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Old 11-25-2012, 12:08 PM   #1
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Rear Towing Plug has no Brake input

Hello....I am towing a 20' enclosed trailer. I just replaced all the lights on the trailer with new LED fixtures. When I hook up my coach to it i get all the lights except the brake lights. I am getting the turn signals. The brake lights on the coach are on but not on the trailer. All other lights work. I have checked all the 12v fuses, including the brake light fuse. I used a meter and determined it is the feed to the plug from somewhere in the chassis fuse panel. My question is where is this plug wired from? Is it coming from the panel or is it from the rear lights themselves. I have not done a lot of running this down yet and was wondering if anyone else had this problem. Thanks for any help.
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Old 11-25-2012, 12:19 PM   #2
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Have you towed this trailer before? Do you have a brake controller inside the coach? If so take a test light and poke the blue wire and see if it lights up when the brake pedel is depressed and go from there.
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Old 11-25-2012, 12:37 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Skully View Post
Hello....I am towing a 20' enclosed trailer. I just replaced all the lights on the trailer with new LED fixtures. When I hook up my coach to it i get all the lights except the brake lights. I am getting the turn signals. The brake lights on the coach are on but not on the trailer. All other lights work. I have checked all the 12v fuses, including the brake light fuse. I used a meter and determined it is the feed to the plug from somewhere in the chassis fuse panel. My question is where is this plug wired from? Is it coming from the panel or is it from the rear lights themselves. I have not done a lot of running this down yet and was wondering if anyone else had this problem. Thanks for any help.
You're talking about brake lights, not the brakes themselves, right?

Question:
You say you replaced the trailer lights just now with all new LED's- did the old lights work before replacement?
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Old 11-25-2012, 03:13 PM   #4
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PH, no this is the first time with the coach. I have towed it with my Ford Trucks before and all the lights on the trailer are wired correctly. The "Brake Lights on the coach" work fine. There is no brake controller on the coach that i can see. I read the entire manual and it has no reference to one. It does reference not using an equalizing hitch but just the ball. I know that i am not getting the power at the "Brake Light Pin" on the plug of the coach.....meaning the pin inside the plug....I am getting power on the right and left turn signal pins based on the 6 pin wiring diagram. I am wondering if the plug is basically wired into the rear lights or has it's own fuse block.

2004 Winnebago Ultimate Freedom 40KD

Francesca, yes the lights worked before and I upgraded all lights to led (Clearance, brakes/turn, parking) which all work fine, meaning the LED light up great...except when I apply the coach brakes the brake lights on the trailer DO NOT work, but the brake lights on the coach work fine. I think there is probably a broken wire somewhere in the rear/engine bay....the only reason I assume this is because normally a plug does not have a separate fuse block....but this is my first coach.

Thanks for any information though...it's cold out so I don't want to crawl around under it right now...
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Old 11-25-2012, 03:22 PM   #5
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You say you have a 6-pin connection- the center pin on those is typically for brakes, not brake lights. Since you say you have no brake connection on the Rv, it's no surprise there's no juice at that pin.

The brake lights are on the turn pins...if your turn signals work they're getting power. Is it possible you installed the wrong type of fixture????

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Old 11-25-2012, 03:30 PM   #6
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Francesca, I have that correct plug on the coach....though your diagram is from the trailer end...but that aside, the Yellow and Green wires, LT and RT Turn/ Brakes only get power when I use the turn signals....BOTH pins do not get power when I hit the coach brakes.....so if i am getting the blinkers...you would think the brakes would come...that is why it is perplexing....thoughts?
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Old 11-25-2012, 03:33 PM   #7
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Your coach is still waiting for someone to locate and hook up a brake wire, it can just come from the brake lights on the rear of the coach if you just want brake lights or most of the time when towing a trailer or anything with brakes a brake controler is installed. Most late model coachs have a wire under the dash by the steering wheel and at the rear of the coach for this purpose. Being a 20' trailer I would guess two axles w/brakes? I had to wire mine up when I bought it. I did not have wires front and rear so this is what I bought so I did not have to run wires from front to rear, it works great and I am amazed how it works wireless.
http://www.etrailer.com/Brake-Contro...sha/90250.html
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Old 11-25-2012, 03:39 PM   #8
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What your saying is the wire for the electric trailer brakes....do you think they are really needed? I have heard with a 40000 lb coach and towing about 5k lbs (2 bikes and a car) i don't really need it. I do have electric brakes on the trailer. Weird about the brake lights though...as Fran pointed out the pins are the same it just as if they do not come on from the actuation of the brakes....Im hoping it warms up and I will crawl under there tomorrow and do some digging. Thanks
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Old 11-25-2012, 03:42 PM   #9
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Since you suspect the problem's with the coach, you might verify that by connecting the trailer lights to the Ford truck and see if the new lights work as the old ones did before.

I still suspect the new lights...but only from sad experience!
The motto around here is:
If something worked before I changed it but doesn't work now, I did something wrong during the change.

Since everything was fine/working before you put the new lights on, my suggestion is to go over every step/connection you took/made and see what if anything got missed.
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Old 11-25-2012, 04:13 PM   #10
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Yeah great idea. Unfortunately my truck is in Oregon and I am headed back to the house with this trailer....It worked all the way out to New Jersey....ill try to find a buddies around here to hook up to. Also when plugged into the coach ALL the other lights on the trailer work (Parking, Clearance and Turn Signals.... Yeah I suspect the coach because I do not see any voltage at the plug while applying the brakes. Which begs the question...if the two turn signal pins actually turn the brake lights on what make the turn signals "hold" or stay on with voltage all the time instead of blinking? I don't know that part of the equation.....and I suspect there must be something to signal to the turn signal pins how to override and stay lit up. Any ideas?
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Old 11-25-2012, 04:18 PM   #11
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If your coach has a separate brake/turn light, you'll need to install a converter that combines the signal. On all trailers, the brake/turn light is the same bulb but often not so on many newer cars, trucks, and coaches.
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Old 11-25-2012, 04:23 PM   #12
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With these bigger plugs(bigger than a 4 prong flat) your turn signals are seperate from the brake wires like on the smaller plugs. Ask how I learned about this: A long time ago my dad wanted to pull his 5th wheeler and I had the truck so I started the wiring job, everything worked great and on the road we were going, everything was going great till I went to turn on the turn signal to make a turn and you know by now what happened, jerk,jerk,jerk, everytime the light flashed it applied the brakes on that side. I'll bet if you pull the plug on the rear of your coach it will not have a wire on the brake terminal and if it does the other end of it is under the dash.
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Old 11-25-2012, 04:49 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Skully View Post
...if the two turn signal pins actually turn the brake lights on what make the turn signals "hold" or stay on with voltage all the time instead of blinking?
There's a switch in the TS switch assy on the column that opens the brake light circuit on the side that will now be the TS. As that open occurs, it closes the TS circuit and...blink-blink. After the TS switch goes to neutral, the brake circuit is restored.
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Old 11-25-2012, 05:26 PM   #14
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There's a switch in the TS switch assy on the column that opens the brake light circuit on the side that will now be the TS. As that open occurs, it closes the TS circuit and...blink-blink. After the TS switch goes to neutral, the brake circuit is restored.
I think this diagram/quote illustrates that point:

Quote:
The brake light switch sends power to the turn signal switch. If there’s power coming in from the brake switch and no power coming out to the brake light circuit the turn signal switch has an open and should be replaced.
Above info and more at this link: Brake light diagnosis
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