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Old 02-15-2015, 11:56 AM   #141
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Surely you guys realize that the entire run is recorded. Everything that you can monitor on the dash and more is recorded. Things like operating temp, vehicle speed, rpms, warm up time, cool down time, exhaust gas temp, among lots others.

It's all time stamped so they can profile your every use from key on to key off.
Guessing tha 99.9% do not............
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Old 02-15-2015, 12:05 PM   #142
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We shut down while filling out of force of habit with previous cars and gasoline, but our diesel pickup a Ford F-350 4x4 we always shut down because the fuel cap is locked and the key is on the ignition key ring so off it goes.
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Old 02-15-2015, 01:46 PM   #143
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Originally Posted by scep View Post
Surely you guys realize that the entire run is recorded. Everything that you can monitor on the dash and more is recorded. Things like operating temp, vehicle speed, rpms, warm up time, cool down time, exhaust gas temp, among lots others.

It's all time stamped so they can profile your every use from key on to key off.
Could you give us an example of how you would read from the ecm, the cool down periods before shutdown which includes the two minute drive from the freeway to the gas pump. Not just one trip or one day but an entire history of cooling down or idling that would give you cause to cancel a purchase. 99.9 percent of us would like to know so perhaps we could do the same.
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Old 02-15-2015, 02:55 PM   #144
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Get yourself licensed to use Cummin's Insight software and download away. They also have free license free software, but I dont know what you can see with the free stuff. I used Insight on a job a year ago while doing some engineering work for a company that was developing a "R&D" signal acquisition box for Cummins. Lots of info in the ecm's.

You can also peruse the truck forums as well, lots of guys have found relatively simply methods to download the ecm.
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Old 02-15-2015, 03:35 PM   #145
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Old 02-16-2015, 01:21 PM   #146
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What about checking in at RV park? It's not considerate to those sites near the office to have to inhale diesel.

The idea that starting the motor during one fuel stop during the day is going to put undue hardship on the starter seems unrealistic.

If you have a start up problem, then it would be easier to get support at a fuel stop than at a park.

Shut down, RVs rarely get many miles to make a difference and help cut pollution. It's rare that a semi is left running at the pump, they like to check the oil.
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Old 02-16-2015, 04:36 PM   #147
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I am just curious how many keep their diesel pushers running while refueling at a fuel stop or while taking a bathroom break and stretching your legs at rest areas. IF not why? This is assuming someone is around to "guard" your DP while it is running.

I see no reason to burn diesel while I'm fueling or stretching my legs!
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Old 02-16-2015, 08:09 PM   #148
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Mine is shut off at all stops. Fuel Injection is mechanical, No high Idle, No ECM.
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Old 02-17-2015, 08:43 PM   #149
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I see no reason to burn diesel while I'm fueling or stretching my legs!
Do you have instrumentation to tell you what the turbo's temperature is before you shut the engine down?

Maybe a little enlightenment is in order here.

Mobil Oil believes that conventional oil begins to coke at 225C, 437F (remember the mobil 1 commercials with the frying pan?). Under boost, turbo temps can easily hit 1200+ degrees. Under non boost, turbo temps run around 700 - 900 degrees (twice the temp needed to coke oil).

Turbos have mass, specifically thermal mass. The turbos body will heat up to the temperature of the exhaust gas (in surprisingly a very short time) and will in "due time" cool back down to somewhere above the temperature of the oil used to flood the turbos bearings.

Keep in mind the primary purpose of the oil flowing in the turbo isnt there to provide lubrication, it's purpose is to soak up the turbo's latent heat and transport it away from the bearings. Thus oil flow in a turbo is regarded as a flooding the bearings rather than simply providing a cushion against friction. Oil integrity is critical in turbos.

The turbo's latent heat is the key player in this discussion. Latent implies latency, I.E. a lag in time before something happens. And in the case of the turbo latent heat it means temperatures hot enough that last long enough to coke the oil (to crystallize, or to turn the oil into shards of carbon). And that can happen even under the easiest of operating conditions.

The turbo therefore is provided oil almost immediately after the oil pump to insure the turbo's bearings are "flushed" quickly and continuously. But that only helps on restart and operation thereafter.

It Does not prevent you from shutting down the engine prematurely and causing the latent heat in the turbo housing to coke the oil into shards of carbon that will gouge the keerap out of your turbo's bearings the next time you start it. Accumulative damage will eventually take out the turbo. It is, what it is.
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Old 02-17-2015, 08:51 PM   #150
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Do you have instrumentation to tell you what the turbo's temperature is before you shut the engine down?

Maybe a little enlightenment is in order here.

Mobil Oil believes that conventional oil begins to coke at 225C, 437F (remember the mobil 1 commercials with the frying pan?). Under boost, turbo temps can easily hit 1200+ degrees. Under non boost, turbo temps run around 700 - 900 degrees (twice the temp needed to coke oil).

Turbos have mass, specifically thermal mass. The turbos body will heat up to the temperature of the exhaust gas (in surprisingly a very short time) and will in "due time" cool back down to somewhere above the temperature of the oil used to flood the turbos bearings.

Keep in mind the primary purpose of the oil flowing in the turbo isnt there to provide lubrication, it's purpose is to soak up the turbo's latent heat and transport it away from the bearings. Thus oil flow in a turbo is regarded as a flooding the bearings rather than simply providing a cushion against friction. Oil integrity is critical in turbos.

The turbo's latent heat is the key player in this discussion. Latent implies latency, I.E. a lag in time before something happens. And in the case of the turbo latent heat it means temperatures hot enough that last long enough to coke the oil (to crystallize, or to turn the oil into shards of carbon). And that can happen even under the easiest of operating conditions.

The turbo therefore is provided oil almost immediately after the oil pump to insure the turbo's bearings are "flushed" quickly and continuously. But that only helps on restart and operation thereafter.

It Does not prevent you from shutting down the engine prematurely and causing the latent heat in the turbo housing to coke the oil into shards of carbon that will gouge the keerap out of your turbo's bearings the next time you start it. Accumulative damage will eventually take out the turbo. It is, what it is.

ya what he said
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Old 02-17-2015, 09:12 PM   #151
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What about checking in at RV park? It's not considerate to those sites near the office to have to inhale diesel.

The idea that starting the motor during one fuel stop during the day is going to put undue hardship on the starter seems unrealistic.

If you have a start up problem, then it would be easier to get support at a fuel stop than at a park.

Shut down, RVs rarely get many miles to make a difference and help cut pollution. It's rare that a semi is left running at the pump, they like to check the oil.
Normally I wouldnt respond to a post like this as it tends to inflame rather than discuss. But whatever...

Very few DP's shut down immediately at check in that I have seen. Son's a b....ches tend to run on for hours at their sites too!!!

start up problems involving a turbo anywhere requires a tow At that point it really doesnt matter where you are, they're going to tow you. And if your in a park, it could mean no tow at all, just a turbo swap.

If you dont like pollution, consider rv'ing in an electic or hybrid rv. Short of that protect your investment first and then consider your affect. You did make the choice to burn diesel, so act like you understand what that choice means.

I fuel at the truck side of fuel stops. I have yet to see a "rig" come lumbering in and just shut it down. It's noisy, always. I notice they tend to check their oil levels before the run that day, not mid run.
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Old 02-18-2015, 04:55 PM   #152
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The majority of truckers shut down at the fuel pump and by the time they reach the pump it is safe to shut down the turbo. Thats all I need to know...the technical mumbo jumbo I leave to the mechanics.
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Old 02-18-2015, 06:27 PM   #153
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Backgroud: I recall reading a book where it spoke of one of the advantages of Diesel over Gas is (was actually) that if you idled a gasoline engine too long the thing could foul up and when you called for power .. Alas bad things happened (Stall out or not much power) but with a Diesel you could idle all day.. Fast forward.

Car talk: Someone ask about ideling a gasoline engine, And Click and Clack the Tappet Brothers told him that with a Gasoline engine, it was OK, to let 'em idle (Modern computer controlled engines do not foul like the older ones did) but with modern Diesels. Not a good idea. (They are right on that and I do know why but will leave it to experts to describe)

OF course in both cases we are talking hours, not minutes.

The danger of leaving a diesel running while fueling....

I have seen a lit match tossed into a flash pan full of diesel.. Now one might expect a conflagration (Big fire) but in fact, had about the same effect as if it had been tossed into water.

Do that with Gasoline and you get your Conflagration big time.

I can't believe I spelled Conflagration right the first time.

If the engine is turbo charged, Leaving it idle for a SHORT period is easier on the turbo than shutting it down.. The key word here is SHORT.. If stoppign for the head.. Leave one body in the rig and let it idle (or use the indoor plumbing on the rig) For fuel... I will leave it up to you.. For Dinner at a sit down place.. SHUT IT OFF.
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Old 02-18-2015, 07:39 PM   #154
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I cant believe you actually conflagrated without saying excuse me.
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