Community Forums

travelynne · 08-13-2012, 03:08 AM

Hi folks! Been lurking a while, but getting close to purchase of new MH. I've researched many, both Gas and diesel, but have fallen in love with the floorplan of the new 2013 Thor Challenger 37GT. Has a Triton 6.8L V10, with a 5k hitch, but only 4k between GVWR of 22K and GCWR of 26K. I am wanting to tow a Ford Explorer approx GVWR 4500 lbs plus cargo, so was hoping for 5-6k towing. Is there any way to beef up the MH to tow more? The floorplan is a lock, and I'm willing to compromise on everything else, but was hoping you guys knew some magic ... LOL!

Also welcome and could use some education here. Been mostly researching 40+ diesel pushers until I fell in love with this floorplan, so don't know much about the gas engines. Is that a good engine? Big enough to power that MH? and this is smaller, only 37', so they only have a 5.5k generator - will that power the 2 ACs plus domestic refrig and TVs et al?

Thx. Love the forum.

Phoggberg · 08-13-2012, 04:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travelynne

...and this is smaller, only 37', so they only have a 5.5k generator - will that power the 2 ACs plus domestic refrig and TVs et al?
Thx. Love the forum.

5.5 K is a little small IMHO for 2 A/C Units. Normally with 2 A/C units you are into 7.6KW and with one A/C you are into 5.5KW. Normally each A/C unit will draw about 15-18 Amps when running, but during startup its more like 20-25 Amps. So for short periods of time (about 45 seconds) the A/C will pull about 80% of a 30Amp circuit. That leaves about 5Amps to run the AC Converter, Fridge, and possibly the Water heater. Now add the TV, Sat Receiver, and surround system there probably isn't a lot of the 5Amps left over.

With two A/C's they run independent of each other and so most of the time only one is in start mode at a time, but not always. Don't forget the Power Converter, when dry camping it can want about a 2-3Amp draw on the AC side, and most likely the AC Converter will always be running.

It's rather simple to do the math for your power budget. The formulae is P=IE where P is in Watts, I is in Amps, and E is in volts. In this case I=P/E. To keep it simple we will use E=120V so 5.5KW is about 46Amps max, and 7.6KW is about 63Amps. When both A/C units start up at the same time you will be drawing pretty close to a 5.5KW Generators rated output.

Perhaps your vendor is using some very high efficiency A/C Units, or has some sort of sequencer to ensure that both units don't start at the same time. However, I think that 5.5K is undersized for 2 A/C Units

TXiceman · 08-13-2012, 04:40 AM

You are limited by tow ratings and the lower of the tow will be the limit.

The hitch is physically limited by the 5000# rating.

The coach is limited by the GCWR. What you can tow is GCWR - loaded coach weight. The most the coach can weigh on it's two axles is the GVWR.

So you need to look at the manufacturers weight sticker and see what the weight was when it left the factory and how much room you had for cargo (food, passengers, water, camping supplied, etc.) If you load lightly and keep the weight down, you can pull a bit more than the 4000# when you are at max load.

There is no real way to add to your GCWR. It is what it is.

The V-10 is a great engine, but it has its limits. I would feel that you are pushing the limits with a 37' coach and add a car to tow. Are you going to use this unit in flat land, hills or mountains?

flat land and towing, maybe on a great day, 7 to 8 mpg at 65 mph. In the hills, lower.

The 5.5 kW will run the two A/C units and a TV. Keep the frig on gas and the water heater on gas. Add the microwave to the load and it won't be able to handle it. Hopefully the generator is an Onan and not a Generac (also know as a Gena-WRECK).

As I noted, Thor tends to the entry level and has quiet variable quality control in another post.

Ken

aschuller1 · 08-13-2012, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travelynne

Hi folks! Been lurking a while, but getting close to purchase of new MH. I've researched many, both Gas and diesel, but have fallen in love with the floorplan of the new 2013 Thor Challenger 37GT. Has a Triton 6.8L V10, with a 5k hitch, but only 4k between GVWR of 22K and GCWR of 26K. I am wanting to tow a Ford Explorer approx GVWR 4500 lbs plus cargo, so was hoping for 5-6k towing. Is there any way to beef up the MH to tow more? The floorplan is a lock, and I'm willing to compromise on everything else, but was hoping you guys knew some magic ... LOL!

Also welcome and could use some education here. Been mostly researching 40+ diesel pushers until I fell in love with this floorplan, so don't know much about the gas engines. Is that a good engine? Big enough to power that MH? and this is smaller, only 37', so they only have a 5.5k generator - will that power the 2 ACs plus domestic refrig and TVs et al?

Thx. Love the forum.

Thought I throw my 2 cents worth in:
In regards to the towing:
The hitch rating is 5000# and there is no way to change it. As far as the 4000# difference between the GVRW and the GCWR, what you need to consider is how much the coach actually weighs. As example, I have a 2011 Fleetwood Bounder that weighed 18.6K# on the "official sticker" that is required on all M/H so that the CCC (Cargo Carrying Capicity) can be calulated. I had mine weighed after purchase with full fresh water, fuel, propane, gear, wife and pets and came in at a little under 21K#. I tow a 2012 M/T Subaru Outback that weighs in at a little under 3500# with a full tank of fuel, and keeps me safely under both the hitch rating and the GCWR of the coach.
In regards to the Ford V10:
If you're in a hurry, don't be because simply it just does "all right" but, I don't care because I cruise somewhere around 60 MPH max. I live in the NW and drive in some pretty hilly territory (not like the Rockies but, hilly). I have averaged 7-7.3 MPG not towing and 6-6.2 towing the car. As I have told anyone that has gasped at the fuel economy, "If I was that concerned about the price of gas or the MPG, I would have never bought a M/H in the first place".
Good luck on your purchase and I will second the notion that the quality of the dealership and their service department can be just as important as the coach itself!

aschuller1 · 08-13-2012, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travelynne

Hi folks! Been lurking a while, but getting close to purchase of new MH. I've researched many, both Gas and diesel, but have fallen in love with the floorplan of the new 2013 Thor Challenger 37GT. Has a Triton 6.8L V10, with a 5k hitch, but only 4k between GVWR of 22K and GCWR of 26K. I am wanting to tow a Ford Explorer approx GVWR 4500 lbs plus cargo, so was hoping for 5-6k towing. Is there any way to beef up the MH to tow more? The floorplan is a lock, and I'm willing to compromise on everything else, but was hoping you guys knew some magic ... LOL!

Also welcome and could use some education here. Been mostly researching 40+ diesel pushers until I fell in love with this floorplan, so don't know much about the gas engines. Is that a good engine? Big enough to power that MH? and this is smaller, only 37', so they only have a 5.5k generator - will that power the 2 ACs plus domestic refrig and TVs et al?

Thx. Love the forum.

Almost forgot, in regards to the 5.5KW generator, I can run both of my AC units and the refer just fine. I have a dual zone thermostat and I start one unit and let it run for a minute or two and then start the other. When both are up and running (with the fridge), it shows I'm drawing 26 amps according to the control panel. You should be plenty safe, especially if you run the water heater on propane during heavy usage times.
Again, good luck and happy motoring.

travelynne · 08-13-2012, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aschuller1

Almost forgot, in regards to the 5.5KW generator, I can run both of my AC units and the refer just fine. I have a dual zone thermostat and I start one unit and let it run for a minute or two and then start the other. When both are up and running (with the fridge), it shows I'm drawing 26 amps according to the control panel. You should be plenty safe, especially if you run the water heater on propane during heavy usage times.
Again, good luck and happy motoring.

Thx - all good info!

bronk · 08-13-2012, 03:05 PM

We have a 2011 371 Challenger and tow a Jeep Wrangler. The V-10 has more than adequate power for our needs. We consistently get around 8mpg while towing and depending on terrain, speed and wind. This is a great engine (V10) and should last many years with good maintenance. The Jeep (a '97) is fairly light, but a larger SUV with greater weight is stretching the tow limits of the coach. We have friends with the identical coach, and they tow a full-sized Denali, but I wouldn't recommend it. Maybe a smaller (lighter) toad would be the answer for your situation. Just a thought!

Bronk

mgtr · 08-13-2012, 03:56 PM

I agree that the V10 is a great engine, lots of power. The joke about the engine is that it will pass anything but a gas station! Towing a car, driving 70 MPH, I generally got 6.5 mpg. Obviously, driving slower or not towing will increase your mileage.

Cat320 · 08-15-2012, 03:15 PM

You've gotten lots of good advice. Here are the formulas noted above:

The tow rating is the lower of:

1. GCWR minus RV's actual weight (if it's not over GVWR).

2. Hitch capacity.

3. Coach tow rating.

4. Chassis maker's tow rating.

becks · 08-15-2012, 03:49 PM

Nothing wrong with a V10, we had one for eight years. Why not continue looking for a 40ft DP as you were. There are alot of very clean used DP's to be had at some great prices. Good luck with whatever you choose.

Dutch Star Don · 08-15-2012, 05:07 PM

The numbers you're using aren't really helpful. As some others stated, you need to know what that coach weighs as it comes from the factory. Then you can do some math and add your family and gear. This will give you the weight of the coach. Then you can subtract that from the GVWR to see what is left over. As an example, if that coach weighs in at 21K loaded, you would end up with 5k for towing.

I would check the screen door as it will have a yellow sticker with actual weights of that coach. My guess would be that a 37' is going to be pretty close to 22K when loaded.

You'll have some decisions to make about what you want to tow. You also provided the GVWR of the Explorer. That's really not pertinent. You need to know what the Explorer actually weighs which could be 700 pounds or less than the GVWR. You need actual weights on the coach and Explorer to make an informed decision.