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Old 06-08-2011, 06:27 AM   #43
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Thanks for all the info. I decided to go with a 30amp portable from progressive for my winnebago vista. Hopefully no one walks off with it...
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Old 06-08-2011, 07:18 AM   #44
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Surge capacity for the TRC Surge Guard Model 34750 50 Amp is 1750 Joules.

Surge capacity for the Progressive EMS-HW50C is 3580 Joules.

Neither will fully protect you from a direct lightning strike!!

The major difference between the two that I have found is the response time if a power surge event were to happen. The speed with which the unit can detect and disconnect your coach from the shore power will determine how much damage will be done in those critical seconds. The Progressive unit has a response time of less than one nanosecond whereas the TRC unit does not publish its data and when asked, they were not able to tell me anything except that it has 1750 Joules rating for surge. The other difference is the Progressive unit will tell you that an electrical surge has occurred whereas the TRC does not other than possibly it won't work correctly anymore.

Each unit will detect high and low voltage, open neutrals, open ground, reverse polarity, etc.

Everyone can make their own decision as to which one to purchase however, the most important decision you can make is to BUY one before any expensive damage happens to your coach.

My Progressive unit recently shut me down due to a Low Frequency situation during a very severe rain storm where a nearby transformer was struck by lightning. The power company came out and replaced the lightning suppressor on one side of the transformer, replaced the fuse and the meter all of which was damaged from the lightning strike.

Nothing was damaged inside the coach. Thank you Progressive.

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Old 06-08-2011, 09:12 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by AFChap View Post
It would be much more helpful if you would share what definition of "surge capacity" you are using, perhaps whose definition that is, and the capabilities of each product ... ie SHOW us the facts you are refering to.

All I know is that my SurgeGuard has cut power many times due to high or low voltage, etc and has never failed me over 7 years of use ...unless you want to count the lightning strike when I still received far less damage than rigs around me. Can any such product successfully handle a lightning strike?
Hi Paul,
As I said, my comment is not to start a product war but simply state a fact. I have said many times that any surge protection is better than none. Many members have asked in the past which surge protection is better, or which surge protection unit they should they purchase.


If you look at the specifications of each unit you'll notice the “Joule” rating. The rating indicates how much energy the unit is capable of passing.


In the Progressive industries unit Metal Oxide Varisters(MOV's) are used to provide this protection. An MOV is basically a variable resistor with one end connected to a live leg and the other to ground. As the voltage rises on the incoming live legs the resistance of the MOV's decrease until the surge voltage reaches a point where the MOV looks like a short circuit and the surge is safely dissipated to to ground. When the varister senses the voltage returning to normal the resistance begins to increase and block normal load current. This process is measured in nanoseconds and well under the trip threshold of the pedestal main breaker. Since the magnitude of a surge is dependent on voltage and current over time, the varister must be capable of passing the surge current which is described as the joule rating. The higher the joule rating number the more protection you have against stronger surges.


I can't help but think if you had a Progressive Industries unit when you experienced your lightning strike that you would have had no damage as a result. I also wonder if the cost to repair the minor damage would have offset the cost differential of the Progressive Industries unit.


To answer you last question, “Can any such product successfully handle a lightning strike? There is no product that can handle a direct lightning strike. You only need to look at the damage to a tree that has been struck by lightning. The only solution you have is to purchase the best device you can afford and compare it to what you can afford to lose.


The following is taken from the specification of the Surge Guard 50 amp Hardwired Unit.
  • Mis-wired Pedestal
  • Power Surges
  • Low (<102V) and High (>132V) Voltage
  • Reverse Polarity
  • Dangerous Current on Ground Wire
  • Caution indicator light to indicate cause of power stoppage. 2 minute 16 second reset delay protects AC compressor
  • 1750 Joules
The following is taken from the specifications of the Progressive Industries 50 amp Hardwire Surge Protector EMS-HW50C.



5 Mode surge protection: This feature provides full surge protection L-N, L-N, L-G, L-G, L-L, and N-G. Total Joule rating is 3640, response time of <1 nano second.
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Old 06-08-2011, 09:44 AM   #46
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Hi Paul,
The higher the joule rating number the more protection you have against stronger surges.
From "Surge Protector" Wiki:

The joule rating is a commonly-quoted but very misleading parameter for comparing surge protectors.

Counter-intuitively, a lower number may indicate longer life expectancy if the device can divert more energy elsewhere and thus will need to absorb less energy. In other words, a protective device offering a lower clamping voltage while diverting the same surge current will cause more of the surge energy to be dissipated elsewhere in the system. Better protectors exceed peak ratings of 1000 joules and 40,000 amperes. It is often claimed that a lower joule rating is undersized protection, since the total energy in harmful spikes can be significantly larger than this. However, if properly installed, for every joule absorbed by a protector, another 4 to 30 joules may be dissipated harmlessly into ground. A MOV-based protector with a higher let-through voltage can receive a higher joule rating, even though it lets more surge energy through to the device to be protected.
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Old 06-08-2011, 11:03 AM   #47
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And to think I bought my Progressive EMS-HW50C just because of the remote feature
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Old 06-08-2011, 11:06 AM   #48
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From "Surge Protector" Wiki:

The joule rating is a commonly-quoted but very misleading parameter for comparing surge protectors.

Counter-intuitively, a lower number may indicate longer life expectancy if the device can divert more energy elsewhere and thus will need to absorb less energy. In other words, a protective device offering a lower clamping voltage while diverting the same surge current will cause more of the surge energy to be dissipated elsewhere in the system. Better protectors exceed peak ratings of 1000 joules and 40,000 amperes. It is often claimed that a lower joule rating is undersized protection, since the total energy in harmful spikes can be significantly larger than this. However, if properly installed, for every joule absorbed by a protector, another 4 to 30 joules may be dissipated harmlessly into ground. A MOV-based protector with a higher let-through voltage can receive a higher joule rating, even though it lets more surge energy through to the device to be protected.
You will have to excuse me if I don't consider “Wiki” as an authoritative source of technical information since anybody can post anything to it without technical review. But assuming it is correct, what parameter would you use to determine which device is better? Should we throw out all the specifications and make our decision by cost? Or which manufacturer has the better name? Or who's been in business the longest? I agree that some specifications can and are manipulated and knowing that makes our research even more difficult.


My post compares two existing products based on their published specifications which you can purchased today. You speak about better protectors. If you know of one and it can be installed in an RV or hung from a power pedestal please post it so it can be considered.
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Old 06-08-2011, 06:10 PM   #49
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You will have to excuse me if I don't consider “Wiki” as an authoritative source of technical information since anybody can post anything to it without technical review. But assuming it is correct, what parameter would you use to determine which device is better? Should we throw out all the specifications and make our decision by cost? Or which manufacturer has the better name? Or who's been in business the longest? I agree that some specifications can and are manipulated and knowing that makes our research even more difficult.


My post compares two existing products based on their published specifications which you can purchased today. You speak about better protectors. If you know of one and it can be installed in an RV or hung from a power pedestal please post it so it can be considered.
Are you an electrician or an electrical engineer?
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Old 06-09-2011, 02:06 PM   #50
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I bought this unit ssp-50 for
Now then depending how long I keep the unit I can always are a permanent one.
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Old 06-09-2011, 03:12 PM   #51
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How many joules are equal to1 second? That may help us regular folks to understand how to compare the time needed for the surge protectors to trip. And, how much time is needed to fry a microwave, TV, etc.?
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Old 06-09-2011, 09:53 PM   #52
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How many joules are equal to1 second? That may help us regular folks to understand how to compare the time needed for the surge protectors to trip. And, how much time is needed to fry a microwave, TV, etc.?
Beats me. That's why I quoted Wiki. I thought the Moderator had the expertise, but apparently not. I sure don't.

Without an electronics background, how can you claim one model is better than another?

You'll get "educated" guesses and "I own one and like it" comments. Like kicking tires.
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Old 06-09-2011, 10:00 PM   #53
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Just installed today a hardwired TRC bought through the internet. Easy to put into the electric compartment with a few tools including a hack saw. Have not test it out yet.
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