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Old 05-15-2015, 10:46 AM   #267
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Originally Posted by jerichorick View Post
Steve, thanks for sharing your experience with such detail and passion. The blowout I had in OK a few years back caused $17K in repairs. I was fortunate in that I didn't have the violent shaking as severe as you did. But I had to drive a hundred yards over a bridge before I could stop. I am so glad that there were no personal injuries for either of us.

After the coach came back to me I had the odometer fail. I believe the shop didn't take the correct precautions for the engine and transmission when setting up to weld. I hope your shop does this. The electronics in these things are expensive and sensitive to welding frequencies.

I do hope you can get back on the road soon. In the mean time, enjoy your time while grounded.

Thanks for the comments about "bad attitudes". I'd hate having this mindset as a neighbor. Their the one's that are always right and feel they have a "right to be wrong". I quit a boss with that attitude. Loud and obnoxious. But I cannot ignore the others who are participating in this discussion in an informed and informing manner. and thanks for the great input.

Happy trails,
Rick Y

In the interest of full disclosure, this is a reprint from a poster back in 2012. I was so impressed by his qualifications and passion about the obviously traumatic event, that I contacted him and ask permission to repost on other forums. He was glad to have me do that. I'm not as vehemently opposed to the Goodyear G670 as many others. It has a propensity for odd wearing characteristics on the steer axle but appears to be ok otherwise.

I pasted this account on because it was so well written.


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Old 05-15-2015, 04:46 PM   #268
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I note that tire failure can be catastrophic and expensive. What I also often see is a jump to the conclusion that the tire was perfectly fine one moment and the next instant "It Blew-out".

Sorry but that does simply not reflect reality. Tires, engines, transmissions and yes even airplanes simply do not fail for no reason. The reason may not be apparent to the driver or aircraft pilot, but that doesn't mean the failure was somehow due to an evil spell or magic.

The problem is that despite the number of tire failures that occur there are almost none that have a complete forensic inspection or accident re-construction completed. The Police want to get the accident scene cleaned up as fast as possible so much of the evidence is simply dumped in the trash or swept into the ditch.

I have 28 posts on my blog that refer to tire failure. Many provide pictures of the physical evidence of the cause or causes for the failure yet in not a single case were any of these causes seen or properly identified by the first responders or vehicle owners. Having been involved in over 20,000 failed tire inspections in my career I have seen many other examples similar to those in the 28 posts so my examples are more likely the norm rather than the exception.

I do understand the feelings of those involved in a tire failure not wanting to take the time or expense to have a competent inspection completed. It is much easier to simply jump to the conclusion that the tire failed because it was made in a tire plant painted blue or by companies that really don't care if they kill their customers.

It is also not rational to claim "I will never buy a brand QXY tire again" as few seem able to understand the difference between Causation and Correlation.

With no slight intended I would ask why anyone flies on Boeing airplanes. After all the vast majority of crashes occur with that maker of aircraft so there must be something wrong with them.
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Old 05-16-2015, 09:07 AM   #269
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"It is also not rational to claim "I will never buy a brand QXY tire again" as few seem able to understand the difference between Causation and Correlation."

This is the only place we disagree, Roger. There are certain product names or designs I simply will not buy because they have developed a bad reputation through numbers of reported problems and personal experience. To get away from tires lets take RV refrigerators. The absorption coil refrigerator, long in history, was a good choice for RVing when your choices were limited to that or an ice box. With the engineering advances in refrigeration the modern residential refrigerator for a RV is a better and doable choice. I don't like German or French cars because of personal experiences. Firestone tires will never be on my list, long or short. They earned my distrust over and again. Enough said.

We have to make choices with the information we have on hand. If the information is defective we make defective choices. Good, solid information should lead to a more valid choice.

Let's take another look at this topic. If a tire company makes X number of tires and has a 3% failure rate, that may be acceptable in the industry. If company 2 makes 2X tires and has a 1% failure rate it stands to reason the failures will not be as advertized just because of the way the #'s are working.

I have many more thought along this line but are not valid in this discussion. The bottom line here is that tires fail for some reason. How old your tires are is just another one of the reasons for failure. Do you think or want to live to be 120 years old? The body, according to science, is built to do just that. So, why is this age not achieved on a regular basis, or ever? Life happenings leads to minor failures that lead to major failures that lead to early death. So, why not apply the same process to man made things, much less complicated than our bodies?

Are you certain you want to continue to cling to your oldest tire bragging rights?

Rick Y
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Old 05-16-2015, 06:06 PM   #270
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Originally Posted by jerichorick View Post
"It is also not rational to claim "I will never buy a brand QXY tire again" as few seem able to understand the difference between Causation and Correlation."

This is the only place we disagree, Roger. There are certain product names or designs I simply will not buy because they have developed a bad reputation through numbers of reported problems and personal experience. To get away from tires lets take RV refrigerators. The absorption coil refrigerator, long in history, was a good choice for RVing when your choices were limited to that or an ice box. With the engineering advances in refrigeration the modern residential refrigerator for a RV is a better and doable choice. I don't like German or French cars because of personal experiences. Firestone tires will never be on my list, long or short. They earned my distrust over and again. Enough said.

We have to make choices with the information we have on hand. If the information is defective we make defective choices. Good, solid information should lead to a more valid choice.

Let's take another look at this topic. If a tire company makes X number of tires and has a 3% failure rate, that may be acceptable in the industry. If company 2 makes 2X tires and has a 1% failure rate it stands to reason the failures will not be as advertized just because of the way the #'s are working.

I have many more thought along this line but are not valid in this discussion. The bottom line here is that tires fail for some reason. How old your tires are is just another one of the reasons for failure. Do you think or want to live to be 120 years old? The body, according to science, is built to do just that. So, why is this age not achieved on a regular basis, or ever? Life happenings leads to minor failures that lead to major failures that lead to early death. So, why not apply the same process to man made things, much less complicated than our bodies?

Are you certain you want to continue to cling to your oldest tire bragging rights?

Rick Y

I understand your position.
My issue with using the "reports" of various RV forums is that almost never do I see evidence provided for the "why" there was a failure.
I am aware of a number of tire failures where the real root cause was a failure of the tire tech to properly install the bolt-in valve so the air leaked out. There isn't a tire available for regular application that can run without air.
How about punctures. Can you identify a brand & design that won't ever have a puncture?
Load. The data from RVSEF who get individual tire loadings shows that over 50% of the RVs they have ever measures (tens of thousands) have one or more tire and/or axle in overload so how do we adjust the reports for the tires being overloaded?
A correlation can only exist if the reports are based on accurate analysis.

RE tire failure rate. Normal passenger failure rated of modern pass tires is below 0.5% ( Sorry I don't have data for LT or truck but doubt the majors tolerate more than a 1%.)

I do have to wonder about all the concern about poor quality on a product where a number of competitors offer 3 to 5 year warranty but we the RV buyers seem to readily accept 12 months on the rest to the RV.

RE Never using xyz brand again. Would that also apply to Ford products because of the Pinto? how about the rust problems and bad durability of Honda, Toyota etc from the 60's? The RV refrig is not a good example as the closest I can get in tires is Bias vs Radial.

If you want to assume that the majority of people posting information about tire failures have had some level of training in forensic analysis that's fine but in my experience not many are able to demonstrate a working knowledge of how tires are made and what evidence to look for in a failed tire.

Following your logic I should never buy a jug of milk from Circle-K dairy because one went bad. Keds shoos are poor quality because I broke a shoe lace. GE makes crappy light bulbs because they burn out. See my point?
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Old 05-17-2015, 09:23 AM   #271
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Roger, you are pushing the curve with your argument against my criticism of that one statement you made. I don't go by forum gossip. My statements are from reports from the news, posted law suits and individuals I know who have experienced problems advertized through recalls, etc. I don't like Ford because I have had to repair too many Ford only problems. That was a good example on your part. I love Toyota because they did fix their earlier problems. Another good example on your part. My point is made by your astute support. Thank you.

Rick Y
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