Stranded! Chassis Batteries discharging.

[RickO]

Took the coach out of storage a few days ago, loaded up and hit the road from Phoenix to Minnesota. Immediately got a warning of low system (chassis) voltage. Coach is Itasca 40FD on a Freightliner Evolution chassis with Cummins 400ISL.

1) After "check engine" low voltage warning the voltage continued to drop resulting in an electrical shut down of the chassis.

2) To get to a CG, I swapped two house batteries with the chassis batteries and once checked in (Friday) I went looking for replacement batteries. Could only find WalMart open and bought the strongest CCA batteries they had with 825CCA.

3) All seemed well for 50 miles with a voltage reading of 13.5v but then quickly dropped to 12.1v and once again set off the alarm.

4) Ran the generator which kept the volatage above 11.9v and got us 150 miles to Gallup, NM. Stopped at a TA travel center which was a Freightliner partner and while unhooking the toad lights the system voltage immediately jumped back up to 13.6v! I noticed that the toad light connection cable had come apart and the center (ground?) prong had come off and stuck in the recepticle on the coach. I removed that and we made the 140 miles to Albuqurque and voltage remained at 13.6 the entire way so we thought we had it solved. This leg was made without the light cable connected.

5) This morning we set up and headed out to find a new light cable for the toad and after about a mile the check engine light came back on and system voltage was back down to 12.1v.

6) Turned around and went to a Freightliner shop here and we're currently waiting for a call for them to take a look at it either tonight or in the am.

All battery connections are clean and secure at the batteries and there is no obvious damage to the light cable receptacle on the coach.

Any ideas on what might be going on or quick fix things I might check?

Thanks,

Rick

[bigskymt]

I'd think a dead short in the trailer plug would blow a fuse.
If you can check voltage at the alternator thats where I'd start. You may have an isolator problem that's not allowing the engine alt. to charge the chassis batteries.
It sounds like the house batteries were good when you switched them to the chassis.

[RJay]

Rick,
Try to isolate the problem between the toad and the MH. If you unplug the toad does the problem go away? Could your DW follow you in the toad for the next leg of your trip to see if it's in the toad wiring?

[Harry B]

I jad the same thing 2 months ago. Turned out to be a bad alternator. Incase of my alternator, all regulation is internal to the altetnator and it also did not have an external exite wire so the only thing that could be the problem was the alternator it self. I drove for several days on the generator until a new alrernator arrived. I also had them replace the belt while they had it off.

[bdpreece]

My first suspect would be the alternator also. If running the generator keeps the voltage up then the alternator is not doing it's job.

[Nuge]

Is that center (ground) connection to your toad "welded" into the socket? It sounds like your problem went away when you unhooked the toad lights. I'd do a real good visual inspection of both sections of the toad light cables first. Feel for warm spots while it's hooked up. Look for worn/abraded spots on the cable. It seems you've already isolated it to the toad lighting circuit since everything returns to normal when you disconnect the toad.

[RJay]

Disconnect the large battery wire at the alternator, and start the engine, then take a voltage reading from the battery terminal to ground. If you don't get a voltage it's you alternator. If it is, try to get one that's rebuilt, it will be less expensive.

[RickO]

Thanks for the rapid replies guys!

1) The center ground prong which came loose on the toad lighting wire was not welded to the socket but had just come unscrewed from the cable and remained in the socket. I removed the grond prong from the socket easily.

2) Yesterday, the problem immediately went away when I unplugged the toad light cable and we drove 140 miles with strong voltage readings. This morning all was good when I started out (without the toad lighting connected) but THEN once again dropped quickly within a few minutes.

3) The isolator seems to be working since, with the coach running, I can press the boost button and see a jump in chassis battery voltage but it only jumps from about 12.1 to 12.6.

4) When I originally swapped the old chassis batteries with two house batteries the voltage came back up but I only drove about a mile to a CG and then shut it down. When I replace the chassis batteries with new ones the next morning all was good for about 50 miles but then the voltage dropped again. This was all with the toad still connected. The generator got me another 140 miles or so during which time the voltage degraded from 12.1 to 11.8 by the time I got to the Freightliner shop in Gallup. That's where I disconnected the toad and saw the good voltage return. It worked for about another 150 miles with strong voltage before failing again this morning.

While I'm waiting for FL to call me, I'll be doing what visual inspections I can but haven't been able to see anything obvious so far.

BTW, I found out the hard way what happens when the system voltage drops too low... I got a "Shift Inhibit" error message... all gauges died... the Allison was stuck in 5th gear and no shifts were allowed. The "requested gear" display went blank.

The good news is that is a nice day in Alburqurque and there's a basketball game on tonight.

Rick

[RickO]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RJay Disconnect the large battery wire at the alternator, and start the engine, then take a voltage reading from the battery terminal to ground. If you don't get a voltage it's you alternator. If it is, try to get one that's rebuilt, it will be less expensive.

Thanks RJay. I think I'm going to put my extended wty to good use.

Rick

[RickO]

Just an update... looks like the shop won't be able to look at the coach until tomorrow. I called FTL HELP and talked to a good ole boy who really seemed to know his stuff.... just like you guys. He thinks the toad light issue was a coincedence and the problem is a failing/failed voltage regulator/alternator. Just as you guys offered, he said if running the generator keeps the voltage up.... it's probably the alternator.

More to follow.
Thanks again.

Rick

[Nuge]

See post 26 here:
No battery charge. Stranded in Wichita

I did an extensive write up on how to determine if it's the regulator or the alternator with a voltmeter in four easy steps.

[hondo122]

Ricko, if you have the tools and time you can handle this yourself, look for a local alternator rebuilding shop much cheaper than going new, plus they may be able to increase the amp output. Good luck
.

[RickO]

Thanks Nuge and Mike. Actually, I have far more time right now than either tools or inclination to try to do this myself. It sounds like the voltage regulator is embedded in the alternator and my days of serious mechanical work are behind me.

Turns out the Freightliner shop here in Albuquerque is an Oasis shop. You'd never know it though. Coaches are rare and worked in between all of the OTR trucks. Today they determined that the alternator is bad and are over nighting one so I hope to be back on my way by late afternoon tomorrow.

My EZ Care extended wty is covering all but $100 which covers my deductible and the overnight freight.

Thanks again...

Rick

[Dr4Film]

Rick,

I got to ask this question, all the time you were driving the coach, what was your Voltage Analog Meter telling you for alternator voltage output? And isn't there a red dash light that would come on telling you that your alternator bit the dust?

I had a recent alternator failure on May 1st on my way to the Adirondacks. The first indication was the RED light on my dash that indicated an ALT CHARGE problem. Next, I looked at my SilverLeaf computer display and it was reading 12.8 volts. Normally, it reads 13.9 to 14.1 or so.

I knew then that my alternator gave up the ghost. As long as I was driving during the day not requiring headlights etc. I could drive for 250-300 miles before the voltage dropped to 11.8 or so. My Allison would shut down and stop shifting around 10 volts or so.

Were your gauges not reporting the true condition of your engine, alternator and batteries?

Dr4Film ----- Richard.