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Old 12-15-2017, 08:09 AM   #1
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Question Where are the wheel balance weights on your rims?

I had vibration around 60-65 MPH from the time I picked up my coach from Newmar with FL chassis. I went to the local FL service center and they were instructed by FLCC to check the runouts, several of which were out of tolerance (Michelin XRV's) and that did improve the issue but the vibration remained, it was worse. So I just went to FL in Gaffney and they found a few tires out of limits and balanced every tire. The issue is resolved, however, they put about 6-8 ugly square weights on the rims of the drive wheels on the edge near the tire. Is this the right way to do this or is there a non-visible or less ugly way to balance the tires and install weights? Yeah, they are just wheels, but this is fugly!
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Old 12-15-2017, 08:15 AM   #2
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Most truck tire shops use balance beads on big truck tires which go inside the tires. That is usually the best way to balance them with no visible weights. Try to make sure the shop has a Hunter Forcematch balancer which is the way to eliminate out of round issues without guessing.
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Old 12-15-2017, 08:49 AM   #3
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I have seen them glue the weights anywhere it is easy for them (sometimes ugly).
If you are looking for other alternatives (in this case dynamic balancing as you drive), another option (to beads) is Centramatic balancers. If interested, it is best to call them (real easy to talk to) to get the right ones for your chassis.

Definitely smoothed the vibrations on my rig and as the tire wears or whatever, they will keep things in balance.
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Old 12-15-2017, 09:15 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NealC View Post
I had vibration around 60-65 MPH from the time I picked up my coach from Newmar with FL chassis. I went to the local FL service center and they were instructed by FLCC to check the runouts, several of which were out of tolerance (Michelin XRV's) and that did improve the issue but the vibration remained, it was worse. So I just went to FL in Gaffney and they found a few tires out of limits and balanced every tire. The issue is resolved, however, they put about 6-8 ugly square weights on the rims of the drive wheels on the edge near the tire. Is this the right way to do this or is there a non-visible or less ugly way to balance the tires and install weights? Yeah, they are just wheels, but this is fugly!
They may be ugly but weights are placed on the inside or outside of the wheel to dynamically balance them. That's to prevent side to side wobble, at speed.

The weight may be placed out near the outside edge or in near the inside edge, depending on where its needed. Putting all of the weights inside and out of site could throw off the balance.
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Old 12-15-2017, 09:45 AM   #5
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Are you saying they put the stick on wheel weights on the outside, polished portion of the rim, that shows? If so, that is not the way to do it. That was just lazy. The computer tells them where to place them, outside of the rim or inside of the rim, but on polished wheels, a good wheel balancer will place them inside, closer to the center of the rim and then rebalance the wheel again, adding weight where necessary......never on the outside of the rim.

I have Centramatics on this coach and my last. Perfect balance ALL the time, even if you have mud in the tires. The Centramatics balance the entire wheel assembly. I have them on all three axles.

The best and cheapest place to buy them is Florida Shores Truck Center.
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Old 12-15-2017, 11:23 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NealC View Post
I had vibration around 60-65 MPH from the time I picked up my coach from Newmar with FL chassis. I went to the local FL service center and they were instructed by FLCC to(Michelin XRV's)check the runouts, several of which were out of tolerance and that did improve the issue but the vibration remained, it was worse. So I just went to FL in Gaffney and they found a few tires out of limits and balanced every tire. The issue is resolved, however, they put about 6-8 ugly square weights on the rims of the drive wheels on the edge near the tire. Is this the right way to do this or is there a non-visible or less ugly way to balance the tires and install weights? Yeah, they are just wheels, but this is fugly!


NealC,
Ok, let's take this one step at a time.
.... check the runouts, several of which were out of tolerance....

"Out of tolerance"? Now, to me, out of tolerance means the effected tires were close to "eggs". That is, you can't balance an EGG. You can put all the weights on it you want, but, it's still AN EGG.

....they found a few tires out of limits....

Again, just exactly what, does "out of limits" mean? Out of limits as in, out of balance? or, out of limits as in OUT OF ROUND? If it's the latter, AN EGG IS AN EGG! And if it was the latter, in both cases, especially in the first attempt to remedy this, the true and most appropriate action is to REPLACE the EGGS, with nice and ROUND tires. Then, balance round tires instead of eggs. Out of round tires is not nearly as common as it was back in the "old days". Old days being at least 20-25 or more years ago. Quality control in making ROUND tires,has improved immensely over time, but, as you can see, it's not eliminated the problem completely, in some cases.

And, the art of TRUING tires, is also pretty much a thing of the past. There are a scant few fellas hanging around that still perform that service but, locating them, is almost like looking for HOFFA! And, to that subject, if and when a tire company or, service center finds the tires or tire they just sold, IS out of round, 99.999999% of them will simply replace said tire or tires instead of going through the hassle of trying to locate a tire shaving tech.

I've had several tires "shaved" in my years. That includes RV tires and Jeep tires, truck tires etc. Each and every time, those tires turned out superb. Not nearly the amount of weight was needed for rebalance when the shaving was done. I didn't and don't mind them shaving a tire, even if it's a brand new one, they just installed. The reason, if a tire shaver is good, he will make that tire more perfectly round, than it could ever be from the factory, based on certain parameters.

Obviously, "Z" rated tires, (ones that are supposedly rated for 100 mph and up) may have more quality control in the manufacturing than say, RV tires. So, in the end here, if your tires are still "out of tolerance" or, "Out of limits", as in out of round, either get them trued/shaved or, get them replaced. It's kind of tough for me to think that, if a company like FCCC was alerted to an out of round set of tires, that it would be "ok" to them, to try and balance them, if that was the case. An egg is an egg.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ama009 View Post
Most truck tire shops use balance beads on big truck tires which go inside the tires. That is usually the best way to balance them with no visible weights. Try to make sure the shop has a Hunter Forcematch balancer which is the way to eliminate out of round issues without guessing.
ama009,
"Most" truck tire shops? Well, I don't buy large tires every day so, I cannot attest to them using balancing beads the majority of the time, maybe they do. I did just purchase 6 new Yokahama RV 103 265 x 75 22.5" and, I was offered beads or weights. I asked what the "norm" was in this situation. The head of the facility said, there is no norm, it's about a 50/50 desire. I asked how many come back with problems from beads? He replied, NONE. I asked the same question about weights. His reply, about the same. Some shops may use only beads, and some use both.

On here, this forum, the discussion of weights vs beads has been debated a few times. And, if I recall, it's close to a 50/50 tie on who prefers what.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutch Star Don View Post
Are you saying they put the stick on wheel weights on the outside, polished portion of the rim, that shows? If so, that is not the way to do it. That was just lazy. The computer tells them where to place them, outside of the rim or inside of the rim, but on polished wheels, a good wheel balancer will place them inside, closer to the center of the rim and then rebalance the wheel again, adding weight where necessary......never on the outside of the rim.

I have Centramatics on this coach and my last. Perfect balance ALL the time, even if you have mud in the tires. The Centramatics balance the entire wheel assembly. I have them on all three axles.

The best and cheapest place to buy them is Florida Shores Truck Center.
As usual, Don's pretty right on with an accurate statement. I take pride in my wheels. At least some of you have seen them when I posted the pics of them. And, I'm sure the ones that have seen them, DO NOT remember seeing any weights on them, from the outside. That's 'cause there wasn't any. ALL of the weights were placed on the inside of the wheels. And, while there was not an overly amount of weights per wheel, there were quite a few on each one. And those tires were smooth as glass. So, yes, at least in my cases (had several nice sets of wheels on my vehicles for years and years), I've always requested the weights be placed on the inside.

And the company, normally Discount tire (been dealing with them for oh, about 40 or more years in various locations), has accommodated my request and any and all tires that have been done that way, have turned out just fine.

The last time I tried "bags" of beads, they failed miserably. That is, the bags NEVER OPENED! Not good. So, I went back to weights. I used weights for years after that. But, in my most recent purchase, the 265s mentioned above, I chose to go with the beads, to see how those work, since there's so much praise of them. Well, so far, in about 800-900 miles of travel since the new skins were installed, AND THE BEADS, I'm pretty darn happy.
Scott
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Old 12-15-2017, 12:18 PM   #7
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I agree with don and Scott. If the tire isn’t truly round or wobbles balancing can’t make it right. even if it could be trued you could be almost bald on one side with a lot of rubber on the other side. I had a shop put stick on weights on the outside of my alloy wheels . I told them to put the weights where they wouldn’t be seen. A lot of new cars have trim caps that won’t fit on the wheel if the weights were on the outside so they have to go inside.
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Old 12-15-2017, 12:51 PM   #8
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I just installed a set of Centramatic on my Ventana...and then left for UIO. Cannot wait to see what the ride is like on our next outing.

The part numbers for the Ventana are...

Steer: 700-720
Drive: 600-640
Tag: 800-820

They just slip on the studs behind the wheel.

My original weights...which are left in place...are only one per wheel...looks like about 3oz weights...stuck to the rim on the non viewable side.
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Old 12-15-2017, 04:10 PM   #9
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Typically, if your wheel is already balanced, Centramatic recommends to leave them on, except if there are weights on the polished side.
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Old 12-15-2017, 07:27 PM   #10
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99% of the tire shops I called couldn't spin balance the tires I wanted to buy and said they just put beads in there (actually sand) I called Michlin and Yokohama, they told me that beads in the tire voids the warrantee. I wanted new tires and for them to be spin balanced. I ended up a commercial tire in LA. They tried to talk me out of balancing the rears due to the weights needing to be on the outside of the polished rim.

I had them do it. One of the tires has 8 small stick on weights. I noticed them the day they got put on, and only notice them when I am polishing the rims. They are so close to the rim color I never notice them otherwise.
I really like how smooth the coach rides at freeway speeds. Now if only I could get rid of all the rattles and squeaks when on rough roads...

-Bill
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Old 12-15-2017, 09:48 PM   #11
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Quote:
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99% of the tire shops I called couldn't spin balance the tires I wanted to buy and said they just put beads in there (actually sand) I called Michlin and Yokohama, they told me that beads in the tire voids the warrantee. I wanted new tires and for them to be spin balanced. I ended up a commercial tire in LA. They tried to talk me out of balancing the rears due to the weights needing to be on the outside of the polished rim.

I had them do it. One of the tires has 8 small stick on weights. I noticed them the day they got put on, and only notice them when I am polishing the rims. They are so close to the rim color I never notice them otherwise.
I really like how smooth the coach rides at freeway speeds. Now if only I could get rid of all the rattles and squeaks when on rough roads...

-Bill
Bill,

Now if only I could get rid of all the rattles and squeaks when on rough roads...

That would require the powers to be, actually spend the money collected in gas taxes etc., to IMPROVE the roads! Imagine that.
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Old 12-15-2017, 10:59 PM   #12
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Where are the wheel balance weights on your rims?

I have one wheel with 12 weights. FL called me after my email of the disappointment and they said they can try putting them on the inside. I will first call Michelin and see what they say as they provided the tire to FL.

Iím not sure if Centramatic has enough weight to do the job mine needed. However, after 7 hours on the road today I agree with Bill, the drive is amazing. So much smoother. Not the prettiest but the only one that will notice is me.

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Old 12-16-2017, 03:04 PM   #13
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Most truck tire shops use balance beads on big truck tires which go inside the tires.
After I called more than 20 Truck Tire shops in Arizona and Southern California when I was looking to replace the tires on my Allegro Bus, I would agree most use the beads, but from my small sample it was way more than most doing that. Very few of the truck tire shops could spin balance the large wheels so their only option was beads, or no balance at all. No one mentioned the old style way balancing where you put it on a device with a bubble in the middle that told you which side was heavy (or light) so you know where to hammer on the wheel weights. There was a place in Phoenix that had a machine to straighten up the wheel and tire, but they only had Firestone's in my size and load rating. And those had that long haul trucker groove that breaks off if you hit a curb making the tires look like there is something wrong with them. I think its called a decoupling groove.

I went with the Yokohama's, but for my load range I needed the 108R's I found a retread manufacturer on the web and called them. After reading about all the sidewall issues with Michelin's I wasn't surprised they wouldn't accept the Michelin's for retreading, said the sidewalls weren't up to the task. I called him back when I was pretty sure I was going with the Yoko's and the guy told me he can retread them a few times. Which was enough of an endorsement for me to pull the trigger on them.
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Old 12-16-2017, 03:19 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by NealC View Post
I have one wheel with 12 weights. FL called me after my email of the disappointment and they said they can try putting them on the inside. I will first call Michelin and see what they say as they provided the tire to FL.

Iím not sure if Centramatic has enough weight to do the job mine needed. However, after 7 hours on the road today I agree with Bill, the drive is amazing. So much smoother. Not the prettiest but the only one that will notice is me.

Attachment 185850
My thoughts are if that much weight is needed the tires are defective. It should not take to much to balance any tire. The shop in my home town sent 2 of the 6 back to the supplier because of this problem. He stated he will only apply reasonable weight for any tire he sells.
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