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Old 07-23-2015, 09:32 AM   #1
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Oops Air problem

I have a 1999 Winnebago Ultimate Freedom with an RVP 6636-871 air conditioner
located next to the engine in the rear. I also have a Freedom 20
Heart Interface inverter/charger supported by all new batteries, good connections, and clean terminals.
Both were working fine thru the last 12 months. However, all of a sudden, after plugging into a 50 amp pedistal that had 123 on both legs, the inverter/charger is not charging and the air conditioner is blowing warm air and the compresser is not comming on.
The only problem I found was my 50amp plug had a couple of disconnected wires which was causing me to have only one live leg in the plug. After fixing the plug and plugging it back in these things stopped working.
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Old 07-23-2015, 09:39 AM   #2
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If one of those disconnected wires was the neutral, your gear has probably experienced somewhere around 200 volts. If the neutral is lost in a 50A (split phase) power system the voltage in the hot wires float proportional to the amp load in each. The way an RV is typically wired, that almost always results in extreme high voltage on one of the two hots. If that happened, you are in for some expensive repairs.
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Old 07-23-2015, 04:38 PM   #3
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If one of those disconnected wires was the neutral, your gear has probably experienced somewhere around 200 volts. If the neutral is lost in a 50A (split phase) power system the voltage in the hot wires float proportional to the amp load in each. The way an RV is typically wired, that almost always results in extreme high voltage on one of the two hots. If that happened, you are in for some expensive repairs.
I thinks this is the case. What might these repairs be. It seems obvious that I have blown the inverter/charger
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Old 07-23-2015, 07:59 PM   #4
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Not wanting to sound like a butt. Would a surge protector caught this problem? Thanks Robert.
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Old 07-23-2015, 10:13 PM   #5
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Not wanting to sound like a butt. Would a surge protector caught this problem? Thanks Robert.
I wouldn't say you're sounding like a "Butt". It's a legit question. There are cheapo and expensive surge protectors out there for our rolling Kleenex boxes. I'm no expert on any of them and, at the time, do NOT have one. But, the more expensive ones have the ability to detect all kinds of issues and, protect against the consequences of encountering any of those issues. It's just like any insurance policy.
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Old 07-24-2015, 08:01 AM   #6
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Not wanting to sound like a butt. Would a surge protector caught this problem? Thanks Robert.


Question:---------------------------------------------------
I have figured out what happened. I had a senior moment of some sort.
1 - I pull into the park, plug in my "surge guard" to the pedestal and my plug into my surge guard
2 - no power to the rv, the window on the surge guard is all cloudy and I can't read a thing.
3 - I figure it is the pedestal so I check it with my meter , 123 on each side
(Senior moment) - never occurred to me to check my plug
4 - the park tech checks things out and replaces the old beat up looking plug
5 - still no power coming through the surge guard, can't read what it says in the window
6 - finally check my plug - three loose wires
(Senior moment) - I only see two of the loose wires. The "White" neutral is short and I don't notice it.
7 - I tighten up the two wires I see
8 - since I know the pedestal is good I put my plug directly into the pedestal.
9 - I hear a noise, short and sweet like a breaker tripping.
10 - I unplug and turn on the generator for the rest of the night
at this point my basement air is blowing warm air because the compressor won't come on and the lights on my inverter/charger panel are off
11 - I run my roof backup unit and go to bed
12 - in the morning all the batteries are dead
13 - I jump start the coach and go home.
By this time my wife is mad as hell and I feel like the dum-ass of the year.
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Old 07-24-2015, 10:21 AM   #7
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Not wanting to sound like a butt. Would a surge protector caught this problem? Thanks Robert.
Three answsers I wil use Progressive Industries products

SS50P NO
PT-50C NO
HW-50C yes
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Old 07-24-2015, 10:36 AM   #8
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Three answsers I wil use Progressive Industries products



SS50P NO

PT-50C NO

HW-50C yes

Yes on PT-50C. Same capabilities as HW
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Old 07-24-2015, 04:31 PM   #9
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6 - finally check my plug - three loose wires
(Senior moment) - I only see two of the loose wires. The "White" neutral is short and I don't notice it.
Yep, this is what did it. Because of the open neutral, half of your coach experienced damaging high voltages. You MIGHT be lucky and only have some blown fuses on some equipment, but I fear that generally you are looking at replacing a bunch of burned up equipment.

The only way to know what needs replacing is to go through EVERY 120V powered device and fully check them out.

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8 - since I know the pedestal is good I put my plug directly into the pedestal.
Well, don't beat yourself up on this part: even if you had your portable unit plugged into the pedestal, it wouldn't have protected your coach from a faulty shore power cord. You still would've had the same issues. The only thing that would've protected you is a hard-wired unit, because that would've been installed after the faulty plug - a big reason I like hard-wired units, especially those that are installed after the transfer switch (because it protects from transfer switch and generator failures as well.) But even a hard-wired unit won't protect you from problems that occur after the unit.

However, you should still always use your portable EMS, even if you think the pedestal power is good. That's the other reason I like hard-wired, there's never the temptation that it's not needed "this one time." Wiring faults can still happen after you've plugged in, and high/low voltage can strike you at any time, well after you've plugged in.
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Old 07-24-2015, 04:34 PM   #10
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Yes on PT-50C. Same capabilities as HW
True in most cases, but not in this particular case. The problem was not in the campground pedestal, but in the shore cord that would've been plugged into the portable unit. No EMS unit is capable of protecting a rig from wiring faults that occur after the unit. For a portable unit, this includes the shore cord and plug.

So in this case, where the problem was an open neutral in the shore cord plug, a PT-50C would indeed not have protected the OP.
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Old 07-24-2015, 06:45 PM   #11
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True in most cases, but not in this particular case. The problem was not in the campground pedestal, but in the shore cord that would've been plugged into the portable unit. No EMS unit is capable of protecting a rig from wiring faults that occur after the unit. For a portable unit, this includes the shore cord and plug.



So in this case, where the problem was an open neutral in the shore cord plug, a PT-50C would indeed not have protected the OP.

Got that. Thanks. Pretty rare, unless the plug was put on after-market, me thinks.
Not easy to bust a return line in a stock plug, eh?
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Old 07-24-2015, 07:22 PM   #12
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Got that. Thanks. Pretty rare, unless the plug was put on after-market, me thinks.
You may be right, given how he states he "tightened" up the wires.

Quote:
Not easy to bust a return line in a stock plug, eh?

I've seen stock cords and extension cords where the jacketing is starting to separate from the plug, it wouldn't be too hard to imagine them fraying. Pretty rare, I agree. A more common trouble spot would be the connections in/out of the transfer switch, and the sliding contacts on a shore cord tell if there is one.
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