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Old 01-17-2016, 07:44 AM   #1
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Lightbulb S-cams rusted poor braking clunking

Last trip I felt the brake power a bit off and noticed I was getting that loud clunking noise more often.

I tackled the fronts first, this is a 2000 with less than 50,000 miles.

Shoes looked great, the main spring was badly rusted, the cams were completely rusted and not capable of turning, the pivot or hinge pins were rusted.
the cams also had flat spots.

got the part numbers from FL, called Napa had them the next day, less than $10 a wheel for the kits.

I popped the main spring removed the shoes, used a small wire wheel on a drill to clean up the the contact points on those.

Replaced the hinge pins & sleeves lubed with high temp grease.

Used wire wheel on the Scam itself, they were tight up/down in/out.
Grease the s-cam Zerks and auto adjust arm.

two new springs on that side of the shoes, next the main spring that was a bit tricky but doable with help holding things in place.

Next new cams, they DO NOT get grease on the roller bearing surface only the edges in contact with shoe.

Take a look at old & new parts.

I rolled down the RV lot a bit stopped hit the self adjusters 6 times hard.

No more noise, stops on dime.

Hardest part was the wheels, I used a hand truck to get them moved around I also used it for the brake drums.

The front drums are about 50#, the rears maybe 80#, the hand truck saved my back.

I think this greasing of the cams & other bake parts should be done on some sort of regular maintenance schedule.

Total time 90 minutes a wheel

Note on the rears the book says to lock out the emergency brake, called caging, not a big deal.
But a shop said just leave the engine running to maintain air pressure for 45 minutes or so while changing the parts out, that worked fine.
I had the sets of wheel chocks on. 4 jack stands and an extra jack when doing the rears.
2 jack stands for fronts
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Old 01-17-2016, 09:20 AM   #2
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Great write up! Thanks. But 90 minutes for each wheel? Does that include removing and installing the wheel? If so you are indeed good Shoot anymore it take me 90 minutes just to get my tools out!

I see you used a hand truck to move the tires around. I bought a truck tire dolly years ago and that is the best invention ever. I can lift, move, rotate the tire to align the holes, and slip it on easily.
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Old 01-17-2016, 09:36 AM   #3
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yes 90min includes taking tires off/on, I had a helper.

That tool is great, but the hand truc really wasn't bad (and I had one)
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Old 01-17-2016, 09:54 AM   #4
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What did you use to get the lug nuts off?
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Old 01-17-2016, 10:03 AM   #5
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33mm deep socket (off amazon)
3/4 drive 24" breaker bar with a 5' pipe extension for first turn to get loose.
I also smeared a bit of grease on the threads first, so the rest of the turns were easier.

After I finished I just made all the lugs tight with the 24" breaker bar.

I'm going to drive a few miles up the road to a truck stop and have them hit them all with an impact.
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Old 01-17-2016, 10:25 AM   #6
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As a bus mechanic for many years using grease on brake parts is a no no. If you use anything it should have been NEVER SEIZE. Never seize will not melt as grease will, even high temp grease. Brakes get alot hotter than people think.
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Old 01-17-2016, 10:27 AM   #7
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Great work Jimbo. The first year I owned my coach I drove it to Freightliner Gaffney to get it serviced and attend Camp Freightliner. On the drive there I started experiencing the symptoms you described. The brakes seemed to be working fine but right before it came to a complete stop I would feel something give and clunk. Freightliner found rusted S Cams and the like. Freightliner in Gaffney in my opinion is very fair and honest on their labor charges. Really hard to find a shop like that. That being said it was no small task to complete that job so my hat is off to you for tackling that and getting it done. I don't have the tools or the work space to complete such a task but it's great to see owners such as yourself taking care of business. I would say you saved $1000 or more depending on which shop was doing the work and they may have cut corners where you know exactly how everything looks now. Great job!
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Old 01-17-2016, 10:29 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jergeod View Post
As a bus mechanic for many years using grease on brake parts is a no no. If you use anything it should have been NEVER SEIZE. Never seize will not melt as grease will, even high temp grease. Brakes get alot hotter than people think.
My error, I did use high temp never seize, the grey/silver stuff
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Old 01-17-2016, 10:32 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noserider View Post
I would say you saved $1000 or more depending on which shop was doing the work and they may have cut corners where you know exactly how everything looks now. Great job!
Thanks, $1,000, now I can tell my wife to pick restaurant tonite
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Old 01-17-2016, 01:30 PM   #10
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Thumbs up great job.
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Old 01-17-2016, 03:33 PM   #11
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Greasing the S cam is mentioned in the maintenance schedule for my Spartan chassis. I forgot the interval now though.
With air brakes you don't need to drive it to activate the automatic slack adjusters, just pressure, (Spartan says 100# pressure) as it works on travel distance of the push-rod. Bendix Air Brake Handbook
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Old 01-17-2016, 03:54 PM   #12
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Correct you don't need to drive it, I drove it few hundred yards to seat everything, remember the lugs weren't torqued to 450 at that time.

Not sure about Sparten, but everything I read and studied on U-tube said no lube
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Old 01-17-2016, 06:10 PM   #13
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Nice work Jimbo,
I did the same exact thing, a couple of years ago. I did not replace any parts due to the fact that mine were grungy and ugly but, serviceable. I did pretty much almost everything you did in cleaning things up, making sure the springs were serviceable and all other related parts. I then put a dab of grease (yes Grease, high temp stuff but, non the less, GREASE) on the specific contact points.

NO, grease was not spread all over the place, ONLY where it was important. I might add, that operation was done, like stated, two to three years and, several thousand miles ago and all is still working flawlessly.

Now, as for breaking them loose, if you're going to continue to do this kind of work, I'd invest in an outstanding tool that I and a few others have purchased on here. If you haven't heard or seen of it, it's called a Torque Multiplier. Now, that term can be applied to a couple of versions. The one I bought off Ebay is a crank type that's geared 75:1 and I can sit on my butt and, actually break free, all 10, 33MM, 450 lb. lug nuts, WITH ONE ARM!!

It's a great tool. Absolute ZERO strain in using it. If I were to use it in reverse, that is install those lug nuts with it, I could actually break the lug stud with it. But, for re-torqueing them, I purchased a 150-600 lb. Proto, 3/4" drive Torque wrench. I got that off Ebay too, for $75.00 and it also works flawlessly.

As for handling those 160 lb. tires and wheels, I use the tool that's shown above. That tire/wheel dolly is priceless in that situation.

Anyway, when it was all said and done, I re-adjusted the slack adjusters and, my brakes also stopped that 27,000 coach on a dime. And, WITH NO CLUNK.
Scott



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Old 08-03-2016, 09:09 AM   #14
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Exclamation How urgent is this?

I've had a "clunk" from front end when coming to a stop for a while now. We're heading down the "Highway" from AK to Portland in 5 days. If my problem is the S cams, do I need to tackle it before this trip or can it wait until we get down to Oregon? How hard is it to pull the brake drums - do they have to be knocked loose with a BFH?
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