500 ISM won't start

[racer0624]

Thought I'd throw these 2 problems out hoping someone has run into them....1- Several times the engine will turn over but not start. Releasing the ign. key(but not turning it off) and trying again, usually 2-4 times and it'll start. I don't think it's the fuel solenoid valve as I never turn the ign. key to the full off position.
Problem 2- The engine won't even turn over. With the key turned on, all the dash lights and gages light up but turn the key nothing happens. Voltage is good, battery terminals are tight, connections on starter are tight. Two times ago, road service hooked jumper cables directly to the starter and it started. The other day I tapped on the starter terminals and it started.
Spartan doesn't want to start throwing parts and pieces at the problem and would like a mechanic to trouble shoot the issue on the phone with their techs. when it happens again. So far it hasn't been convienent to do so.
Sorry for the long post. Any thoughts???

[Pat Z]

Quote:

Originally Posted by racer0624 Thought I'd throw these 2 problems out hoping someone has run into them....1- Several times the engine will turn over but not start. Releasing the ign. key(but not turning it off) and trying again, usually 2-4 times and it'll start. I don't think it's the fuel solenoid valve as I never turn the ign. key to the full off position. Problem 2- The engine won't even turn over. With the key turned on, all the dash lights and gages light up but turn the key nothing happens. Voltage is good, battery terminals are tight, connections on starter are tight. Two times ago, road service hooked jumper cables directly to the starter and it started. The other day I tapped on the starter terminals and it started. Spartan doesn't want to start throwing parts and pieces at the problem and would like a mechanic to trouble shoot the issue on the phone with their techs. when it happens again. So far it hasn't been convienent to do so. Sorry for the long post. Any thoughts???

I had the exact same issue with my caoch. I was intermittent but a real pain. Finnally the service center kept it for 2 weeks trying to get the problem to surface. It turned out to be a bad starter solonoid, there is one on the starter and one on the frame. The one on the frame was the problem.
Good Luck!

[Chickadee]

Yup! Experienced same thing w. our 4502, 08 EXDP. Long story short....starter solenoid was the culprit. Following a number of VERY inconvenient "no start" episodes, finally had Cummins/Spartan shop in Sioux Falls trouble shoot it, and had solenoid replaced....along with new starter since, evidently, if this has been happening, it is BEST to change out the starter ALSO as the original starter could have been damaged. Warranty covered it all....no problem since!! Steve

[a k]

If it's still under warranty, let them throw parts at it. Sounds like a fuel or glow plug problem. Turns over but don't start. Does it blow black smoke after it finally starts?

[EngineerMike]

Have the tech do a voltage drop test on the two solenoids (could be either one of them). Probably bad contacts in the solenoid since all else on the coach is working electrically.

Just put the volt meter probes on each large terminal of the solenoid and meter reads the difference, or connect black to chassis ground and record both terminal readings so you can see the loss. If you have >0.2 volts difference, that solenoid is bad and getting worse. You have to run the starter several times for each solenoid to make sure, as the solenoid frequently has arcing debris inside which may only intermittently get caught between the contacts. If the volt drop is irregular, this is the cause. I'm surprised Spartan didn't direct this type of testing right off the bat, and likewise that your tech didn't go right to solenoid tests (should take no more than 30 min. for both solenoids). Makes me wonder if maybe there isn't a better place for service next time.

[racer0624]

Thanks for the replies, especially Chickadee. Sounds like I know where to look now. It's interesting to hear Spartan say that my problem is isolated and hear Chickadee say it's a known problem. How many times has that happened to us RV'er's?

Chickadee, How did they troubleshoot if it wasn't happening when they had your coach?

[Chickadee]

John:

Final straw was another "no start" episode just South of Mitchell, South Dakota following a lunch stop. Wouldn't start!! Got a tech down from Mitchell who was familiar w. Spartan/Cummins, who immediately (ie. first thing), checked solenoid just as Engineer Mike described above, and sure enough.....solenoid!! He jumped the solenoid, got rig started, and we proceeded immediately to take it to Cummins/Spartan Service Center in Souix Falls. I described to Sioux Falls Mgr. what had been happening and how the Mitchell diesel tech tested and jumped the solenoid. Sioux Falls techs rechecked system (connections, grounds, starter, and..solenoid issue) and also came up with "erratic solenoid functioning," so...new solenoid, new starter, and not a glitch since!!

Don't know if it was the skillful knowledge of the technicians that did the trick....or....the donuts and sweet rolls I bought for the shop crew, BUT...whatever....haven't had a "no start" issue since this fix and that was in June of 08!! Steve