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Old 07-12-2016, 07:15 AM   #1
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Hard starting

Good Morning,

I have a 2001 Winnebago Journey DP that I have noticed recently
is having issues starting. I turn the key to the on position, wait for
the "wait to start" indicator is off, then turn the key to start the
engine and nothing. It acts as though I am trying to start a car
when not in Park. I have to turn the key off and on several times
and then it will start fine. Is there a safety switch on the RV that
could be causing the issue or even the ignition switch starting to
go?

Thanks in advance
Andy
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Old 07-12-2016, 08:23 AM   #2
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Mine started to do that and then all of a sudden nothing, no power to the dash etc.

First thing I checked was my battery cut of switch. Took it off and check continuity across the posts while turning the knob on the rotary switch, nothing not matter how I turned it. Took the 2 leads and bolted them together and the coach started.

The cut off switch I used is a Marinco 2012, I ordered 2 since I have another one for the house side. Replaced the switch and all is good.
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Old 07-12-2016, 08:46 AM   #3
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You also need to check the battery terminals.

When waiting to start, the current is low and it can travel thru the poor, dirty connection. Once you turn to start, the current goes way up and the connection fails. As you keep trying, the connection gets hotter and carries the current.

When it happens, feel the start battery connections. If any are hotter then the others, that's the problem one. Of course clean them all.
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Old 07-12-2016, 04:16 PM   #4
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I just worked on one of these for my 80 yo neighbor... I have several thoughts... on his when it wouldn't start the voltmeter on the dash would stay at zero when the key was turned on.... his btw has the 3126 CAT... looking at the wiring diagram I found a 12vdc red wire and black wire connected at the batteries... 12 gauge wire, where the red goes through a fuse and both go onto a loom... the loom ends at the ECM and this is a the primary power to the ECM.... I'd check these connections, all the battery connections... I also had a cable with a large voltage drop at the connection and had to take care of that...

If you go through all this and you still don't have a no crank condition... and you know the batteries are up... I'd take a hammer... and tap both the starter and solenoid with the HANDLE.. taping the side of the solenoid lightly with that wood handle... if the tap, tap, tap solves the problem I'd replace the related part as needed...

On the wiring diagram is a wire from the (START TERMINAL) switch to the ECM... pin 51 or 52 as I remember.... this is where I'd go next... looking for the start signal (12vdc)...

Hope this helps..
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Old 07-12-2016, 05:10 PM   #5
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Andy,
What Chassis and Transmission do you have?

Pat
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Old 07-13-2016, 09:58 PM   #6
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hard starting

I have a 2003 journey dl with a 3126e help no start new batteries cranks but does not start oil ok fuel full coolant tank full code on shift selector reads "o L--70 anyone have this happen lucky I'm still at the house have 65000miles help!! freight liner chassis with allison transmission
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Old 07-13-2016, 10:20 PM   #7
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For free expert help, call the Freightliner Support Center.

CUSTOMER SUPPORT CENTER
1-800-FTL-HELP (1-800-385-4357)
fcccservice@daimler.com


Have the last 6 digits of your VIN number available when you call.


Fred
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Old 07-14-2016, 12:30 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeydrt View Post
I have a 2003 journey dl with a 3126e help no start new batteries cranks but does not start oil ok fuel full coolant tank full code on shift selector reads "o L--70 anyone have this happen lucky I'm still at the house have 65000miles help!! freight liner chassis with allison transmission
Try shifting it into and out of neutral a few times to see if the fault clears.
On my coach a similar issue turned out to be a bad neutral sense relay, although I don't recall seeing an error code. I would look for that kind of circuit in your coach. That relay has to pick before the starter solenoid will work.
I would also clean the battery contacts where the hot wire to the transmission ECU connects. On ours there is an inline fuse where that wire connects to the battery. The fuse holder itself went bad. That was tough to find because the fuse was fine.

HTH,
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Old 07-14-2016, 09:00 AM   #9
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It sounds like the power solenoid is not closing. When you turn the ignition switch on, it powers up a solenoid that gives power to your dash, etc. This is to keep all the power from going through the switch itself. It is usually a silver solenoid about three inches tall and two inches wide.
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Old 07-15-2016, 09:13 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeydrt View Post
I have a 2003 journey dl with a 3126e help no start new batteries cranks but does not start oil ok fuel full coolant tank full code on shift selector reads "o L--70 anyone have this happen lucky I'm still at the house have 65000miles help!! freight liner chassis with allison transmission
The OL-70 is not really a fault code when the engine is cold. OL-70 means the transmission fluid is too cold. You will get this when the motorhome is first started.
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Old 07-15-2016, 09:24 AM   #11
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The dash gauges are 5 vdc volt meters powered by the engine ECM... the engine ECM sees (reads) the data from the various inputs... as it needs those inputs to control the engine... it also sends water temp, trans temp, voltage, oil pressure, to the dash... The ECM is powered directly from the battery with a separate fuse... the ECM comes to life when it sees a KEY ON command from the switch...

If you turn the key ON and the volt meter, and other dash gauges do not react to the KEY ON command.. no oil pressure when cranking as an example.. you need to research power to the ECM.... If the ECM powers up... than this is an interloc problem from the transmission, OR a fail to crank from a start solenoid, bad connection at the batteries, solenoid, or starter...
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Old 07-15-2016, 10:28 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acrobe1 View Post
Good Morning,

I have a 2001 Winnebago Journey DP that I have noticed recently
is having issues starting. I turn the key to the on position, wait for
the "wait to start" indicator is off, then turn the key to start the
engine and nothing. It acts as though I am trying to start a car
when not in Park. I have to turn the key off and on several times
and then it will start fine. Is there a safety switch on the RV that
could be causing the issue or even the ignition switch starting to
go?

Thanks in advance
Andy
Andy , you haven't replied to the question about chassis brand and engine , have you found your problem?
You have to be aware the start signal power from the ignition switch , does not go directly to the starter solenoid , there is a relay in the system ; I've had to replace the relay twice on my coach. The relay is powered from the ignition switch and grounded by the trans controller when the controller senses the key pad shift is in neutral. Just like the system in your car , that wont crank the engine unless you're in park or neutral.
As others have said , battery connections are the first place to check, then you'll need help , to check the rest of the system; and with an erratic problem this could take a while , you have to be able to get to the starter and see if the starter solenoid wire gets powered up when the key is turned .
If the solenoid wire is powered, when a helper turns the key, and the engine isn't cranking then you have a starter problem, no power then the relay is suspect, find the relay and do the same test , the relay has 4 terminals, 2 large and two small . One large is battery power , second large is the output to the starter. Small terminals, one gets power from the ignition switch , the other is grounded by the trans . Need to do the same test there, with helper turning the key, if you have power from the ignition switch ,and the ground wire should show zero ohms to ground ( trans in neutral) then the relay should pass power to the second large terminal.
Here's a picture of the relay location, it's on the left, located between the batteries and starter on the frame , and a document from Freightliner , for the relay that my chassis uses, with cross reference to other suppliers.
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Old 07-19-2016, 05:40 AM   #13
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Chassis

Good Morning,

Sorry for the late post. I have a Freightliner Chassis and I am not sure
what trans is in it. I had the same problem with starting this past weekend
so this weekend coming up I am going to check the connections on the
batteries and switches. What I noticed when trying to start is a clicking
noise but I cannot tell where it is coming from.

I will have my wife stand near the battery compartment and see if she
can here anything coming from there. If not I will start tracing cables
and see if something shows up.

Thanks everyone for all the suggestions, I really do appreciate it!!!


Andy

I will have to find out what trans is in there......
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Old 07-19-2016, 09:48 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acrobe1 View Post
Good Morning,

Andy

I will have to find out what trans is in there......

If you call the Freightliner's free help line , with your chassis serial number, they will give you all the info; engine serial#, trans serial # , and differential #.

1-800-385-4357

While you on the phone with the help line , inquire about joining "Access Freightliner " takes a while , but you get online access to parts and wiring info for your chassis.
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