Community Forums

Warm Heart - Cold Feet · 03-22-2005, 05:29 PM

We're preparing to purchase our first diesel pusher. We're looking at the 2005 40' Beaver Monterey (Laguna IV) and the 2005 40' Alpine Limited (FDQS). The Beaver has a Caterpillar C-9 400-hp engine, 1100 lbs/ft torque, 8.8 litre, and a Pac Brake. The Alpine has a Cummins 8.9 litre ISL Pegasus 400-hp engine, 1200 lbs/ft torque w/Jacobs 2 Stage Compression Brake.
We (with no experience) would like to hear opinions/comments from those of you with experience! Any general remarks regarding Beaver vs Alpine would be also much appreciated.

Warm Heart - Cold Feet · 03-22-2005, 05:29 PM

We're preparing to purchase our first diesel pusher. We're looking at the 2005 40' Beaver Monterey (Laguna IV) and the 2005 40' Alpine Limited (FDQS). The Beaver has a Caterpillar C-9 400-hp engine, 1100 lbs/ft torque, 8.8 litre, and a Pac Brake. The Alpine has a Cummins 8.9 litre ISL Pegasus 400-hp engine, 1200 lbs/ft torque w/Jacobs 2 Stage Compression Brake.
We (with no experience) would like to hear opinions/comments from those of you with experience! Any general remarks regarding Beaver vs Alpine would be also much appreciated.

Don (W5IT) · 03-23-2005, 01:07 AM

Boy howdy can that question get folks talking!

Anyway I'll throw my two-cents worth in.....

As far as the deceleration factor between the Jake and the pac brakes. The two stage Jake on the Cummins will win hands down.

On the acceleration side of the coin...... The Cat will be quicker "Off the line". But the CUmmins will be stronger at the mid and high end of the spectrum. Kinda like a "Quarter horse" verses a "Thorough bred" type of thing.

Don't get me wrong, the Cat is no slouch at highway/cruise speed. It just seems the Cummins has "Longer legs" so to speak.

I like both. The Cat for the low end get up and get after it. But I also like the two stage jake and long legs of the Cummins.

Either one are fine pieces of equipment. A TOUGH decision to be making.

RV Wizard · 03-23-2005, 01:50 AM

Don has given the best comparison I have heard of yet of these two engines. I would recommend you visit the Owners section for info on the Alpine and I am sure you can get some good info here for the Beaver. Good luck in your decision, take your time and enjoy the hunt.

RustyJC · 03-23-2005, 05:32 AM

Both are good engines, and Don has given a good comparison. One of these manufacturers has a reputation (deserved or not) as being somewhat pricier on repair parts should they be required - I'll leave it at that and let you do some comparison shopping for a market basket of parts at each engine's dealer. I wouldn't turn down an excellent deal on either coach based on which of these 2 engines is used, however.

Boy, I wish I were having to make this decision!

Rusty

Don (W5IT) · 03-23-2005, 07:38 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">One of these manufacturers has a reputation (deserved or not) as being somewhat pricier on repair parts should they be required </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'll TOUCH on the parts price subject in a "Round About" way.

CAT parts are not available from as many sources as the CUMMINS parts. Therefore many times the parts are only available from a CAT dealership. Soooooooooooooooooooooooo

Cummins seems to have more "Authorized Service Centers" that are convenient to a owner. Also many places where parts can be obtained.

Cummins also has a 24 hr phone number you can call as well. I have used this number a couple times at some STRANGE hours when a customer had a problem with one of our rental coaches. Each and every time Cummins has come through with flying colors.

In one incident a computer module problem wound up burning three of the six pistons in a 300-ISC. Cummins replaced the whole short block at no cost. (Total bill was around $12,000.00)

SO there is my "Around the world" answer to the parts availability/price issue.

RustyJC · 03-23-2005, 07:52 AM

You're a brave man, Mr. Fauntleroy!!

Thanks!!

Rusty

Warm Heart - Cold Feet · 03-24-2005, 08:48 AM

This is VERY HELPFUL information. Thank you so much!

DriVer · 03-25-2005, 04:01 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Cummins seems to have more "Authorized Service Centers" that are convenient to a owner. Also many places where parts can be obtained. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>I just wanted to add that when you buy that new motorhome you might want to specify both the Cummins (engine) and Onan (generator). Both can be serviced in the same facility. I've been passing a lot of Cummins/Onan Service Centers in my travels.

Bushman512003 · 03-25-2005, 04:42 PM

Hands down Cummins

Wingding · 03-26-2005, 01:24 PM

Wow! This must be some sort of qusi-moto sort of dream.
I have been at a dealership in Arizona for 6 weeks and one day. I had come to pick up a 40'alpine 2005 quad slide.
The company was under seige and the poor service manager needed a break. I said basically put me at the end of the line and do not worry about me.
I was and never am in a rush.
Well, I have had the opportunity to see many different companies and tour and examine the different coach's.I have a opportunity {because of the situation} to opt for a different coach.
After careful observation and alot of secrutiny,
I have much to offer, and a terrible tough choice to make.
Basically, I like in no particular order.....Travel supreme/Alpine/Beaver Monterey.
Now, for reasons, of non-availibility and question marks on the wood 2x4 plating, I have had to rule out the travel supreme. This is not to say that the construction practice is successful or not but the fact that I just do not know plus the fact that the dealership does not have a steady line on them.
I have two choices and must make a decision in I am estimating 1 week.
Alpine/Monterey... After 3 weeks of picking them apart,this is what I see.
From the wheels to the frame, Alpine.....From the floor to the roof, Monterey.
Their is no doubt that the inside of the monterey is carefully done in a strong way.
Look at the ceramic tile.... The craftsmanship of the wood.The Galley set up. The finer grade corian countertops.I like that sink a whole lot.

Sit down at your kitchen table..........On the Alpine , you tend to hit you head on the ceiling, especially if you sit to the inside. Now I am only 5'9" and it is something to consider every time you sit down and get up.By using the extra table leaf does help the situation for two people. On the Monterey, it just feels more comfortable and is higher. The table top coming out of the side on the monterey is much nicer.
The bathroom door on the monterey is well made and solid.Shut the door on the monterey and alpine.It is solid on the monterey, no rattle. Not so on the alpine.
The pocket doors on the monterey are better made.These are not great, but ok. The alpine pocket doors are pretty poor. The double one way side to the bedroom is very-very poor. Being a "wood man" I pay close attention to wood detail........
Overall, I like the alpine bedroom setup.It is a strength. Very nice. The triple drawer layout with the tv above it, which is a very nice rca with DVD is the nicest part of the coach. The vanity area is particularly nice and deep enough to handle a good size laptop and MFC.{multi-function center}
This is what I have been using it for.Now if you are married, well maybe you will not want it as such.....
But things like drawer construction will favor the monterey because they have stronger bottoms.
They have better made tracts that the drawers side on.
When you enter the coach, Alpine needs to make a serious effort to improve the look of its stairwell leading up and it's dash in general.
Step into a monterey especially at night and each step is lite up and they have a nice woodwork and dash combination. This more then anything hurts the appearance of the alpine.
But strangely enough, I like sitting in the drivers seat of a Alpine better then Monterey. You just seem higher and more comfortable. {This has nothing to do with the ride}I just took the monterey for a test ride a hour ago.
After I take this alpine for a ride I will comment on the driving aspects. I will say that the monterey goes with 8 OUTER bags and Alpine 4. Now the alpine bags are bigger. But I will hold judgement till. I will say that we did a real hard lane change and the monterey handled it unbelievebly real. I thought we were in trouble.........
The monterey has a number of nice features I do not see in the alpine. Vac front entrance door-notice the 2 hinge latches instead of one on the alpine.Also the basement has a nice insulation layer between the road and it. Alpine does not.I like the compartment doors better on the Monterey.They have a lock unlock capability with the keyless entry. Something alpine does not have.{keyless entry or locking baggage compartments.
Alpine was smarter with the chassis. Look at the back of the coach, If you have to go up a step incline, the monterey will definitly bottom out easier. Alpine has a nice angle to the panels on the back of the coach and the muffler is well up there and protected alot better.
Right now it is very difficult for me to make a decision. I love the shape of the alpine. I think it is the best looking coach out there!
This sis agonizing. Hopefully after a alpine cruise tonight ....things will be alot easier to figure. I think I am going outside and back over to sit down in the monterey for awhile.
Boy I could go on and on about what I have discovered and all the mechanic's preferences.

I will add a message after the alpine ride!

It was just so funny to come in here after my monterey test ride and see someone else with the same agonizing decision to make !!!

I would like to ask ONE question...????????
For equally equipped coaches...Alpine Monterey......Which one does the dealers want more for????? {Which one is cheaper or more expensive]

Wingding · 03-27-2005, 06:34 AM

Well things got a litle more complicated last night. I took the alpine for a short cruise and well.......... Man did it ride like a dream. Maybe it's just me but that 4 airbag system and peak chassis was ....... a nicer ride then the Monterey..... don't ask me why, it just is.
Maybe I need to take a couple more test drives min both...... But for what it is worth, After round 1, I would have to go with the Alpine ride.
I simply was not prepared for that ride..... Figuring 8 outer bags are better then 4, but for whatever reason,.....Well, I have to do it again....just to be sure.......
You know, some other things to consider.......Alpine offers a 100 gallon grey tank and 78 black which is considerably more then the monterey which is 58 black and 58 gray.
thats about a 1/3 more. which is considerable.
I would imagine if you are more of a dry camper this is a major consideration.
Alpine offers a better all round electronic's entertainment center.TV/dvd/vcr/am/fm and speakers.
Monterey is just better big time with the quality of the interior-better baggage compartments. Doors swing to the side and are easier to access. Better latches on those doors.
All the fixtures are much better. Shower and kitchen and bathroom sinks.Their use of different flush lighting is better. The corian with the side inlay is downright beautiful.
Monterey offers more standard options.

This decision just got a whole lot tougher after that alpine ride last night..............

I really do not know which way to go...........

Warm Heart - Cold Feet · 03-27-2005, 03:01 PM

We've abandoned Monterey - even tho it's gorgeous. We just don't think it's as well built (except for the "pretty stuff") as the Alpine for sure, and some others we've looked at as well (eg, Holiday Rambler Imperial). Also, we have decided we want a Cummins engine, not a Cat, and we want a Jake brake, not the Pac brake. By the way, we talked to a dealer in Arizona on Friday about an Alpine they have on the lot (same dealer has locations in Everett and Fife, Washington). Anyway, we were looking for a 2005 Alpine with Hydro Hot. They have one on the Arizona lot. If it's within your budget, definitely consider this feature. GOOD LUCK!
PS You asked about price - our "educated" guess is that you'll pay less for a Beaver than an Alpine.

Steve Val · 03-27-2005, 04:39 PM

So all you really did was start another "Ford vs. Chevy" thread. You need to tell us what made you decide- you really didn't appear to explain your decision process. i wouldn't normally worry when I see someone make such a decision, but you did ask the forum, and your reasoning process is nothing short of arbitrary, especially when your "educated guess" shows that you haven't even talked price...

Steve