I added it the fan clutch would kick in doing 70 MPH on flat ground on an 80° day. There was a 70 MPH wind and the fan needed to come on! Since adding the airdam I can count the number of times the fan clutch has kicked in on one hand with a few fingers to spare, and it's been on for at least 3 summers now. My coolant temp is 191° - 193° 99% of the time now.

[LVJ58]

Page 68 of my 2000 v10 Owners manual details how the "Fail-Safe Cooling Works."

In general it reads "when it reaches a preset over-temperature it automatically switches to alternating cylinder operation with each disabled cylinder acting as an air pump to help cool the engine." This results in loss of power with rough running engine.

When this occurs power will be limited and the air conditioning system becomes disabled. Continued operation will result in complete automatic shut down to prevent engine damage.

I had mine go into the "LIMP" mode when the lower radiator hose came loose and dumped coolant so I'm convinced the "Fail-Safe" cooling feature does work.

[John Hilley]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Capt. Flipper Seaview 33, I have a 99 Dolphin with exactly the same situation. 75,000 miles on odo and problem has existed for as long as I have owned the coach (10 years & 70,000 miles). Here is what I have done: Flush and replace green coolant Replace pressure cap Replace thermostat Replace fan clutch Replace radiator Replace serpentine belt Nothing has made a bit of difference Here is what I do know: Factory temp gauge has a very non-linear calibration by design for reasons I can only guess. It reads about one third of full scale at the normal operating temp of 195 -205. As temp rises, it doesn't budge until 230. At 240 the needle is just entering the red zone. These readings are from the computer via a Scan Gauge which I use to monitor water temp, cylinder head temp, trans fluid temp and inlet air temp. Like you, I would back off when the needle approached the red zone or turn on the heater. Recently, I decided "screw it" and didn't back off and found something very interesting. The temp never went over 240 and after sitting ther for a minute or so began to fall slowly all the way back to 220. All the while, I was still pulling an 11 mile long steep grade, towing and at max GVW, 90F ambient, 4500 rpm. It would appear the only reason for the drop is the fan clutch kicking in. I have repeated this a couple times over the past year with similar results. At this point, here is what I believe: There are no defective parts and the system is performing as designed and is slightly under cooled. Remember, it has never exceeded 240F. The engine protection circuitry which is calibrated to kick in above 250F, has never done so and I have never boiled over. My plan: Experiment with baffling behind the grille to get more airflow thru the radiator. Adding a pusher fan might work but noisy and actually blocks some airflow when not running. Mostly, I am going to ignor the issue and have fun RVing. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

I have noted exactly the same thing and have also decided to ignore it also. I would never have known about it if I hadn't installed a Scan Gauge II.

[trainsktg]

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Hilley I have noted exactly the same thing and have also decided to ignore it also. I would never have known about it if I hadn't installed a Scan Gauge II.

Yes that was good information.

Keith