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Old 08-19-2016, 12:32 AM   #15
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Cannot say which tire band is superior, but what I can say is my Toyos are performing very well. I follow close the OEM inflation recommendations.
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Old 08-19-2016, 02:50 AM   #16
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Replaced our Michellin XZE cracked sidewall tires with XZE2 to keep the same size. Did not like the ride and noise after the change, and I was very attentive to tire pressure and tried different psi. Made the change to the Toyo M177, 295/75/22.5 as originally suggested as a good option by Les Schwab. Also removed the beads because they said that can be a noise issue. The M177 track very well, smooth, much lower rolling resistance and quieter , and as mentioned earlier in thread easy turning. But, tire pressure is so important or there will be harsh ride, understeer, or problems with any tire.
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Old 08-19-2016, 05:52 AM   #17
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x2 on the toyo's. M154 265/75 22.5 here
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Old 08-19-2016, 09:48 AM   #18
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This one of these posts much like "which oil is better?" I'm sure some brands rely on "reputation". Perhaps Michelin is one. I had Double Coins on our last rig and loved them, especially the cost. We now have a newer coach with 2 year old Toyo's. If I could save significant money by going with Toyo over Michelin, I'd do it in a heartbeat!

Maintenance and correct tire pressure is the key IMO. And we run 90 all around on our coach with 22.5 wheels per Toyos recommendation.
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Old 08-20-2016, 11:32 AM   #19
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Yep, as I stated - opinions will vary!!!

Cost is not as important as safety.

Lower rolling resistance is not as important as safety.

Now, which tire is safer then another? Subjective indeed!

Again, buy tires that meat or exceed your coaches Load Range needs.

Do get four corner weights, and use the tire manufactures recommended PSI setting. (Though some, myself included, add 10% contingency to this setting. Allows for weight creep, and some loss of PSI on trips, with still being in the safe range.0

To me, after safety, which is subjective enough to warrant it's own Forum Heading! I go for the combo of ride comfort and lower rolling resistance as my next two main criteria.

Rolling Resistance Comparison | Michelin Truck

This thread is a good resource for comparing tires against each other. Note that not all brands and sizes are here, for example the last time I looked, Hankook AH12 was not one that I could compare, but the AH11's were. This is the link I used to compare the Toyo's recommended to me from LS, against my Michelin XZE*'s I was replacing. And also against the Michelin Energy XZA2's that I ended up buying.

I have nothing negative to say about Toyo. They are what they are, a respected OTR Trucking Tire. Hold up well. Same with Bridgestone's veteran R250 tire. But in my tire size, both the Toyo and Bridgestone's had much higher Rolling Resistance then the tires I ended up with. Comfort of drive? Well so much of the depends on other factors. The chassis and insulation and build quality of the coaches, being one major factor. But I went with the info shared to me by people with like coaches, similar and or the same, as mine. I neglected in my first post, to include Yokohama's, which are getting good feed back from owners too.

OP - Good luck on you hunt! And in the future, you will be one of the 'Opinions will vary.' posters!

Best to all, be safe, keep the rubber side down,
Smitty
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Old 08-20-2016, 03:32 PM   #20
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There is no comparison. Toyo tires are superior to Michelins.
LOL! I have to agree! I think the Michelins cost so much more to pay for the advertising campaigns which (apparently quite successfully) convince people that any tire that is not a Michelin in a rolling time bomb that is made of rocks and eats fuel just sitting still!

The stiffness of a highway or regional delivery tire is probably 98% determined by the air pressure and 2% by differences in the sidewall construction, whether the tire company says "RV' or "truck". They both have to hold up the load, right? A given size tire has just so much footprint (the tire "patch") square inches to support the weight, and requires x amount of psi to do that. x psi times Y sq inches = the load capacity, whether its Michelin or Toyo. There ain't no way to beat the basic physics except by making the tire "patch" bigger, meaning a larger tire.

By now you have probably figured out I don't buy Michelins. I have Continentals in the back and Toyo up front, at 50%-60% of the price of Michelin. Or GY either.
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Old 08-20-2016, 04:03 PM   #21
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Many Les Schwab shops in Oregon so no sales tax that's a plus too!
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Old 08-20-2016, 08:18 PM   #22
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Many Les Schwab shops in Oregon so no sales tax that's a plus too!
I bought my RV in Oregon and the first thing I did before I drove it 50 miles was stop in to Les Schwab and get new Toyos. Great price and service with no sales tax
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Old 08-21-2016, 12:53 AM   #23
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Big fan of Les Schwab, used them for many years before heading north. Did the same thing as noserider, drove straight to Les Schwab for a set of Toyos.
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Old 08-21-2016, 09:16 AM   #24
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Due to miles driven (203,000) the rear tires are my 3rd set of Michelins. It is the only set that I've had for more than 4 years. The fronts after the 3rd set, I replaced due to cupping. I chose Toyo's as I got tired of the cupping.

Back to the rear set of Michelin. As of this month they are exactly 6 years old. I checked and they have cracks around the entire sidewall were the tire meet the rim. Michelin will argue they have to be driven to exercised. They are driven at least 500 miles every month. They also will argue that sun affects the tire. I garage the coach when not in use (at least 6-8 months a year). Needless to say I'm disappointed as they have more tread to be used.

As to the Toyo's on the front. They are 265/75R 22.5, 154's. No cupping in the last 35,000 miles and provide a stable, comfortable ride. Toyo's are going replace the back set shortly.
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Old 08-22-2016, 08:55 AM   #25
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I have had zero problems with the Michelin tires on our motor homes or other vehicles. What is the most popular OEM tires on new heavy DP's? I really don't know, but would suspect that if one brand was superior to another, that would be the one they would use, or maybe if one was cheaper, that would be their choice. Does anyone know what brand is used more than any other and why?
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Old 08-22-2016, 09:12 AM   #26
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I have had zero problems with the Michelin tires on our motor homes or other vehicles. What is the most popular OEM tires on new heavy DP's? I really don't know, but would suspect that if one brand was superior to another, that would be the one they would use, or maybe if one was cheaper, that would be their choice. Does anyone know what brand is used more than any other and why?

Excellent question! I think along the same lines, the RV manufacturers are going to save every penny they can on any components . They will weigh quality and reputation, against their cost and make a decision based on that. So what are the tire brands used by the mfg?
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Old 08-22-2016, 01:50 PM   #27
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LOL! I have to agree! I think the Michelins cost so much more to pay for the advertising campaigns which (apparently quite successfully) convince people that any tire that is not a Michelin in a rolling time bomb that is made of rocks and eats fuel just sitting still!

The stiffness of a highway or regional delivery tire is probably 98% determined by the air pressure and 2% by differences in the sidewall construction, whether the tire company says "RV' or "truck". They both have to hold up the load, right? A given size tire has just so much footprint (the tire "patch") square inches to support the weight, and requires x amount of psi to do that. x psi times Y sq inches = the load capacity, whether its Michelin or Toyo. There ain't no way to beat the basic physics except by making the tire "patch" bigger, meaning a larger tire.

By now you have probably figured out I don't buy Michelins. I have Continentals in the back and Toyo up front, at 50%-60% of the price of Michelin. Or GY either.

Hi Gary - I understood your post completely. And understand that you're not in favor of paying the price for Michelin, as you find other tires meet your needs well at a nicer price point!

I did want to share some real world differences on the difference in noise level, and comfort, from some tires we've had on our coach.

> When we bought the coach used, they still had the CC OEM Toyo Tires. (Do not recall the tire model number.) Due to the age of the tire, I negotiated a credit from the buyer for 8 new tires of my choice. Disclaimer here: I never checked the tire PSI on the Toyo's when I took delivery. Bought the coach out of Holland Motor Homes in then San Diego, since moved to San Marcos. They did the PDT for delivery, and the tires PSI were checked as being set. I suspect they set these to the placards PSI setting, which is much higher then normally run with. That being said, the couple hundred miles I drove on the Toyo's, I found the ride jarring over expansion joints and bad roadways. Noise level was high too. And the front wandered in the lane. (But again, I do not consider that a fair assessment of this set of Toyo's, as they were old, and I believe the PSI was much higher then required.)

>Installed the Michelin XZE*'s all around. These tires were the heaviest tires I had looked into, that extra weight came from extra meat on the sidewalls for scrubbing. The PSI was set per the actual four corner weight of the coach, plus the added contingency I run with on top of that. The fronts were set to 105 PSI. The ride was noticeably quieter, tracked well, and while I still felt expansion joints and bad roadways, it was an improvement over the Toyo's, yep again - the Older Toyo's - that were on the coach.

>Damaged two tires about two years ago now due to a California pot hole. Michelin tire shortage, which then rippled over to shortages of other brands of tires to. And at 12R 22.5, not as large a choice of models to choose from anyway. I did due the FMCA purchase program, and was able to find 2 BF Goodrich ST230's (Made by Michelin.) Being the newest tires, the other 6 were 5 years old. I had the ST230's installed on the steers. The tires were not quite as loud as the XZE*'s, and set for the proper load weight of my front end, I ran these at 105 PSI too. Expansion joints and bad roads ride transfer into the front end of the coach, was again reduced and or an improvement over the XZE*'s.

>Earlier this year, I replaced the final 6 tires. Changed the size to 295/80 22.5, as they had more tire models to choose from, and minimal difference to the speedometer. I went with the Michelin XZA2 Energy tires. Again on the FMCA program. Tire pressure was also set to the same 105 PSI, on the steers. (I moved the still young ST230's 12r 22.5 to the Tag, after coordinating with Country Coach that it was ok to have the Tag be a different size. The noise level dropped down again, over the ST230's. The ride comfort over expansion joints and rough roads, also dropped again.

So what? Well, the sidewalls 'stiff ness' or 'hunkiness' differences between for sure the Michelin XZE*'s, BF Goodrich ST230's and finally the Michelin XZA2's - made a noticeable difference, on the steers, on ride comfort and tire noise level.

Different coaches may have different results, due to different chassis and running weights.

My purpose not his thread, was to share that perception of the experience of these three tires. Not the Toyo's, as it would not be a fair comparison.

On price? With the FMCA discount, the difference in cost is not as great for the Michelin's. You probably have seen in this and other threads, that I for sure did consider other tires too. I'm not hung up on just driving on Michelin tires. I did use the Rolling Comparison site to compare the tires, and that was one of the primary reasons I went with the XZA2's, as they had the least rolling resistance I could find for my two tire sizes (12R or 295/80), and still under 6 months of DOT Born On Date age, a criteria for me at the time of purchase.

I do feel that if I could have found Hankook's with younger dates then were available, that I would have put those on the Drive and Tag, and still bought the Michelin XZA2's for the steer. I think that would have been a reasonable and cost effective approach for these 8 shoes that go on my coach!

Best to you and all, be safe, have fun,
Smitty
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Old 08-22-2016, 05:13 PM   #28
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Last summer I purchased 6 Sumitomo tires at $2,300 installed with tax. I have traveled Chicago to Alaska and Chicago to Florida and they still look new. Never lost even a pound of air. They ride quiet and smooth (if the road is good)and appear to be a good tire for the price. Any new tire at any price will be a big improvement over any brand of older tires.
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