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Old 08-03-2016, 10:11 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by DaveBunker View Post
When leveling the power jacks in auto it will sometime put my wheels up off the ground. Attachment 134693 I've heard not to do this. This is a front engine gasser (V10) so it's probably pretty heavy. What's everybody say about this? Is it a no no? What's it gonna hurt?
We have a gas Challenger and always level manually. I don't care for the "jerkiness" of the auto-level and find that I have greater control in the manual mode. I use one of the 4--way levels that I can easily read from the seat. After 50,00 miles the "system" has worked flawlessly.

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Old 08-04-2016, 06:27 PM   #16
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I have started using an old leveling tool to help me. The system shows level but its not. I have to calibrate one of these days...I followed the instruction once but didnt work.


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Old 08-04-2016, 06:40 PM   #17
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No problèm with that
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Old 08-04-2016, 06:57 PM   #18
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After 8 motor homes including 4 new coaches, I have never ever read any manufacture suggest that it is ok to use the jacks to lift the wheels off the ground. IN fact I will wager it states to never use the jacks to lift the coach to change a tire.
Secondly if I am on a lot that that happens, then I move to another lot !
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Old 08-05-2016, 12:00 AM   #19
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I have had both front wheel(s) and rear off the ground, but not both front and back wheels at the same time. If the rear wheels leave the ground just use wheel chocks on the front wheels to prevent rolling if you think that might be a problem. The instructions for my Dutchstar with manual HWH jacks says to level side-to-side first then front-to-back. in the last 6 years never had a problem.
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Old 08-05-2016, 12:25 AM   #20
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The first time I saw a motor home with the front wheels off the ground I thought "no way" that can't be safe. Our 2008 Itaska Ellipse "Auto" Leveling System will not lift off the ground unless you place pads under the jacks. So, I called HWH and asked the question. The answer was "no problem", the jacks on that coach will easily lift the weight and more. Since then we have been lifting the front a few inches on those uneven grass fields at ball games and concerts with no problems. We just need that extra Camco step for the stairs. But, I do feel the comments about the potential problems with raising the rear wheels and not having a parking brake makes good sense, even though the jacks can lift the weight. You could use wheel chocks up front, but they had better be snug and not allow any rolling movement.
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Old 08-05-2016, 03:43 AM   #21
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let me add my two cents here - as we think about this on a 'physical' level, are we actually using our 'emotions' to cloud our judgement about this topic?

let me explain:

- I feel much more movement in my coach when I am NOT using my leveling system, which probably makes sense to all of us that travel in a motorized rv. We know that the legs provide equalization and stability. Of course, I also feel much more movement when I am driving my coach, BUT, I am comfortable because I know that the Tires, wheels, axles, and suspension systems are designed to take the load, take the movement, take the momentum, and take the weight shifting and still provide me a somewhat stable environment.

-when arriving at an 'unlevel' site, I am, at that moment, at the MOST 'unlevel' as I will possibly be. I have NO leveling system yet in place, yet I must not feel so uncomfortable, or else I would have moved somewhere else. It's really no different that riding down a hill on a highway. I know that the coach is designed to drive in that 'unlevel' condition, and I don't 'fear' an unfriendly outcome.

-when I then use my leveling system, it uses the legs to put the coach into the most 'level' of ALL times during my travels. AND, all this while NOT in motion. This is the moment I should feel most comfortable and safe.

-when I go outside the coach and find that both my front(or rear!) wheels are off of the ground, I suddenly get uncomfortable - but why??

----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is a question of emotion, not reality - here's why:

- when your coach is LEVEL, it is at the most POSITIVE of any times during your travels.
- when the leveling system is in place, your coach has NO momentum to 'roll' down a hill, it is LEVEL.
- when a tire, or two, or three, is off the ground, it means that your leveling system has done it's job... would you rather have your coach 'leaning' all night? is that a better scenerio?
- will your tires, wheels, suspension, and axles fall off? uh, no.
- will your BRAKES be able to save you? if your brakes would not save you, then they would NOT have saved you, regardless of any leveling system.
- per the last point, about brakes, if all of your wheels are off the ground, why would you need brakes?


... most of our concerns really evolve around how we 'feel' when we see wheels off the ground, not grounded in reality, and which is not nearly as negative as we make it out to be.

we've all probably seen those 'crazy' folks in that 'big' coach that has wheels off the ground and rolled our eyes as we passed by. funny though, we come back several months later and they're still there, enjoying their retirement, relaxing, and their coach is still exactly where it was to begin with - wheels off the ground.
: )
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Old 08-05-2016, 06:58 AM   #22
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The coach that you are leveling is heavy, somewhere in the 10 - 40 thousand pound range. Remember two things. First your parking brake is only on the rear wheels, it is either a small set of brake pads around the driveshaft or a cog in the transmission. Second, your jacks are attached to your frame expecting vertical (up and down), not horizontal (forward/backward/side to side) stress. When you raise your front wheels off the ground you stress the suspension system, either springs or air bags and shocks by extending them as far as they can go, leaving that weight hanging there in space is not the norm. You also stress the parking system and of course the jacking system (both the shafts and the attachment points). Yes once the coach is level, most , but not all, of the weight is not inclined to move, but as things change, the soil/asphalt/etc under the jacks compress or wind acts upon the coach, that situation changes. Remember even though they are called jacks they are really stabilizers, not designed to hold all the weight and take all the stress that they could be subject to.
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Old 08-05-2016, 07:53 AM   #23
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I have found that the Lippert auto level system sucks at best. It will almost always keep going until one or more wheels are off the ground, even in relatively level sites. I also have trouble understanding the manual system. You have four buttons and four wheels. Why not have one button per wheel, rather than two buttons labeled front/rear and two labeled left/right. I've tried holding the front/rear and right/left at the same time thinking that would activate one corner only, but nooo. Perhaps I am just not smart enough to figure it out, but if someone can explain how the system is suppose to work, it would be appreciated.
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Old 08-05-2016, 07:57 AM   #24
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I'll politely disagree ...

- the discussion of BRAKES and JACKS/LEVELERS are two different discussions, but it seems that everyone wants to have them in the same discussion as though they are related.
..... your brakes keep you from moving, IF, and only IF, your wheels are fully seated on the ground. BUT, when your leveling system puts your jacks down, ALL wheels are then lifted 'off the ground', even so slightly, as far as 'brakes' are concerned. When a jack contacts the ground, it then LIFTS that wheel off the ground, or better said 'takes the weight and pressure off that end of the axle', which is where the wheel is. So, your BRAKES are no longer part of the equation. Your LEVELERS/JACKS are now in control.

Now..... your LEVELERS/JACKS are certainly capable of lifting your coach with ALL WHEELS OF THE GROUND. If they could not, then they COULD NOT LEVEL YOUR COACH. Your system is designed for the full weight of the coach, and more. This is not a negative, but a positive, as you certainly want your leveling system to be powerful enough to handle the weight that it is designed to provide leveling for, even under extremely uneven circumstances, such as when your 'Extreme Angle' indicator lights up.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think many of us fear that the leveling 'legs', which we envision as too 'skinny' to be lifting such a large load, are going to somehow 'bend' if too much weight is added. But, these SOLID legs, which extend well up into their housing, and are attached to the most solid part of your chassis, are not going anywhere anytime soon, even fully extended.
We fear that wind, weather, movement within the coach, weight shifting, or ground giving way is going to 'break' the system and cause the coach to 'tip over' or 'go rolling down the hill'. But.... that's when your wheels would then carry the weight and the brakes would keep that from happening....


I would like to hear a story of anyone that this has happened to. We might see that there were also other parts to the story.

...having said all this, I don't like my wheels off the ground either. : )
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Old 08-05-2016, 08:30 AM   #25
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I have had to raise the front wheels off the ground from time to time. Only issue for me is I instantly hate any CG that has sites that hard to level. Most coach's raised that high in the front mean you practically need a ladder getting in/out. Wife is short and so are dogs so not a good fit for us.
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Old 08-05-2016, 11:50 AM   #26
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If my wheels have to come off the ground then I will put blocks under them as well as the jacks. I feel more stability having the wheels on the ground along with the jacks rather than just 2 metal rams for the jacks. It may be okay to lift your wheels off the ground and keep it that way but I will not do it that way. It is always my technique to get as level as possible with the wheels then fine tune with the jacks.
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Old 08-05-2016, 10:25 PM   #27
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Lots of "feelings" being expressed here. Rational? or irrational?
Like MisterT I would like to hear of an actual bad experience and the circumstances surrounding it.
As far as things being stressed when the wheels are off the ground, where is the proof? If a tire and rim is being removed from the coach for repairs is anything being stressed? Do you think the designers of these vehicles have not designed the equipment to handle these situations? If you were the designer would you have omitted including these situations in the design?
Just saying.
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Old 08-06-2016, 06:43 AM   #28
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Lots of "feelings" being expressed here. Rational? or irrational?
Like MisterT I would like to hear of an actual bad experience and the circumstances surrounding it.
As far as things being stressed when the wheels are off the ground, where is the proof? If a tire and rim is being removed from the coach for repairs is anything being stressed? Do you think the designers of these vehicles have not designed the equipment to handle these situations? If you were the designer would you have omitted including these situations in the design?
Just saying.
You're mixing apples and oranges. There's a huge difference between raising a wheel off the ground on a flat level hard surface to change a tire and parking on a hill steep enough that a wheel has to be raised off the ground to level it. As a former road service provider I would never attempt to raise a vehicle and change a tire on a vehicle that was sitting on potentially soft ground on the side of a hill. It's a recipe for disaster.

Over the years I've seen a number of trucks and cars down on the axles when owners attempted just that. In most cases the vehicle had to be raised by a tow truck and either blocked to complete the tire change or moved to a flat hard level surface and completed.

By definition the wheels on a motorhome won't need to be raised high enough to take them off the ground unless you park on an incline. In a case where one or more wheels need to be raised off the ground you're likely not on a paved surface.
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