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03-21-2017, 09:17 PM
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#1
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Chicago Metro
Posts: 3,949
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Michelin Tire Issue
2016 Itasca Suncruiser 38Q-U1 (F53 26k chassis) with Michelin 255/80R 22.5 XRV tires on both axles. The MH has 11,000+ mostly interstate miles on it. After pulling into our current park a few days ago the parking assistance noticed that the two front axle tires were severely worn on the outer edge with the left front tire being the worst...the steel belts are just about ready to show. This is my first experience with Michelin tires as well as with 22.5-inch tires. Both of our previous MHs had Goodyear tires with which we were very happy and gave us excellent service and miles.
I noticed no excessive handling issues leading up to the discovery. I did have a steering stabilizer (Blue Ox TruCenter) installed just before we left on our current trip (early March). Pressure is set per inflation tables. From what I can see the dualies on the rear axle seem ok.
Several folks in the park who claim they have the necessary experience tell me it is not an alignment issue, not the fault of the steering stabilizer but rather a poor tire. One urged me to get Toyo tires, another suggested BF Goodrich. One of the local tire shops that deal in 22.5 tires suggests going with Michelins. Since I had good service from Goodyear I am leaning towards the G670s but the shop says while they will sell them to me they will not warrant them. A quick search of the forums seems to suggest that the Michelins are a poor tire but there are those who love the Michelins and hate the other brands. Needless to say the options, along with what might have happened had the discovery not been made, are spinning in my head.
I'm looking to replace these tires with a quality tire. Price is not an issue as I don't believe in scrimping on tires but I do believe in value.
Questions:
- looking for thoughtful, reasoned opinions on the replacement tires.
- I'm planning on having the 4-rear tires examined and if OK I'll leave them be. Any reason not to?
- I'm going to have the front-end re-aligned post tire purchase. I'm also having the Blue Ox TruCenter examined to make sure it was installed correctly and is operating properly. Is there any reason to suspect a bad alignment or the TruCenter as the proximate cause of the tire issue?
- We're currently in Phoenix (Mesa) until mid-April and have spoken with Robert's Tires and will be speaking with Danny's Big Rig Resort in the next couple of days. Does anyone have any experience with either shop or have any other dealer recommendations that deal in 22.5-inch tires?
Thanks for reading.
__________________
Rich, Ham Radio, Sport Pilot
Retired 9-1-1 Admin.
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03-22-2017, 05:22 AM
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#2
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Senior Member
Winnebago Owners Club
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,636
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From what you described YES it sounds like an alignment issue. Did you get a front end alignment done after you'd loaded up your coach with everything you planned on carrying? If not then that's defiantly is your issues. The wear you described is not an issue associated with Michelin's as much as is was associated with some Goodyear tires.
__________________
2012 Journey 40U (Our Incredible Journey)
2008 Dodge Dakota(TOAD) 2005 Honda Shadow in TOAD
AF-1 braking system
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03-22-2017, 06:03 AM
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#3
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Senior Member
Tiffin Owners Club
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Maryland
Posts: 1,432
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I had a similar issue with the front outside edges wearing on the Michelin tires. I caught it early and had it checked at it was an alignment issue. I had the tire rotated after the alignment.We have put 35000 miles on since and no further issue with the outside edges wearing.
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03-22-2017, 08:25 AM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Pensacola FL
Posts: 1,451
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Absolutely positively have the front end aligned at the time the tires are installed or before. The wear issues you are describing sound like an alignment issue to me. Do not torture the new tires by subjecting them to a misaligned coach. I'ld investigate the Michelin FMCA tire program to save you some money.
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Brenda & AL
2017 Thor Venetian, T42 "Groot"
2020 Chevy Sonic, 2019 KTM 790 Duke
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03-22-2017, 08:52 AM
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#5
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Senior Member
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Diamond Bar, CA
Posts: 757
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You should ask when the alignment equipment was last calibrated and ask for a 4 wheel alignment with weights at the end of each axle. You want before and after print outs of the alignment so you can see what they did for your money.
__________________
2012 Bay Star 2901, 2 ACs, 5.5KW Onan, 765W solar & Outback FM-60, 800 AH Lifeline AGMs & Magnum MS2812 + AGS + BMK, Koni FSDs, Safe-T-Plus, Super Steer Rear Track Bar, MCD Duo shades w/powered cockpit, remodeled galley, Sumo springs and 2008 Tacoma 4x4 toad.
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03-22-2017, 10:22 AM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Chicago Metro
Posts: 3,949
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joes2901
You should ask when the alignment equipment was last calibrated and ask for a 4 wheel alignment with weights at the end of each axle. You want before and after print outs of the alignment so you can see what they did for your money.
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OP here...a bad alignment was my first thought although I did wonder if the steering stabilizer had a role. I am going to have the alignment done post tire purchase. the tire dealers I've spoken with say they can do the job but i'm wondering if I should seek out a shop that specializes in alignments. comments on that? this is our third MH since 1986 and I've never experienced a problem like this and certainly have never heard of or been advised by the dealer or anyone else to have the coach aligned post purchase and after it's been outfitted for a trip. for my 4-wheel vehicles I usually have the front end re-aligned when I purchase new tires which isn't that often. same rule-of-thumb for the coach or does/should the alignment be checked more often? how often? what are some of you doing?
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Rich, Ham Radio, Sport Pilot
Retired 9-1-1 Admin.
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03-22-2017, 10:32 AM
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#7
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Senior Member
Country Coach Owners Club Solo Rvers Club iRV2 No Limits Club
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Vancouver, WA
Posts: 37,725
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OP: The alignment is set at the chassis factory with no load on it, then the RV manufacturer adds the "house" and you fill it with your stuff and fill the tanks. There is no way for the chassis manufacturer to know how it will affect the alignment unlike a car which is pretty close to it's weight as you use it.
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2009 45' Magna 630 w/Cummins ISX 650 HP/1950 Lbs Ft, HWH Active Air
Charter Good Sam Lifetime Member, FMCA,
RV'ing since 1957, NRA Benefactor Life, towing '21 Jeep JLU Rubicon Ecodiesel
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03-22-2017, 11:02 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Chicago Metro
Posts: 3,949
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_D
OP: The alignment is set at the chassis factory with no load on it, then the RV manufacturer adds the "house" and you fill it with your stuff and fill the tanks. There is no way for the chassis manufacturer to know how it will affect the alignment unlike a car which is pretty close to it's weight as you use it.
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well, that makes sense and while it's ultimately my responsibility it sure seems like that should be something the delivering dealer or certainly the mfg should caution new owners about.
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Rich, Ham Radio, Sport Pilot
Retired 9-1-1 Admin.
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03-22-2017, 12:21 PM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Pensacola FL
Posts: 1,451
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rk911
I suspect if you look at the literature that came with your coach you'll find a recommendation to have the alignment checked. As a matter of fact I just looked it's on page 1-2 of the 2016 Suncruiser owners manual.
FWIW
During a Fleetwood factory tour I was told that all coaches are put on the alignment rack after they are assembled. I can't vouch for other manufacturers.
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Brenda & AL
2017 Thor Venetian, T42 "Groot"
2020 Chevy Sonic, 2019 KTM 790 Duke
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03-22-2017, 04:28 PM
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#10
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Senior Member
Winnebago Owners Club
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,636
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In the operators manual that Winnebago provides they clear state that once you have you're coach loaded for travel to have the front end aligned. The reasons are as stated above.
__________________
2012 Journey 40U (Our Incredible Journey)
2008 Dodge Dakota(TOAD) 2005 Honda Shadow in TOAD
AF-1 braking system
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03-23-2017, 09:52 AM
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#11
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Senior Member
Tiffin Owners Club Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Town of Beloit
Posts: 363
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confused
the tires are worn to the cords in 11k? Not a tire problem . Sounds like excessive toe in. the caster and camber angles on a solid axle are preset at factory and should not change unless something bends ? Toe in is the only adjustment and Ford presets the toe in once the chassis is completed . the coach builder should recheck and adjust toe in once complete, but because the axle is solid and toe in does not change with ride height if properly set at factory should not change unless something bent or loose . You can check your toe in with a tape measure , just curious what it is ?
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2016 Tiffin 34PA, 2018 Ford Edge toad, Blue OX rear track bar, Cheap handling fix, Konis, Super Steer retired Ford tech/service manager, No Worry, No Hurry. "Livin The Dream"
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03-23-2017, 01:13 PM
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#12
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Member
National RV Owners Club Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_D
OP: The alignment is set at the chassis factory with no load on it, then the RV manufacturer adds the "house" and you fill it with your stuff and fill the tanks. There is no way for the chassis manufacturer to know how it will affect the alignment unlike a car which is pretty close to it's weight as you use it.
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and I would go the extra mile, buy / borrow water softener salt and set in pass and drivers seats while on the alignment rack to get as close as possible to weight/load on front axle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JIMBO34PA
Sounds like excessive toe in. the caster and camber angles on a solid axle are preset at factory and should not change unless something bends ? Toe in is the only adjustment and Ford presets the toe in once the chassis is completed . the coach builder should recheck and adjust toe in once complete, but because the axle is solid and toe in does not change with ride height if properly set at factory should not change unless something bent or loose . You can check your toe in with a tape measure , just curious what it is ?
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Good point, on Toe in, have it checked, straight axles have little adjustments, unless the king pin bushing or pin are worn and in your case I highly double doubt it.
Tire loyalty is a strange case, my father worked for Uniroyal tire since Dominion tire days, He once stated that the asphalt is different in Europe vs NA, hence different compounds. That statement was in the mid 70's when he told me, unclear today if it is still true, never been to Europe since they don't have a bridge to cross with the RV.
The Dominion Tire Plant, later known as the Uniroyal Tire Plant then the Uniroyal-Goodrich Tire Plant and today known as AirBoss Rubber Compounding is a rubber and tire company located on Glasgow Street in Kitchener, Ontario. It is the largest independent rubber mixing plant in North America.
Regards, Marv
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03-23-2017, 02:14 PM
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#13
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Community Administrator
Fleetwood Owners Club Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Marquette, Michigan "Da UP" & Lehigh Acres Florida
Posts: 21,822
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Do you have any pictures you can post? I have to blame alignment problems from your description as well.
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John & Cathy R.
06 Pace Arrow 38L Workhorse W24
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03-24-2017, 10:07 AM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 710
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For the record: caster can be adjusted. You do it by placing wedge shaped shims between the spring and the axle. It requires loosening the u-bolts and raising the chassis off the axle.
OTOH, camber is not adjustable, even if the alignment shop tells you that they can bend the axle. Bending the axle voids the warranty on every axle I've ever seen.
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