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10-27-2013, 12:00 PM
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#1
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Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Central Canada
Posts: 7
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Relay switch solenoid
I have had the battery relay solenoid replaced in Aug. and now can hear it with a high pitch whine. Have been plugged into 50 amp for five days now and it seems to be working fine. We have an 08 H/R Endeavour. Has anyone ever had this experience. This my first post but know we are going to really enjoy this fantastic site!
RayCin
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10-27-2013, 12:57 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Monaco Owners Club
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Angola State Prison - Murder
Posts: 4,230
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A solenoid does not whine. It only 'clunks' when connecting or disconnecting the two battery banks. I suspect you are hearing the converter or inverter.
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John & Clare Lyon
2007 43.5' Monaco Dynasty Palace III (All Electric)
Towd: 2011 Chevy Equinox
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10-27-2013, 01:12 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Gulf Streamers Club
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 19,925
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The whine is produced by 60 cycle 120 v AC. The battery solenoid works on 12 v DC and won't whine. It must be in your converter, inverter, or or some other AC source. Try turning off power at the pedestal then back on, see if it's still whining.
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Bob & Donna
'98 Gulf Stream Sun Voyager DP being pushed by a '00 Beetle TDI
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10-27-2013, 01:19 PM
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#4
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Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Central Canada
Posts: 7
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Ok thanks for your knowledge. I will try that when we get back to the coach !
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10-28-2013, 05:53 PM
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#5
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Senior Member
Damon Owners Club Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 24,024
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The O/P said "high pitched whine"
I will cover several possible sounds.
1: Humm (low pitched, just above 2-3 octaves BELOW middle C on your piano... AC humm. 3 octives is 55 HZ, 2 octaves 110 hz. (60 HZ full wave rectived) I would not call either of those HIGH PITCHED.
Alternator, Very high pitched, often over at the right side of the keyboard on the piano, 1,2,3, thousand HZ or more.
I would call that a high pitched whine.. However the solenoid should not make it, Most battery isolator solenoids have NO POWER on the coil except when changing state (Emergency start are different).
Finally we get contact hiss.. If the contacts are not doing well it can hiss like a snake.. This can be a HIGH PITCHED sound. And it's not good when it happens.
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Home is where I park it!
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10-28-2013, 07:11 PM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: FL
Posts: 11,402
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The isolator relay on the 08 Endeavor has full charging/battery voltage on the contacts when activated by the Bird circuit.
Look at the large solenoid that was replaced. There is a small white wire and a small purple/violet wire that controls it.
Disconnect the white wire and the solenoid should go clunk as it de-activates. If the humming goes away there you are. However, I suspect the noise is from the next door compartment to the left as you are facing the batteries. Inside is the converter/inverter.
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Certified Senior Electronic Technician, Telecommunications Engineer, Telecommunications repair Service Center Owner, Original owner HR 2008
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10-29-2013, 11:38 AM
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#7
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Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Central Canada
Posts: 7
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Yep that did it. Heard the clunk and whine stopped. I have put the white wire back on again. Do I assume then when solenoid closes next time we could have the same issue. I wonder if I got the one in a million faulty solenoid? Thanks YC1 and others for your help!
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10-29-2013, 03:14 PM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: FL
Posts: 11,402
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Try this. Switch the wires. Put the purple where the white is, white where the purple is.
Keep in mind the purple has voltage on it and will pop a fuse if it comes in contact with ground.
Try to NOT be touching the wires when they contact the connection,. You can get a harmless jolt from the relay energizing.
If it still buzzes then replace it.
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Certified Senior Electronic Technician, Telecommunications Engineer, Telecommunications repair Service Center Owner, Original owner HR 2008
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10-29-2013, 05:01 PM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,920
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I posted this recently on the Monaco forum. I had some issues with my isolator circuit. First problem was a cheap relay had failed ($6 to replace) that let both the BIRD and boost switch on the dash activate the Big Boy Isolator Relay.
With the thing working again I had some funny meter readings. When doing nothing I have about 8v on the activation wire into the Big Boy, and when it is activated by the BIRD I have about 3v. The documentation calls for 12v and 6 amps to activate. This seemed REALLY odd to me so I called the Intellitec support line for RVs. Turns out this is MM RV Electronics in Ohio City.
Chris (the person I spoke to) was very helpful. When you press the boost switch it sends 6 amps and 12v to the Big Boy as long as you hold down the boost switch. There will be no humming but you will hear a big clunk as the relay closes. If you keep the boost switch depressed more than 30 seconds you will burn out the electromagnet that closes your Big Boy. The ones used in our coaches are NOT the latching model (referred to as a Big Boy Battery Disconnect Relay by Intellitec and with a different part number but identical to look at) and you can't just substitute a latching model if you use a BIRD unit to control it.
When the BIRD unit decides to activate the Big Boy it first sends 12v and 6 amps for a fraction of a second to cause the relay to close (big burst of power to activate the electromagnet), then it begins modulating the voltage and current to keep the relay closed but avoid burning out the electromagnet. This is the loud humming noise we hear. It is NOT the Big Boy, it is the BIRD unit. If you have a meter on the inputs to the Big Boy when the BIRD unit fires it you will see a spike of 12v, then 3v to 4v. At the same time you will see a difference in voltage across the high current connections drop to zero as the relay closes and the voltages are equalized.
None of this is described in either the non-latching Big Boy or BIRD documentation. The humming is normal as are the strange voltage readings (strange until you know what is really going on).
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Paul
2006 Patriot Thunder C13 Allison 4000
2010 Ford Flex Ecoboost AWD
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10-30-2013, 05:55 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: FL
Posts: 11,402
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Distaff, that is excellent information. Can you tell us the year model please.
This does not apply to the 08 Endeavor. It holds the relay in at full battery voltage. No modulation circuit involved. The relay draws 1.5 amps and can get extremely hot to the touch.
As you suggest though the "buzzing" has caused some concern and has been addressed before. I suspect they moved away from the design because of the complaints and the existing system is less complicated.
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Certified Senior Electronic Technician, Telecommunications Engineer, Telecommunications repair Service Center Owner, Original owner HR 2008
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10-30-2013, 05:51 PM
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#11
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Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Central Canada
Posts: 7
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I switched purple and white wires about six hrs ago and can hear a very low guiet hum/whine. Nothing like before. Should these wires be put back where they were? White was on left side of solenoid. Reading Distaff note reminded me however last June when I had the coach in to check our new toad's wiring work, the house batteries were dead after sitting only a month. They were new batteries the previous Feb. The tech checked voltage on the solenoid switch and said it was not drawing like it should( I think he said only 3-4 volts) and recommended I change the solenoid. Mmm, ours is an 08 Endevour. Again thanks for all your valuable info! I have much to learn but am game for it as we love this life style so much. Meeting so many knew great people like on this forum !
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10-30-2013, 06:29 PM
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#12
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: FL
Posts: 11,402
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No need to switch the wires back but measure the voltage across the them please.
You should see full battery voltage.
If you measure lower then place the negative lead of your voltmeter on one of the batteries and the positive on the purple then the white and report those numbers.
The white wire should be zero volts. If it is anything above that follow it and fix that connection.
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Certified Senior Electronic Technician, Telecommunications Engineer, Telecommunications repair Service Center Owner, Original owner HR 2008
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11-02-2013, 06:30 PM
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#13
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Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Central Canada
Posts: 7
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Just got back to coach and tested as you suggested . White to purple shows 3.4. Purple to battery 3.4 - 3.6. Purple to battery about the same. White to battery 0 . Our coach was built in Oct/07. Maybe they were still wiring this area as the other poster had suggested? House Batteries are testing just over 6.
RayCin
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11-02-2013, 07:18 PM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: FL
Posts: 11,402
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RayCin
Just got back to coach and tested as you suggested . White to purple shows 3.4. Purple to battery 3.4 - 3.6. Purple to battery about the same. White to battery 0 . Our coach was built in Oct/07. Maybe they were still wiring this area as the other poster had suggested? House Batteries are testing just over 6.
RayCin
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House Batteries at 6 volts????
Those should be 12.5 or more.
Time to start from scratch on this one.
Find a clean shiny ground spot and use that for ground. Measure the voltage on the negative post of the battery and then on the positive post. Then remove the cables one at a time and clean and tighten them securely.
Be sure to write down the measurement because it is too easy to forget after taking several.
__________________
Certified Senior Electronic Technician, Telecommunications Engineer, Telecommunications repair Service Center Owner, Original owner HR 2008
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