Go Back   iRV2 Forums > MOTORHOME FORUMS > Class A Motorhome Discussions
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 07-22-2005, 11:33 AM   #15
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 10
When I received the coach of course we were given quite a large package of manuals to ponder through. That's when we realized that what was supposed to be a plasma TV was in fact an LCD TV. We talked to the dealer and his response was that this was between me an Newmar which was not the right thing to say. The brochure listed the option as a plasma TV, the fabrication order listed the TV as a plasma TV, and the option list that you complete when you order your coach listed the option as a plasma TV of which the price was $6000.00. I wasn't given any discount because of switching the plasma to an LCD. The price was the same. And yes I know there is time and labor cost to install the TV but the coach comes with a TV anyway regardless whether it would be a plasma, LCD or standard TV. So, the comment stating there is an additional cost to install the plasma doesn't hold any water.

After two phone calls and three e-mails Newmar responded by offering to make the change without cost to me and if I came to the factory they would reimburse me for my fuel cost. Thats great except that in order for me to do this I would lose a weeks salary. I also asked to be reimbursed for the loss of salary of which I was denied. I don't see this as unreasonable as I did't make the mistake all I did was place the order and pay for the coach. If Newmar would have contacted me when they decided to make the substitution I wouldn't have had an issue with this but instead they just made the switch and the dealer didn't care he had alrfeady cashed the check. It would be the same as if they would have put a gas engine in when you expected that you were getting a 400 hp diesel engine. It's still an engine! Well I have decided what I want to do to correct the situation I've heard pro's and con's regarding plasma tv's and RV's.
__________________

__________________
New05MountAire is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 07-22-2005, 12:04 PM   #16
Senior Member
 
The Shadow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Southern Ontario/Palmetto FL
Posts: 1,092
We are contemplating trading and this type of attitude by Newmar is making me wonder if that is the kind of organization we would want to deal with. One hears a lot of positive things about Newmar but dropping its longer warranty and then pulling a stunt like this is something Newmar should not be proud of (regardless of what the manufacturers' reps on this forum believe [well, reps is too general, defenders would be better, since that is their usual stance]). No LCD is worth even $3k let alone $6k. I have a 50 inch DLP (certainly ranked above an LCD) and it was far from $3k. How large is this LCD unit anyway?

I'd insist on a $3k refund or I'd see a lawyer. The facts supporting your case as you have described them look awful good to me.


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by New05MountAire:
When I received the coach of course we were given quite a large package of manuals to ponder through. That's when we realized that what was supposed to be a plasma TV was in fact an LCD TV. We talked to the dealer and his response was that this was between me an Newmar which was not the right thing to say. The brochure listed the option as a plasma TV, the fabrication order listed the TV as a plasma TV, and the option list that you complete when you order your coach listed the option as a plasma TV of which the price was $6000.00. I wasn't given any discount because of switching the plasma to an LCD. The price was the same. And yes I know there is time and labor cost to install the TV but the coach comes with a TV anyway regardless whether it would be a plasma, LCD or standard TV. So, the comment stating there is an additional cost to install the plasma doesn't hold any water.

After two phone calls and three e-mails Newmar responded by offering to make the change without cost to me and if I came to the factory they would reimburse me for my fuel cost. Thats great except that in order for me to do this I would lose a weeks salary. I also asked to be reimbursed for the loss of salary of which I was denied. I don't see this as unreasonable as I did't make the mistake all I did was place the order and pay for the coach. If Newmar would have contacted me when they decided to make the substitution I wouldn't have had an issue with this but instead they just made the switch and the dealer didn't care he had alrfeady cashed the check. It would be the same as if they would have put a gas engine in when you expected that you were getting a 400 hp diesel engine. It's still an engine! Well I have decided what I want to do to correct the situation I've heard pro's and con's regarding plasma tv's and RV's. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
__________________

__________________
2011 Itasca Impulse 26QP Silver, 2014 Jeep Cherokee Limited V6 Active Drive II
The Shadow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2005, 12:32 PM   #17
Senior Member
 
edgray's Avatar


 
Workhorse Chassis Owner
Entegra Owners Club
Spartan Chassis
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Madison, MS
Posts: 7,547
Originally posted by NEW05MountAire:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">After two phone calls and three e-mails Newmar responded by offering to make the change without cost to me and if I came to the factory they would reimburse me for my fuel cost. Thats great except that in order for me to do this I would lose a weeks salary. I also asked to be reimbursed for the loss of salary of which I was denied. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I guess DLESLIE125 will consider me a "Newmar defender" because of my comments, but I prefer to think of myself as a "problem solver". Why not have Newmar ship the LCD set to the dealer and let them swap it out?? Wouldn't that solve the problem, without costing you a weeks salary? Why drive all the way to Nappanne, even if they were willing to reimburse you the fuel?? Now, as for the difference in cost, I think you should be refunded the difference between the option prices of these different TVs. Frankly, I'm shocked that the buyer of Newmar's flagship MH would have received such an unprofessional response from his dealer. May I ask, was it you LOCAL dealer?? Have you spoken to the owner? Thanks, ED
__________________
2016 EC Aspire 42RBQ / 2014 CR-V
edgray is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2005, 01:17 PM   #18
Moderator Emeritus
 
Cruzer's Avatar


 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Sheboygan, WI
Posts: 4,900
I gotta go with EdGray on this one. I don't own a Newmar so I guess I can't be a rep or defender but Ed's suggestion is right on the money and it's the best way to handle it for all parties involved. It's just too bad it's gone this long without going anywhere. It's also equally sad that your dealer isn't going to bat for you when it's obvious as to where the error lies. A great dealership is worth it's weight in gold when things like this pop up. Too bad yours is measured in Tupperware.
__________________
Mark & Leann Quasius
2016 Cornerstone 45A
2007 Allegro Bus 42QRP (Sold)
2012 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited - Rubicon
Cruzer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2005, 02:33 PM   #19
Senior Member
 
The Shadow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Southern Ontario/Palmetto FL
Posts: 1,092
Ed, your views are no different than mine. I would not put you in the defender category.

I think this "bring it back to the factory" routine is silly (and Newmar is no different from other manufacturers in this regard). If the dealer is not capable of handling something like this, Newmar should drop it and get one that can do it. Just imagine GM saying "bring your Van back to the factory and we will put in the screen you paid for" (I use that as an example because I have a GM van with a DVD and screen). That would go over like a lead balloon with customers and top GM Management (and Ford, DC, Toyota etc). Why do so many MH owners put up with it?

IMO Newmar should simply have cut a check for the difference between the cost of the plasma and the LCD immediately upon identifying the issue.

Cruzer, you don't have to own one to be a defender. Just take a look back over the posts in this thread and see who immediately assumed that the manufacturer likely did no wrong. I've noticed that often enough with his posts that I consider them to be sadly lacking in objectivity and thus of minimal value. I would not say the same thing for your contributions here and on another system as you appear to have made a very good effort to be objective and even handed at all times.

What some people don't seem to realize is that the vast majority of people who participate in these forums are simply looking to get what they paid for - and in most cases they have paid a pretty steep price. They don't want to have these kinds of problems. They don't need them. One of these days a university is going to do a study on the lifespan of motorhome owners compared with the rest of the population. Since we purchased our first MH just over two years ago I've witnessed a lot of owners being subjected to significant amounts of stress from having to deal with MH problems that are clearly the fault of the factory and/or dealer. I've gone through it myself and hopefully that is now behind me (which is why, as we contemplate buying another unit I ask "do I really want to go through this again?). Do the positives of MH ownership outweight the negatives? One might argue they must or we wouldn't keep buying. Perhaps an independent observer might say we only continue to buy because we are not very bright. And yet others might say that the reason we put up with so many problems is that once we are locked into a significant cost ( a MH sure isn't an investment is it, given how little you get for a new unit a year later?) we feel we have to stay with it - and thus we are foolish enough to trade and stay in the game with even higher stakes yet.

One would hope that manufacturers and dealers would understand that it will ultimately be to their financial benefit if they make a proper effort to provide owners with a positive experience rather than one headache after another.


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by edgray:
Originally posted by NEW05MountAire:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">After two phone calls and three e-mails Newmar responded by offering to make the change without cost to me and if I came to the factory they would reimburse me for my fuel cost. Thats great except that in order for me to do this I would lose a weeks salary. I also asked to be reimbursed for the loss of salary of which I was denied. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I guess DLESLIE125 will consider me a "Newmar defender" because of my comments, but I prefer to think of myself as a "problem solver". Why not have Newmar ship the LCD set to the dealer and let them swap it out?? Wouldn't that solve the problem, without costing you a weeks salary? Why drive all the way to Nappanne, even if they were willing to reimburse you the fuel?? Now, as for the difference in cost, I think you should be refunded the difference between the option prices of these different TVs. Frankly, I'm shocked that the buyer of Newmar's flagship MH would have received such an unprofessional response from his dealer. May I ask, was it you LOCAL dealer?? Have you spoken to the owner? Thanks, ED </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
__________________
2011 Itasca Impulse 26QP Silver, 2014 Jeep Cherokee Limited V6 Active Drive II
The Shadow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2005, 07:34 PM   #20
Senior Member
 
edgray's Avatar


 
Workhorse Chassis Owner
Entegra Owners Club
Spartan Chassis
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Madison, MS
Posts: 7,547
Originally posted by DLESLIE125:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">(which is why, as we contemplate buying another unit I ask "do I really want to go through this again?). Do the positives of MH ownership outweight the negatives? One might argue they must or we wouldn't keep buying. Perhaps an independent observer might say we only continue to buy because we are not very bright. And yet others might say that the reason we put up with so many problems is that once we are locked into a significant cost ( a MH sure isn't an investment is it, given how little you get for a new unit a year later?) we feel we have to stay with it - and thus we are foolish enough to trade and stay in the game with even higher stakes yet. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Don, Thanks for not labeling me a defender! I think you MAY have left out the real reason many of us "put up with so many problems..." is because we truely enjoy the freedom and FUN that comes with using our Rvs as we persue our dreams. "hope springs eternal", and I hope to live long enough to see the level of customer support by the RV industry at least approach what you referred to in the auto industry.

Until the day that that "cavet emptor" no longer applies to RVs, I believe that RVers need to USE the internet, and particularly sites like iRV2.com (which I obviously support and endorse),to do their shopping & research. A little knowledge about how to select quality products from ethical dealers will go a long way to help weed out the shoddy workmanship and eliminate the dealer chicanery which seems (from some of these posts) to permeate the RV industry. As long as glitz & frills trumps substance and quality, there will always be a quick buck artist selling exactly what the uneducated consumer is led to believe is the best thing going.

In this instance, I think the buyer WAS buying quality, and should be upset that he did not get what he ordered and paid for. You may have noticed I asked "New05mountAire" about his dealer's location, as I sure won't buy from a place with the attitude he described. And I hope he will also reply with the ultimate resolution of this issue, because he only stated he had made his decision.

Good luck with your decision about trading, and I'm betting you will make a wise choice armed with the knowledge you have gained here and through your other experiences. ED
__________________
2016 EC Aspire 42RBQ / 2014 CR-V
edgray is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2005, 05:04 AM   #21
Moderator Emeritus
 
Cruzer's Avatar


 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Sheboygan, WI
Posts: 4,900
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">...... Until the day that that "cavet emptor" no longer applies to RVs, I believe that RVers need to USE the internet, and particularly sites like iRV2.com (which I obviously support and endorse),to do their shopping & research. A little knowledge about how to select quality products from ethical dealers will go a long way to help weed out the shoddy workmanship and eliminate the dealer chicanery which seems (from some of these posts) to permeate the RV industry. ..... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Amen! Communication will go a long way towards improving the industry. I can't emphasis enough the value of a site such as IRV2 that allows the free exchange of usefull information (read the mission statement at the top of each page). It's given me the chance to benefit my RVing experience and coach and dealer selection. We are extremely pleased with our coach, our manufacturer, our dealer, our choice of options, the campgrounds we've been able to research ahead of time over the web reviews, and just plain help us enjoy RVing. I can't begin to calculate how many dollars I've saved through this or how many intangible benefits there are.
__________________
Mark & Leann Quasius
2016 Cornerstone 45A
2007 Allegro Bus 42QRP (Sold)
2012 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited - Rubicon
Cruzer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2005, 08:06 AM   #22
Senior Member
 
The Shadow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Southern Ontario/Palmetto FL
Posts: 1,092
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by edgray:


Good luck with your decision about trading, and I'm betting you will make a wise choice armed with the knowledge you have gained here and through your other experiences. ED </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Ed, I'm finding this decesion far more difficult than the last one. When we moved from a used 2000 Triple E Commander to the 2004 Journey it wasn't an easy task but this time we are facing a MUCH bigger depreciation hit - in fact huge. I don't really want to get into looking every year. When we bought in 2004 we figured we would move around the southern US in the winter. We ended up renting a lot for the winter in Florida and very quickly bought a lot in that park when we found out how much we enjoyed ourselves with many great people. Now, 2 slides (and a very shallow one in the LR/galley) just don't seem to do the job for a long stay in one place as there are three of us in the MH.

Our dealer is HR/Winnie and is selling DPs at a rate of of at least 25 HRs to 1 Winnie (if not 50 to one - I've been monitoring their inventory since January). So far this year they've had a Vectra (which they still have on the lot) and a Journey 39K that sold after being around for perhaps 4 months (it only had 1750 lbs CCC - the Vectra has 2200 lbs). Their HR inventory is very good and the volume flow of HRs means plenty of turnover with lots of choice.

Our problem in Canada is "dealer distance." If I can't do a deal with them on a Winnie, I can go about 50 miles in the other direction to an Itasca dealer - after that I"m out of luck as the next one is 1.5 hours in the other direction - but none of them seem to carry any DP inventory. With the HR line it the same thing - there is a Monaco dealer 2.5 hours away. I almost feel like I'm being held hostage. OH, prices. Well, you have to beg for a 15% discount off of an inflated price.

If I go to Newmar, the closest dealer (who doesn't even have a web site) is almost a 1.5 hour drive. The next is over 2 hours away and its web site doesn't show its inventory and the 3rd is 4 hours away. Tiffin only has one dealer - virtually in the middle of no where and with little inventory (and when we visited this dealership when making our last purchase I was floored when he bragged how good service was at the Tiffin factory and how he took his there for service at times as well).

If I didn't have a trade I'd buy in the US. However, if I trade mine in the US I'll have to pay sales taxes on the full purchase price when I import - not just the difference as I would trading it here. That levels the playing field very quickly. And then if I did buy in the US, trying to get a dealer here to even look at it would be impossible.

I'm starting to wish that we had originally purchased a 3 to 5 year old Wanderlodge (or something of that nature) and then kept it for 10 years. Since I've never been able to keep a car for more than 3 years there is no reason it would work with motorhomes.

When you are collecting donations for your W24, get a few for me so I can jump to the Wanderlodge.
__________________

__________________
2011 Itasca Impulse 26QP Silver, 2014 Jeep Cherokee Limited V6 Active Drive II
The Shadow is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Workhorse UFO™ Brings A Wave Of New Choices To Motor Home Buyers DriVer RV Industry Press 6 03-25-2007 02:39 PM
New Workhorse UFO™ Chassis Brings A Wave Of New Choices To Motorhome Buyers DriVer Workhorse and Chevrolet Chassis Motorhome Forum 11 01-01-2007 03:27 PM
New Workhorse UFO™ Chassis Brings A Wave Of New Choices To Motorhome Buyers DriVer RV Industry Press 5 01-01-2007 10:37 AM
To All Future Essex Buyers Lug_Nut Newmar Owner's Forum 28 09-22-2006 08:27 AM
Attention RV Owners and future buyers Woge 5th Wheel Discussion 2 07-11-2005 06:36 AM

» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:24 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.