What kind of Bike do I want?

[Jake21]

Originally Posted by Grand Tour

Well, you have now:



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electr...ements_for_use

Thanks for the Wiki link. Good info. But your “many states outlaw” looks more like one (NY) according to the link. And NY has reversed the law to allow electric bikes on the streets as long as they stay under 20mph. So looks like they are allowed in all states.

[Grand Tour]

Originally Posted by Jake21

Thanks for the Wiki link. Good info. But your “many states outlaw” looks more like one (NY) according to the link. And NY has reversed the law to allow electric bikes on the streets as long as they stay under 20mph. So looks like they are allowed in all states.

You gotta look a little deeper. Here is a more detailed link, but you need to search each state individually, which takes a little bit more time:

Policies + Laws • PeopleForBikes

You'll find stuff like this:

In Alabama, an e-bike is defined as a “motor-driven cycle.” As a motor-driven cycle, e-bikes are not subject to the same rules of the road as traditional bicycles.

E-bike riders must carry an operator’s license and are subject to registration requirements. E-bikes are not subject to insurance requirements. However, Alabama's Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying registration and licensing. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in Alabama is illegal.

Helmets are required and there is a 14 year age minimum for e-bike use.*E-bikes are not allowed on sidewalks and bike paths.

In Hawaii, an e-bike is defined as a “moped.” As mopeds, e-bikes are not subject to the same rules of the road as regular bicycles.

Helmets are required for operators under 18 years of age. There is a 15 year age minimum for e-bike use. E-bikes are not allowed on sidewalks. Consult your local government for information on whether e-bikes and mopeds are permitted on bike paths.

E-bike riders must carry an operator’s license and are subject to registration requirements. E-bikes are not subject to insurance requirements. However, Hawaii's Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying registration and licensing. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in Hawaii is illegal.

In Indiana, an e-bike is defined as a “class b motor driven cycle.” As a “motor driven cycle,” e-bikes are subject to the same rules of the road as regular bicycles.

E-bikes are subject to licensing and registration requirements. E-bikes are not subject to insurance requirements. However, Indiana's Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying licensing and registration. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in Indiana is illegal.

Helmets are required for operators under 18 years of age and there is a 15 year age minimum for e-bike use. E-bikes are not allowed on sidewalks. Consult your local government for information on whether e-bikes are permitted on bike paths.

In Louisiana, an e-bike is defined as a “motorized bicycle” so long as its maximum speed is 25mph. As motorized bicycles, e-bikes are not subject to the same rules of the road as regular bicycles.

As operators of motorized bicycles, e-bike riders must carry an operator’s license and are subject to registration requirements. E-bikes are not subject to insurance requirements. However, Louisiana Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying licensing and registration. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in Louisiana is illegal.

Helmets are required during operation, and there is a 15 year age minimum for e-bike use. E-bikes are not allowed on sidewalks. Consult your local government for information on whether e-bikes are permitted on bike paths.

In Maine, an e-bike is defined as a “motorized bicycle” so long as its maximum speed is 25mph. As motorized bicycles, e-bikes are not subject to the same rules of the road as regular bicycles.

E-bike riders must carry an operator’s license and are subject to registration requirements. E-bikes are not subject to insurance requirements. However, Maine's Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these
requirements and has no system for supplying licensing and registration. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in Maine is illegal.

Helmets are required for riders under 16 years of age, and there is a 16 year age minimum for e-bike operation. E-bikes are allowed on sidewalks. Consult your local government for information on whether e-bikes and mopeds are permitted on bike paths.

E-bikes are defined as “motorized bicycles,” and are subject to the registration, licensing, and insurance requirements that apply to motor vehicles. However, New Jersey’s Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying registration and licensing. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in New Jersey is illegal.

Motorized bicycles are defined as vehicles with a power output no greater than 1,119w, maximum speed of 25mph, and without fully operable pedals.

Helmets are required for motorized bicycle use and the age minimum for motorized bicycles use is 15 years. Motorized bicycles are not allowed on bike paths or sidewalks. However, these restrictions are inapplicable to electric bicycles, since they fall outside of New Jersey’s definition of a motorized bicycle.

E-bikes are defined as a “mopeds,” and are subject to the licensing and insurance requirements that apply to motor vehicles. However, New Mexico’s Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying licensing. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in New Mexico is illegal.

The maximum power output of mopeds under this definition is defined in CCs, which is inapplicable to electric bicycles. The helmet age minimum and access restrictions that apply to mopeds are also inapplicable to electric bicycles.

E-bikes are classified as "motor driven bicycles" and are subject to the registration, licensing and insurance requirements that apply to motor vehicles. However, New York's Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying registration and licensing. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in New York State is illegal.

In New York City, the law is interpreted to imply that pedal-assist e-bikes are legal to ride but throttle-actuated e-bikes are not legal to ride.

E-bikes are defined as a “motorized bicycles,” and are subject to the registration, licensing, and insurance requirements that apply to motor vehicles. However, North Dakota’s Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying registration and licensing. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in North Dakota is illegal.

The maximum power output of motorized bicycles under this definition is defined in CCs, which is inapplicable to electric bicycles. The helmet, age minimum and access restrictions that apply to motorized bicycles are also inapplicable to electric bicycles.

E-bikes are defined as a “motorized bicycles,” and are subject to the registration, licensing, and insurance requirements that apply to motor vehicles. However, Ohio’s Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying registration and licensing. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in Ohio is illegal.

Motorized bicycles are defined as vehicles with a power output no greater than 745w, a maximum speed of 20mph, and with fully operable pedals.

Helmets are not required for those over 14 years, and the age minimum for motorized bicycle use in general is 14 years. Motorized bicycles are not allowed on sidewalks and it is unclear whether they are allowed on bike paths. However, these restrictions are inapplicable to electric bicycles, since they fall outside of Ohio’s definition of a motorized bicycle.

E-bikes are defined as “electric-assisted bicycles,” and are subject to the licensing and insurance requirements that apply to motor vehicles. However, Oklahoma’s Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying licensing. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in Oklahoma is illegal.

Electric assisted bicycles are defined as vehicles with a power output no greater than 1,000w, a maximum speed of 30mph and fully operable pedals.

Helmets are not required and there is no age minimum for electric-assisted bicycle use. Electric-assisted bicycles are allowed on sidewalks and bike paths. However, these restrictions are inapplicable to electric bicycles, since they fall outside of Oklahoma’s definition of an electric-assisted bicycle.

E-bikes are defined as “electric motorized bicycles,” and are subject to the licensing and insurance requirements that apply to motor vehicles. However, Rhode Island’s Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying licensing. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in Rhode Island is illegal.

Electric motorized bicycles are defined as vehicles with a power output no greater than 1,491w, a maximum speed of 25mph and fully operable pedals.

Helmets are not required for those over 16 years, and the age minimum for electric motorized bicycle use in general is 16 years. Motorized bicycles are allowed on sidewalks and bike paths. However, these restrictions are inapplicable to electric bicycles since they fall outside of Rhode Island’s definition of an electric motorized bicycle.

E-bikes are defined as “mopeds” and are subject to the licensing and insurance requirements that apply to motor vehicles. However, South Carolina’s Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying licensing. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in South Carolina is illegal.

Mopeds are defined as vehicles with a power output no greater than 1,491w, a maximum speed of 30mph, without fully operable pedals.

Helmets are not required for those over 14 years, and the age minimum for moped use in general is 14 years. Mopeds are not allowed on sidewalks and their use on bike paths is unclear. However, these restrictions are inapplicable to electric bicycles, since they fall outside of South Carolina’s definition of a moped.

E-bikes are defined as “mopeds” and are subject to the licensing and insurance requirements that apply to motor vehicles. However, South Dakota’s Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying licensing. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in South Dakota is illegal.

The maximum power output of mopeds under this definition is defined in CCs, which is inapplicable to electric bicycles. The helmet, age minimum, and access restrictions that apply to mopeds is also inapplicable to electric bicycles.

E-bikes are defined as “mopeds” and are subject to the registration, licensing, and insurance requirements that apply to motor vehicles. However, West Virginia Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying registration and licensing. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in West Virginia is illegal.

Mopeds are defined as vehicles with a power output no greater than 1,491w, a maximum speed of 30mph, with operable pedals.

Helmets are required and the age minimum for moped use in general is 15 years. Mopeds are not allowed on sidewalks and their use on bike paths is unclear. However, these restrictions are inapplicable to electric bicycles since they fall outside of West Virginia’s definition of a moped.

...and many of the remaining states only allow electric bicycles below a certain wattage, on public roads. So if the state law says 500 watts, and your electric bicycle is 501 watts, then it's now a motorcycle, and since motorcycles are required to have DOT legal tires, turn signals, high/low beam headlights, horns, rear view mirror(s), license plates, tail lights, brake lights, odometer, speedometer, high beam indicator, MOTORCYCLE driver's license, mufflers, motorcycle insurance, and so on, it's never going to be legal.

Likewise many states require drivers licenses to operate electric bicycles on public roads. Some states require MOTORCYCLE drivers licenses to operate electric bicycles on public roads. Some states require insurance on electric bicycles.

[Vanslam]

Check the Brompton it is the standard for folding bikes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNPXl2QQNCk

[Yosemite77]

Originally Posted by Grand Tour

Read the link I posted.



Many states require a driver's license to operate electric bicycles on public roads. Numerous states require motorcycle licenses to operate electric bicycles on public roads. Some states also require insurance to operate electric bicycles on public roads. And in some states, they are flat-out illegal to operate on public roads, under any circumstances...

Using your logic, this would also mean that cars are illegal to use in many states, since they require a license to operate as well.

I looked the link you provided and would like some clarification. Here’s your quote from before:
“Electric "bicycles" are illegal to use on public roads in many states.”
I would appreciate it if you would list all these “many states” that do not allow any use of e-bikes on their roads?

[Grand Tour]

Originally Posted by Yosemite77

Using your logic, this would also mean that cars are illegal to use in many states, since they require a license to operate as well.

No. Electric bicycles are illegal to use on public roadways in many states, whether you have a license or not.

In the remaining states, many of them require a driver's license to operate an electric bicycle on public roads. Some require a MOTORCYCLE driver's license to operate an electric bicycle on public roads. Some states even require insurance (on top of every other legal requirement) to operate electric bicycles on public roads.

And many states have restrictions regarding the wattage, horsepower, and top speed of electric bicycles- if you fall outside of those restrictions, then it is a motorcycle, and would require everything that a motorcycle requires to legally operate it on public roads, which is never gonna happen.

I looked the link you provided and would like some clarification. Here’s your quote from before:
“Electric 'bicycles' are illegal to use on public roads in many states.”
I would appreciate it if you would list all these “many states” that do not allow any use of e-bikes on their roads?

I did. Two posts above your post. About an hour before you posted it.

Electric bicycles are illegal to operate on public roads in Alabama, Hawaii, Indiana, Louisiana, Maine, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma Rhode Island, South Carolina, South Dakota, and West Virginia.

And in the remaining states, you still have to comply with the wattage/horsepower/top speed/road equipment/driver licensing/insurance restrictions within each of those individual states.

[babock]

E-bikes are often not allowed in National Parks...even on roads. I was in Zion and they weren't allowed. All of the National Forest areas in my area where I ride a MTB, they are outlawed on trails.

[Grand Tour]

Whenever the subject of electric bicycles come up, there seems to be a lot of people that confuse what they "want", with what is actually legal or not.

But this is important stuff. Consider the following scenarios. This is stuff I've actually seen:

You're out on your electric bicycle in a state that requires a motorcycle license to use an electric bicycle on a public road. You get pulled over by the police, and present your car driver's license. You then go to jail for driving without a valid license, because your car license isn't a motorcycle license.

You're out on your electric bicycle in a state that requires a driver's license to operate an electric bicycle on a public road. You get pulled over by the police, but you forgot your wallet back in your motorhome. You then go to jail for failure to present a license.

You're out on your electric bicycle in a state that requires a driver's license to operate an electric bicycle on a public road. You get pulled over by the police, and present your driver's license, but the officer notices that the wattage of your electric bicycle is over the state limit and/or he paced you over the legal top speed for an electric bicycle. This renders it a motorcycle, and you then go to jail for driving without a valid motorcycle license.

You're out on your electric bicycle, in a state that requires insurance to operate an electric bicycle on a public road, thousands of miles from your home. You get pulled over by the police, and upon failing to produce proof of insurance, your electric bicycle is impounded and you are issued a criminal summons to appear on the charge of no insurance, a month from now...thousands of miles from your home. And if you fail to appear, a bench warrant will be issued for your arrest.

You're out on your electric bicycle in the campground. You're not even going out on public roads, because although you feel fine, you did have a couple of glasses of Chianti with your wife over a nice dinner. You're carefully riding up to the campground office, when a child darts out in front of you and collides with you. Both of you fall down, sustaining minor abrasions. The police are summoned to the scene. The responding officer observes your indicia of impairment, and you are arrested on felony charges relating to injuring someone while operating a motorized vehicle under the influence, which is enforceable even on private property.

There are countless unexpected ways that things can go terribly wrong, if you choose to stick your head in the sand and ignore the applicable laws.

[Grand Tour]

Originally Posted by babock

E-bikes are often not allowed in National Parks...even on roads. I was in Zion and they weren't allowed. All of the National Forest areas in my area where I ride a MTB, they are outlawed on trails.

Yes. I was mostly speaking of public roadways, but beyond that, there are countless other places where electric bicycles are not allowed.

But a lot of places continue to tell people whatever they want to hear, just to make a sale, completely omitting the fact that it may only be legal for them to operate it on their own private property, and even then, there are additional restrictions.

[Jake21]

Grand Tour, you have an agenda regarding ebikes. Not sure what it is. Your earlier post said many states outlaw ebikes, then i replied. to my reply stated Indiana as outlawing ebikes, NOT.

https://www.evelo.com/indiana-state-...ws-definition/

Again, not sure what your agenda is except to stir conversation, which I actually like for the point of useful conversation. I do not have a ebike, i pedal 14 hours per week, but i do see a useful need for them but not for me. But I tend to challenge false internet info.

[Jake21]

A lot of places? You go to a lot of bike shops that sell ebikes and ask them about the usability of the bikes, that you will not own or buy or ride, and the local law regarding their usage? IMO, you have way too much free time. Oh yeah, and the agenda.

[Grand Tour]

Originally Posted by Jake21

Grand Tour, you have an agenda regarding ebikes. Not sure what it is. Your earlier post said many states outlaw ebikes, then i replied. to my reply stated Indiana as outlawing ebikes, NOT.

https://www.evelo.com/indiana-state-...ws-definition/

Again, not sure what your agenda is except to stir conversation, which I actually like for the point of useful conversation. I do not have a ebike, i pedal 14 hours per week, but i do see a useful need for them but not for me. But I tend to challenge false internet info.

Not sure what your agenda is except to stir conversation, which I actually like for the point of useful conversation. I do not have an electric bicycle, but I tend to challenge false internet info.

https://peopleforbikes.org/wp-conten...compressed.pdf

In Indiana, an e-bike is defined as a “class b motor driven cycle.” As a “motor driven cycle,” e-bikes are subject to the same rules of the road as regular bicycles.

E-bikes are subject to licensing and registration requirements. E-bikes are not subject to insurance requirements. However, Indiana's Department of Motor Vehicles does not recognize e-bikes as vehicles with these requirements and has no system for supplying licensing and registration. Therefore, riding an electric bicycle in Indiana is illegal.

I would encourage you not to compromise your personal integrity by being anything less than completely truthful- I never said "many states outlaw ebikes", as you claim.

I said that electric bicycles are not legal to use on public roadways in many states, which is absolutely true.

I then cited the specific states that they are not legal in, with quotes and a link to the information that I accessed.

[Yosemite77]

Originally Posted by Grand Tour

...Electric bicycles are illegal to operate on public roads in Alabama, Hawaii, Indiana, Louisiana, Maine, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma Rhode Island, South Carolina, South Dakota, and West Virginia...

I looked up Alabama’s law on e-bikes. E-bikes are not illegal to use there. They are considered in the same class as motorcycles. As long as you have the proper license, you are allowed to use an e-bike there. Or are you claiming that motorcycles can’t be used on roads in Alabama as well?
As far as I know, New York is the only state that has ever banned them in the past. I’m not going to bother looking up other states, [moderator edit].

[Jake21]

Originally Posted by Yosemite77

I looked up Alabama’s law on e-bikes. E-bikes are not illegal to use there. They are considered in the same class as motorcycles. As long as you have the proper license, you are allowed to use an e-bike there. Or are you claiming that motorcycles can’t be used on roads in Alabama as well?
As far as I know, New York is the only state that has ever banned them in the past. I’m not going to bother looking up other states, [moderator edit].

X 2.

[stepside454]

Not that I’m saying s person should break the law , but go to jail for not having proper license?
Good grief