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Old 01-22-2012, 08:38 PM   #85
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Smile

Don't know anything 'solid', but if you are living in your motorhome,
it is considered 'off limits' without a search warrant...In same token,
if you have a firearm, it needs to be 'out of reach of passengers and
driver'. My Arizona Fire Arms dealer recommends buying a marine
signal pistol, legal everywhere. (might not want to carry it concealed)
Otherwise, a single barrel 20 gauge repeating shot gun, first shell to
be BBs, next Slug, third BBs Etc. I would suggest we all belong to
National Rifle Association. (above, when living in you RV, it is your home.)
gene:
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Old 01-22-2012, 10:53 PM   #86
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Does not apply in WA state as I previously stated. No probable cause required to search a motor vehicle during a traffic stop. It's been through the State Supreme Court, but no one (so far) has taken it to SCOTUS.

You keep repeating yourself over and over however your answer is incomplete and could be very misleading. While states are allowed to be MORE restrictive than federal law, they are not allowed to be LESS restrictive than federal law.

The SCOTUS has ruled on the issue of searching motor vehicles and thus state courts must adhere to those standards at a minimum.

To say that a law enforcement officer may search your car in WA state without probable cause is very misleading.

SCOTUS has ruled: If an officer can articulate some action on your part that gives him a REASONABLE basis that you may be armed, he may search the immediate, accessible area around you for weapons. Both the scope of the search and the area of the search are for a very limited purpose and can only be used when the officer has a reasonable basis for doing so.

To widen the scope and area of the search, there must be an additional legal basis for doing so, i.e. probable cause, consent, incident to arrest,etc etc.

The supreme court of WA state could NOT have ruled in any way that was inconsistent with those minimum standards unless they were to interpret them in a more restrictive manner (i.e. further limiting or restricting the circumstances and basis needed for such a search than what is allowed under federal law).

So the search allowable in your state absent probable cause is limited to weapons only within reach of the driver (and only then based on a reasonable suspicion that you are armed), unless your state supreme court rules more restrictively than that.
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Old 01-23-2012, 06:30 AM   #87
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All I can say is "wow" . . .

I always wonder why people who have nothing to hide, fight so hard to be uncooperative under the banner of a right to freedom, guarded by the very people who are asking them for cooperation.

But this topic sure is educational.
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Old 01-23-2012, 06:41 AM   #88
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All I can say is "wow" . . .

I always wonder why people who have nothing to hide, fight so hard to be uncooperative under the banner of a right to freedom, guarded by the very people who are asking them for cooperation.

But this topic sure is educational.
As for me if I am not "uncooperative" just because I refuse a request. LEO's have a procedure that they need to follow and I have rights that I need to protect. The refusal allows my rights to be protected and keeps a LEO from being over zealous. At that moment I assume that I am the only one protecting my rights. I keep telling my son that you are the best protector of yourself and your rights.
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Old 01-23-2012, 08:17 AM   #89
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We have never been even stopped in our RV let alone searched but here is my 2 cents.

Even if you have nothing to hide, who wants some stranger rummaging through your stuff, right? So you nicely tell the officer that he does not have permission to search. I will bet 9 out of 10 times the officer will "cop" an attitude (pun intended). Why? Because it makes you look guilty. Should it? No but in his eyes you are hiding something if you refuse.

So how does one win this battle? Stand your ground while he calls for back up then takes 2 hours to run your plates. Any way you chalk this up, you lose.

Oh and how do you think your odds are in court if you were by yourself with no one to verify what you said or did.
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Old 01-23-2012, 08:34 AM   #90
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I respect the law enforcement personnel who do so much to protect us and will cooperate in their effort to ensure that any encounter they may have with me is conducted safely. That does not mean that I will willingly give up my constitutional rights. There are excellent people working in law enforcement, and there are also some that are little more than bullies with a badge. My protection from the bullies is the 4th amendment.
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Old 01-23-2012, 09:02 AM   #91
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Since a search warrant is very specific on what is being searched for, upon request from an officer at a stop, when he asks if he can search the MH can you ask him what he/she is specifically searching for? If he says drugs, and then finds a weapon, what are the consequences?
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Old 01-23-2012, 09:06 AM   #92
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Since a search warrant is very specific on what is being searched for, upon request from an officer at a stop, when he asks if he can search the MH can you ask him what he/she is specifically searching for? If he says drugs, and then finds a weapon, what are the consequences?
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Old 01-23-2012, 10:46 AM   #93
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I guess there are two ways to view law enforcement officers. 1) Someone who may infringe on your rights or harass you. 2) Someone who is there to protect you or offer help. I prefer to view them as the latter.

I have been approached by officers seven times that I can recall. Four times to offer assistance when I was broken down on thr highway. Three times to check out me and my RV.

A long time ago I was crossing Hover Dam. I was stopped at an inspection station and told that a vehicle inspection was required. Me, my wife and the officer laughed and had a great time. I told him there were 10 storage containers under the RV and 2 under the dining table seats. He just exited the RV and said enjoy your trip. The second time I was stopped and asked to step out with my drivers license and registration. I complied and handed them to the officer. He briefly looked at them and gave me a cold hard stare as he asked "Do you have a dead body in your RV?" I started laughing hysterically. I apologized and continued laughing. He continued his cold hard stare, handed back my documents and said "You have a brake light out, fix it when you stop." I still wonder about that one. The third time I was asked to exit. The officer asked if I had been drinking. I replied "No, not at all." Then he asked "Why were you swerving back and forth?" I was sure this was just a reason to stop me. I replied "I don't know, maybe because I'm an old man?" He tried to hide his smile as he replied "You're not that old." I added that I had severely dislocated my right shoulder two months ago and perhaps that was affecting my driving. The officer had also dislocated his shoulder. That led to a discussion about rehab and the worst problem you encounter (You cannot properly wipe your behind.) We both laughed and went our seperate ways.

I always refer to a law enforcement person as "Sir, Maim or Officer". I comply with their request and I expect them to comply with mine if I require help. Perhaps I'm naive, but I believe they are there to serve and protect me.
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Old 01-23-2012, 10:55 AM   #94
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Here in Texas you have to say it correctly. It's "Ma'am" and you hold the "A's for just a tad longer so it comes out "Yes Maaaam"

I have had great success on a couple stops over the years. When I take out my driver's license it is right next to my military ID. That usually starts a conversation - most LEO's are former military and will recognize the ID. So instead of a ticket I got warnings. Works for me.

I have never been asked to search my vehicle(s).
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Old 01-23-2012, 10:59 AM   #95
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"LEO's have a procedure that they need to follow and I have rights that I need to protect. The refusal allows my rights to be protected and keeps a LEO from being over zealous. At that moment I assume that I am the only one protecting my rights. I keep telling my son that
you are the best protector of yourself and your rights."

Iron man you are exactly right. I was on the job for 27 years and have seen lazy officers lose cases simply because they failed to follow procedures. If they ask to search, they certainly ne.ed to have a good reason and tell me what they are searching for. Not that I want to be a hard case, but each time I give up my rights a little bit of freedom goes with it. We have an adjoining county here in N Georgia that is pretty quiet. When things get slow a couple of their officers will get out and work traffic for 'intervention'. They will have no probable cause what so ever, but will ask and the the poor guy they stop is scared to say 'no'. The next thing you know, he is cuffed in the rear of the car (excuse me "patrol vehicle" in my best courtroom voice ) while they take the guys car apart. Sometimes they get lucky and most times they don't.
Make them go through the procedure. Most need the practice of writing a probable cause affidavit anyway and it will help them in the court room when they have to explain to a judge why this warrant should be upheld.
These guys would love to seize a MH for transporting contraband, but the problem is most of them are not paid for and the department would have to pay it off in order to keep it. (Ga law)
We don't even need to get into the scope of the search, but basically if you are looking for a shotgun you can only look in places that could conceivably hold a shotgun, not in a medicine chest or glove box.
So tell them "no".
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Old 01-23-2012, 11:23 AM   #96
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I didn't read all 9 pages but lets be pragmatic about this.

Has anyone EVER been pulled over, and some overzealous cop searched the RV, found a gun, and some dire outcome happened? This fear of The Man strikes me as so much over the top New World Order hand wringing. If you follow the laws on guns, you got nothing to worry about if you were to ever be pulled over.

This discussion reminds me of the 'I don't sleep in rest stops because I heard a friend of a friend once read on a forum that, while traveling through Death Valley in 1971, some kids broke into his RV while they slept and stole the Blender and $35'

Worry about real stuff that can happen. Like $5.50 a gal gas
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Old 01-23-2012, 12:13 PM   #97
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I was searched because I didn't bag my Trout fish right at Bennet Springs park in Mo.
Went through my Norcold looking for illegal fish. Guns on their hips.
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Old 01-23-2012, 02:40 PM   #98
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I was searched because I didn't bag my Trout fish right at Bennet Springs park in Mo.
Went through my Norcold looking for illegal fish. Guns on their hips.
Yea, those "illegal" fish are quite dangerous...

Guns are soooo necessary to protect LEO from those fish!
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