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Old 07-23-2019, 08:08 PM   #1
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Looking at a used Select Limited 45DL24, any help?

I apologize for asking questions that are hot topics, but I can't find the specific answers with the search function of the forum.

I am looking at a used 2007 Travel Supreme Select Limited 45 DL24 with roughly 65,000 miles. The coach seems to be in good shape, although I need to travel to see it. The price is right and I am doing my homework prior to booking a flight to go see it. I have no service history on the coach, so I am left with inspecting it in person.

1) Does the K3 chassis require the windshield hoop and chassis cross bracing? Or is that a K2 issue only?

2) This coach has the Cummins ISX 600 engine. I have read through lots of posts in the Cummins forum here about the ISX engine valve failures, but its not clear to me whether this engine (I'm assuming its a 2006 engine/chassis in a 2007 Travel Supreme) is affected by this issue. Also, I tend to think that a few failures get the most publicity and while an expensive repair, might be a limited situation that is out of proportion to the healthy engines that never get posted.

3) Does anyone know if this engine uses DEF? Or a DPF (diesel particulate filter). I can't seem to find when those were used.

Has anyone has issues with their Limited engines?

We currently have a 2004 Coachmen with a CAT 3126E (330 HP) and it has none of these items and has been good so far. This would be a big upgrade for sure.

Thank you.

Matt
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Old 07-24-2019, 09:10 AM   #2
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Paul Conley says Limiteds don't need bracing. I think you'll see bracing inside the basement (and that it exists elsewhere), because TS had learned that bracing was needed.
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Old 07-24-2019, 09:19 AM   #3
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If it is a 2006 engine then it may not even be the same series as the ISX 650. The troublesome one is the EPA model year 2007 CM 871. The ISX 600 does not seem to be as troublesome as the 650. I would not be worried about it. There are more 600's than 650's out there and I've only heard of one 600 failure.
My 650 has been a nightmare as you may have read.
TS made a great rig and
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Old 07-24-2019, 10:35 AM   #4
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We have a 2007 45DL24 with a 600 Cummins. No cross bracing has ever been done and I see no reason to do it. 600 engine is strong. 53000 miles on ours, no issues at all with it. We are very happy with our TS. No DEF needed in our engine,
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Old 07-24-2019, 11:16 AM   #5
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We searched for a nice Travel Supreme Select or Select Limited, but just couldn't come to terms.

They are beautiful coaches and the forerunner of the Entegra Cornerstone.

All of the Select Limited models we saw had visible X bracing in the basement.

I think you'll be okay with the ISX 600 engine but I would investigate restricting your EGR (exhaust gas recirculation) system. The EGR system puts acid back into the intake system and over time erodes #6 intake valve until it fails. But, like Mr D said, this is usually on the ISX 650 CM 871 engines.

Be careful on pricing. We saw huge ($100k) price differences on used coaches.
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Old 07-24-2019, 10:55 PM   #6
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That's excellent news and advice on both the engine and the bracing. I thank you all for your replies. My flight leaves in 8 hours for my inspection and, assuming no dealbreaker defects/problems, the subsequent purchase. I'll be sure to post with some pictures in 24 hours!

Thank you.

Matt
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Old 07-25-2019, 08:02 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve n Jan View Post
We have a 2007 45DL24 with a 600 Cummins. No cross bracing has ever been done and I see no reason to do it. 600 engine is strong. 53000 miles on ours, no issues at all with it. We are very happy with our TS. No DEF needed in our engine,
Your coach was braced when it was built. TS did some or all of the bracing that the rest of us have had to add. In your basement, between the cargo trays, you should find the same vertical bars the rest of us have AND some x bars.

Those are the easy ones to see. The much more important ones are on a 45 degree angle beside & ahead of the fuel tank. We also have an x under the basement on the outside.

I think yours also has the hoop around the windshield.
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Old 07-30-2019, 08:55 AM   #8
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We have a 2007 Select Limited 45SS24

1) Ours is a K3 Chassis and does not have the cross bracing that some have said ALL Limiteds have. I have had the windshields pop out but they weren't glued so they are now and haven't had any problems. (35mph winds going through Texas and New Mexico at about 65mph when they popped out the upper outside corners). Gorilla tape got me home to Yuma although the guy that re-seated them and glued them said it wasn't necessary, they wont fall out... but the wind noise was very irritating, I would tape them if it ever happens. I plan to take mine to Pauls to get the X-bracing and the hoop. The Entegra Cornerstones all have both of these updates.

EDIT UPDATE: I think my new windshields might be the wrong size, view this link:
It happened

2) Our K3 Chassis has the 2006 CM870 600hp Cummins. We have not had any problems at 60k miles and from what I gather the CM870 have the exhaust on the opposite side of the engine (compared to the CM871) and haven't exhibited the broken valve issue although the CM870 series is listed in the bulletin.

3) This engine only has EGR no DPF or DEF. You can put an "Ugly Fix" to bypass the EGR

Take care,
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Old 07-30-2019, 09:49 AM   #9
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Ron, how do you know your coach has no bracing? Most of what Paul adds is quite hidden.

With respect to the windshield, go slow about 2 sizes. Just last month I was talking to Paul about my windshields (2006) and he said the glass co was talking about two sizes, and he said "no no no, there's just one."

The other thread on here about the two sizes was for a 2004.
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Old 07-30-2019, 11:51 AM   #10
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Relative to cross bracing;

Using Paul's as the gold standard of cross bracing don't assume you have "cross bracing" just because you see a couple of X's in your basement.
As mentioned above much of it is not readily visible.

There are a lot of do it yourself cross bracings out there that may or may not have all of the bracing required. Also many coaches (mine included) that were done at shops other than Paul's that may or may not have all of the bracing.

Also keep in mind some coaches are titled based on the model year of the frame and some on the year the coach was actually built.


When it comes to windshield cracking/breaking Travel Supremes are not the only ones with this problem. If you cruise this forum long enough you will note many, if not all, of the long coaches have this problem whether, freightliner or Spartan chassis. The TS forum just seems to talk about it more.

All of us have had concerns about the windshield and other problems associated with a used older coach when considering our purchase.

I have now had my TS for 9 months and put about 3,000 miles on it.
It was 14 years old and had 92,000 miles when I purchased it.


As I peruse the forums I note I have had far fewer problems than many new and relatively new coaches and most of my problems were relatively minor compared to others I read about. Also some of my perceived problems were because I didn't understand how some things function. I suspect this is true of many of the posted problems we read about.

Granted I cracked a windshield but that was because a jack failed. Turns out the failure was due to a faulty installation of a new levelling system installed just before I purchased the coach. NEW IS NOT NECESSARILY BETTER.

View the recent thread titled "Entegra Quality"

So if you like a Travel Supreme don't let things like windshield, cross bracing, age and mileage scare you off.

Just do a thorough pre buy inspection, look through any maintenance records (if available),check the vehicle history re: flooding, accident damage etc. And read this entire TS forum. Then buy the coach you like.


In my opinion the TS is a nicer, more elegant, and better built coach than almost anything , new or used, on the market today.

There was another recent thread titled "If you won the lottery what would you buy"

Without hesitation I would keep my old TS and just do a general interior upgrade and all new tires rather than buy new.
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Old 07-30-2019, 01:09 PM   #11
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I am third owner and asked... if it had been done that would be a selling point, but not having it on a K3 chassis and seeing that Entegra started putting the x-bracing and the hoop on makes me think why not??? I will be taking it to Pauls in the future...
Pics from Entegra brochures...
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Old 07-31-2019, 12:50 PM   #12
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We did it!

We decided to make the purchase on this one. We drove it home 760 miles without much issue. I say that, because upon leaving the dealer, the generator started to hiccup and eventually went off. We decided to keep it off until we could better troubleshoot. Since our chassis AC was not functional either, it was a warm trip home from Georgia to Pennsylvania. The next day we checked the diagnostics on the generator and got a few codes. We tried running it again on day 2 and it ran the entire time. The dealer did a generator service, so we suspected a fuel problem (new filter was installed so maybe the fuel filter was empty?). By the second generator start, it ran fine the rest of the way home, thankfully.

The dealer gave me their repair history from the previous owner. Yikes. Lots of issues but nothing major. House stuff mostly. A roof leak which has been resolved, no evidence of leaking at all now. The generator was a previous complaint, they tightened some fuel connections and resolved it. I will look at that again.

The previous owner installed a new microwave, new fridge, new tires, new slide toppers and awning fabric, and other items. It needs a good cleaning, inside and out, some more repairs, but it's all ours now. Looking forward to getting things cleaned and repaired before our month-long trip to Florida in November. Will schedule a service at Spartan before our trip for sure.

Here is an initial picture in our driveway. Now I have to sell the Coachmen in front of it, just as we got it all cleaned, fixed and made our own

Thank you for all of your help and responding to my post. This is a 2007, but I don't see any X bracing in the basement at the sliding trays. I will look elsewhere as best I can. I'm told that Paul's hasn't needed to add bracing to the Limiteds as the K3 chassis is stronger than the K2.

Thanks to my buddy Dave for all of your help. He and his wife came down to meet and drive home with us, just in case. He also helped me (which means he did the work) get the taillights and door entry keypad/remote working. Its helpful to have another TS at the next camp site over to compare wiring! The previous owner has someone do trailer wiring and it was a bit messed up back there. It's all fixed now.

Now on to my list of 100 items to get done on this coach. I must be a glutton for punishment or something. At one point my wife asked me for a list of things that work, instead of what doesn't. Haha. I must say, the layout is great and the finishes are superb. Even with all the repair items, it won us over once we stayed in it overnight. The bathroom is huge. The bed is comfortable. The bedroom is spacious with plenty of storage for clothes in the closet and cabinets. Our's has a TV lift behind a fireplace where most people have a desk or love seat. We might take out the fireplace and install some more cabinets for kitchen storage.

Oh, and compared to our 2004 Coachmen, the power in this TS is incredible. Passing and hills are effortless.

Matt
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Old 07-31-2019, 02:20 PM   #13
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Looks outstanding...good choice!
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Old 07-31-2019, 02:22 PM   #14
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Congratulations!
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