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Old 12-30-2010, 05:15 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Pairajays View Post
Midniteoyl,

Yea, that's what my icon looks like. That's a lot of info to understand and follow. My tires have been replaced and rotated several times. Sounds like something should been done to calibrate the system each time. I'm not going to worry about it.

Jim E
I'm thinking that yours are still ok battery wise since you'll get an error message (constant lit light) if they werent. I'm also thinking that yours is an older system that does NOT actually 'know' which tire its in and only transmits the pressure. If ones low, your light will come on with no indication of which tire is low.. (I believe.. dont know your system directly, only Audi's)
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Old 12-30-2010, 06:18 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by allynne View Post
Craig,

As stated before that is the biggest bunch of nonsense I have ever read even on this site.

Good luck!

Al Sawyer
'05 MADP
Your personal opinion has been noted.

I took the time to describe the advantages and simplicity of real-time pressure monitoring. Too bad you won't say why you disagree.

With all due respect, I think you'll need the luck.

Cheers.
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Old 12-30-2010, 06:39 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Craig1959 View Post
...
You speak like someone without a TPMS. You should get one. Within a few days of driving you will be able to record the information that manufacturers will not normally provide. You will quickly learn what the normal warm temperature relative to the published cold temperature.

Think! Why do manufacturers tell you to NOT bleed warm air? They're afraid that you will bleed down to the published cold temperature and then end up under-inflated when your tires eventually cool down.

When I bleed warm air, I bleed down to the normal warm temperature that I have observed hundreds of times in the past.


...
I have a TST TPMS system monitoring all of my tires. I use it as it is intended, to MONITOR my pressures. I watch for any sudden loss in pressure or rise in temperature. Two indicators that something is wrong. If this were to happen, I'd pull over and deal with the issues. NOT bleed air.

This entire deal you've thought up about bleeding air down to some empirically observed "warm" pressure is nonsense. If you've observed these "warm" pressures and they are consistent, why are you bleeding air? Shouldn't you just be at your "warm" pressure? You've made all sorts of unsubstantiated assumptions about what the pressures should be when warm. As I stated earlier, if and when tire manufactures ever provide complex pressure/tire temperature/load CURVES and there is a computer driven system that could keep the pressures along that CURVE, then MAYBE some of your thoughts on warm tire pressures will be remotely valid. Again, that is assuming your entire premise that the pressure needs to be adjusted at all is valid. How do you know that the tire isn't designed to just increase in pressure (as it does) when it warms up. Maybe that extra pressure is needed and accounted for in the design of the tire.

I just hope I'm not ever behind you on the road.

BTW, if I ever see a Patent on the system I just described, I coming after you
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Old 12-30-2010, 06:45 PM   #46
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Except that the most common TPMS's in use on cars/light trucks usually only tell you if you are >25% out of range.
So these tires were significantly out of range? What's your point?
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Old 12-30-2010, 06:51 PM   #47
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So these tires were significantly out of range? What's your point?
Brain fart... for some reason I thought you quoted a different post..
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Old 12-30-2010, 08:22 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by Craig1959 View Post
Your personal opinion has been noted.

I took the time to describe the advantages and simplicity of real-time pressure monitoring. Too bad you won't say why you disagree.

With all due respect, I think you'll need the luck.

Cheers.
With all due respect, after all, you do have 12 patents (what are they, by the way?), you have offered nothing but opinions. No facts. No references to any publication. While, on the other hand, other posters have cited specific guidelines by tire companies.

Can you provide more convincing evidence to support your rather unorthodox opinions? And, can you tell us all, since you brought it up, what your 12 patents consist of?

Don, who is doubtful.
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Old 12-30-2010, 09:12 PM   #49
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I have a TST TPMS system monitoring all of my tires. I use it as it is intended, to MONITOR my pressures. I watch for any sudden loss in pressure or rise in temperature. Two indicators that something is wrong. If this were to happen, I'd pull over and deal with the issues. NOT bleed air.

This entire deal you've thought up about bleeding air down to some empirically observed "warm" pressure is nonsense. If you've observed these "warm" pressures and they are consistent, why are you bleeding air? Shouldn't you just be at your "warm" pressure? You've made all sorts of unsubstantiated assumptions about what the pressures should be when warm. As I stated earlier, if and when tire manufactures ever provide complex pressure/tire temperature/load CURVES and there is a computer driven system that could keep the pressures along that CURVE, then MAYBE some of your thoughts on warm tire pressures will be remotely valid. Again, that is assuming your entire premise that the pressure needs to be adjusted at all is valid. How do you know that the tire isn't designed to just increase in pressure (as it does) when it warms up. Maybe that extra pressure is needed and accounted for in the design of the tire.
You adjust pressure to achieve the following goals:

a) Maintain adequate load carrying capacity.
b) Reduce tire wear.
c) Improve gas mileage.
d) Get the best ride possible.

Improper tire pressure is generally orthogonal to all of these goals.

Anytime the outdoor temperature rises more than 30F while driving, you will end up running at higher than optimal pressure. You can generally ignore this situation but there is no good reason to run with higher pressure than is necessary. Doing so increases tire wear, lowers gas mileage and negatively impacts your ride. And if the pressure gets high enough, it reduces load capacity.

You may prefer to not bleed air - that's fine. But maintaining correct pressure after a significant outdoor temperature change is always better than ignoring it. I am curious. Why do you insist what I am doing is wrong? Some of you have used much stronger language than that without specifically saying what you object to. Now's your chance to share your wisdom.

I choose to bleed air in these situations to get a more comfortable ride, better gas mileage, reduce wear and maintain optimum load capacity. My TPMS confirms that my pressure reduction was correct when I begin driving again. As such, it is entirely safe and certainly recommended for F-53 chassis owners who understand the definition of 'rough ride'. By doing nothing, what do you get? Less comfortable ride, poorer gas mileage, increased tread wear and less than optimal carrying capacity which increases the risk of a blow out. Why is the 'do nothing method' better again?

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I just hope I'm not ever behind you on the road.
You may consider my method unnecessary or superfluous but maintaining correct pressure is always safer and better for your tires than doing nothing. To suggest otherwise is just hogwash.

Personally, I would like to sell you tires. You will need a lot more of them than me in the years to come.

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BTW, if I ever see a Patent on the system I just described, I coming after you
Fear not. I only seek patents for good ideas.
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Old 12-30-2010, 09:18 PM   #50
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You can generally ignore this situation but there is no good reason to run with higher pressure than is necessary. Doing so increases tire wear, lowers gas mileage and negatively impacts your ride. And if the pressure gets high enough, it reduces load capacity.
You said that twice in that post... Please, how does higher pressures lower the mileage while reducing rolling resistance?
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Old 12-30-2010, 09:27 PM   #51
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"orthogonal", wow.

Jim E
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Old 12-30-2010, 09:40 PM   #52
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You said that twice in that post... Please, how does higher pressures lower the mileage while reducing rolling resistance?
Stay on topic my friend. The question at hand is: Why is it better to run at improper tire pressure when you don't have to?

Rolling resistance is increased with under-inflation but is reduced with over- inflation. My bad. I should have been more careful distinguishing over and under-inflation since some of you apparently find this point to be critical.

As more sensible statement is: Increased wear and risk of blowout increases with pressure. Fuel economy improves marginally until tire failure occurs.

Thanks for helping to clarify this important issue.
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Old 12-30-2010, 09:43 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by Craig1959 View Post
You adjust pressure to achieve the following goals:

a) Maintain adequate load carrying capacity.
b) Reduce tire wear.
c) Improve gas mileage.
d) Get the best ride possible.

Improper tire pressure is generally orthogonal to all of these goals.

Anytime the outdoor temperature rises more than 30F while driving, you will end up running at higher than optimal pressure. You can generally ignore this situation but there is no good reason to run with higher pressure than is necessary. Doing so increases tire wear, lowers gas mileage and negatively impacts your ride. And if the pressure gets high enough, it reduces load capacity.

You may prefer to not bleed air - that's fine. But maintaining correct pressure after a significant outdoor temperature change is always better than ignoring it. I am curious. Why do you insist what I am doing is wrong? Some of you have used much stronger language than that without specifically saying what you object to. Now's your chance to share your wisdom.

I choose to bleed air in these situations to get a more comfortable ride, better gas mileage, reduce wear and maintain optimum load capacity. My TPMS confirms that my pressure reduction was correct when I begin driving again. As such, it is entirely safe and certainly recommended for F-53 chassis owners who understand the definition of 'rough ride'. By doing nothing, what do you get? Less comfortable ride, poorer gas mileage, increased tread wear and less than optimal carrying capacity which increases the risk of a blow out. Why is the 'do nothing method' better again?


You may consider my method unnecessary or superfluous but maintaining correct pressure is always safer and better for your tires than doing nothing. To suggest otherwise is just hogwash.

Personally, I would like to sell you tires. You will need a lot more of them than me in the years to come.



Fear not. I only seek patents for good ideas.
As I thought. Blow hard. No facts. Only unsubstantiated ludicrous opinions.

I am always anxious to learn. However, there is nothing to learn in this thread anymore.

Good Night Irene.

Don
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Old 12-30-2010, 09:49 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by Craig1959 View Post
You adjust pressure to achieve the following goals:

...
Anytime the outdoor temperature rises more than 30F while driving, you will end up running at higher than optimal pressure. You can generally ignore this situation but there is no good reason to run with higher pressure than is necessary. Doing so increases tire wear, lowers gas mileage and negatively impacts your ride. And if the pressure gets high enough, it reduces load capacity.

...[/i]
This is my issue with your method. You have NO actual data as to what that "optimal" warm pressure is. You are making unsubstantiated guesses as to what that pressure is. The only real data is that given by the tire manufactures and they only give COLD pressures and specifically state NOT to bleed air from a warm tire. Why do you think you know that a given warm pressure is too high? That is the utter nonsense of your plan. You have no real data to make that decision. The people who make the tire tell you to put x pressure in cold. Nothing else. Any other "data" you claim you have is based on un-scientific assumptions and wild guesses. That is the danger in your plan. Sure you may get a softer ride, but you have no real idea that the "warm" pressure you adjusted to isn't too little. You just don't know and MY wild, unsubstantiated guess is you're wrong on the low side. My guess is as valid/not valid as yours. To suggest that others follow your wild guesses is just crazy.
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Old 12-30-2010, 09:51 PM   #55
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thanks, i guess i'll be adding air to the tires before i leave. thanks again

Smart move
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Old 12-30-2010, 10:37 PM   #56
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Stay on topic my friend. The question at hand is: Why is it better to run at improper tire pressure when you don't have to?

Rolling resistance is increased with under-inflation but is reduced with over- inflation. My bad. I should have been more careful distinguishing over and under-inflation since some of you apparently find this point to be critical.
I was... in the context that you posted:
Quote:
I choose to bleed air in these situations to get a more comfortable ride, better gas mileage, reduce wear and maintain optimum load capacity.
Again.. In this context, you bleed warm air to gain better mileage.

Now, if more pressure handles more weight, how does reducing the pressure 'maintain optimum load capacity'?
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