Community Forums

sbirring · 08-20-2016, 03:50 PM

Afternoon all,

I just had our 2005 Monaco Monarch on a 2004 f53 chassis with the 5 star tune installed emission tested last week here in Ontario, Canada. They did both the obd2 check and the sniffer probe in tail pipe test and she passed with flying colors. I didn't even think of removing the tune. All good here in the great white north.

Sonny

Dave-Oh · 08-21-2016, 08:25 PM

I had a 1973 Mustang with a 302 V8 - it had to go to have an emissions test when I registered it to be able to drive it to my govt job in the early 2000's.

I had the engine rebuilt, new intake manifold and carb that removed all the vacuum retarding hoses and mechanisms which were part of the emissions requirements for 1973. I also had had headers, electronic ignition and dual exhaust installed.

With the removal of every emissions control device I could get off of that car, it passed the emissions standards for 1973 - and even the current ones - without problems.

5-star wants you to remove the tune when you take it in to Ford for work because if they refresh the CPU, the 5 star tune will be "locked out". Will it effect emissions? Maybe, but it may not effect them adversely.

I have the tune on my 2016, 6 speed Tiffin Allegro 32 SA. the improvements in shifting behavior alone are worth it. That said....to each his own.

computerguy · 08-22-2016, 09:40 AM

Tejay,
Just a quick comment on supply and demand (and a really really simplified one). I have an accounting degree not an economics degree. Many times it is not all profit when the consumers price goes up.
Given your osb example. Let's say the factory is running at capacity at a certain price to produce the osb. Well, the store selling the stuff says I need more. The factory needs to run an extra hour or two per day. That means instead of paying employees $10/hour it now has to pay overtime to produce the same items. OT is going to be $15/hour. Now, the trucks delivering the stuff are full too. Another truck needs to deliver the additional demand. You get the idea. So in that very simple example the price has to go up.
Economics (supply and demand) is a complex thing (at least for me) to try and learn, understand, predict, etc.

powderman · 08-22-2016, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazeee1

Nothing good ever comes from Cali politicians or the epa.

You really should go take a look at photos of L.A. back in the 60's and 70's before making a statement like that.

vsheetz · 08-22-2016, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by powderman

You really should go take a look at photos of L.A. back in the 60's and 70's before making a statement like that.

Agree. Huge improvement then to now.

vsheetz · 08-22-2016, 10:15 AM

As to removing the Five Star tune. I had one on our 2002 Pace Arrow with Ford v10. Never saw a recommendation to remove. Passed CA smog multiple times without issue.

RELHUB · 08-22-2016, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TeJay

Well if you live in a state that has emission checks then it's best to remove it. Will it fail the test??? Maybe so why take the chance. Do as recommended and remove the tune.

Some may retort that we should not be using something that may fail the emissions test. CA has much more stringent emissions than the rest of the country. CA also has some of the highest fuel prices.

Most folks are not schooled enough to consider these facts. If I get 6.5 MPG on my MH without the TUNE but get 6.9 or 7.0 MPG with the TUNE then I'm burning less fuel and therefore polluting less to go the same distance.

If the FEDS were really concerned about pollution then why are they not pushing for some hydrogen engines???? Why are they not pushing for Natural gas powered engines??? Simple answer is it's the oil $$$$$ in their pockets.

TeJay

I agree 100%
It is always about the Money and
how to remove it from our pockets...
No real concern about our safety
or the environment

TeJay · 08-22-2016, 03:33 PM

Thanks for all the comments. On the CA emissions I agree also 100%. There are a lot of vehicles out there and they need to keep the smog down. One of the absolute best things to come from some of the early CA emissions standards was the addition of the PCV system. That system did absolute wonders for emissions and for keeping the engine clean.

I have received several reports of vehicles passing the emissions tests with the TUNE installed. Good news.

We do need some government intervention. If the government had not made the auto industry increase the fuel mileage while reducing emissions where would we be today??? I promise you the auto industry would not have done anything on their own.
I lived in Detroit from 1972 until 1982 this$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ is their ONLY motive. We can still see that. Ford won't add what most of us think is the obvious to the F-53 MH chassis. How about an air ride option??? How about a rear TB??? They installed a front TB in early 2000. In 2012 they installed poly bushings instead of soybean oil bushings. They can do things but won't because they don't have to.

TeJay

Crazeee1 · 08-23-2016, 07:03 AM

I do not have a problem with some regulations to help with pollution, but they have really gotten out of hand when co2 is now considered a pollutant. Yes, I remember the days of smog filled cities. Many times, it has been proven that an engine can perform and run much cleaner without alot of the mandated smog crap, and get better mileage. I am originally from California, left and never looked back. Now it looks like the diesel pushers are going to be saddled with a 10-15k increase in price due to new regs for heavy vehicles. Lovely.

jrpend · 08-23-2016, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike and Cha

. If it is more efficient that certainly would not be an issue with either California EPA Standards, or Federal Standards when originally being built, ..

Unfortunately California air regulations often run counter to economy and performance. In the early days there was smog gear you could get that worked, IIRC, by limiting ignition advance. You'd install it, get your car inspected and then de-install it. A number of high school entrepreneurs had quite a racket doing that. There was also a very popular book that was allegedly banned by CARB (not sure how they could do that legally) that demonstrated how to disconnect and dummy up smog gear.

But if you got caught, they *might* let you tow it out of state never to return.

On the other hand, you can breath in L.A. now. That was not always true.

vettenuts · 08-24-2016, 05:43 PM

How do they test? Do they use a sniffer or only check for codes through the OBD 2 connection? If it's an OBD 2 check, to my knowledge they have no way to determine the tune is not factory and unless you have codes set it should pass. A visual inspection might pick up a hardware change but not a tune change in the stock ECM.

rk911 · 08-24-2016, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vettenuts

How do they test? Do they use a sniffer or only check for codes through the OBD 2 connection? If it's an OBD 2 check, to my knowledge they have no way to determine the tune is not factory and unless you have codes set it should pass. A visual inspection might pick up a hardware change but not a tune change in the stock ECM.

when I would take our previous MH (2000 Ford F53 chassis) for it's emissions test here in Illinois all they did was stick a sniffer into the tailpipe (there was an OBD2 port under the dash but you had to be a contortionist to get to it). I always passed.

funny story about that. one time the tester stuck the sniffer into the genny exhaust pipe instead of the engine exhaust. he had me start the MH engine and ran his test. a few minutes later when the test was complete he handed my PASS documentation to me with a big grin on his face and complimented me on having the cleanest engine he had ever tested.

I thanked him and drove off.

TomBr · 08-24-2016, 06:37 PM

I have to ask Tejay what he thinks is the value of anything? What you paid for something or what someone else will pay you for it? If you find a diamond at the Arkansas diamond park does it have zero value because you found it? Or is it worth what someone will pay for it? Just about everything is priced at the level that enough people will pay to sell it all. Would you sell at half that price just because you didn't have to pay that much to buy it? Do you see any reason any store should sell cheaper unless not enough buyers show up at current price levels? That isn't greed, it is each person or business selling at the value people place on the item

TomBr · 08-24-2016, 06:41 PM

And of course companies don't waste stockholder (you and me) money making things better unless people ask for it. If you get paid for 8 hours would you work for 10 because you could make the product a bit better by doing so? Any business I put my life savings into better not make things more costly unless the buyers require it and are willing to pay for.