Batteries - Should I be concerned?

[Dippelj]

We left our 2019 Anthem with a well respected Entegra dealer on Oct 31 to have warranty repairs while we returned home for 8 weeks. We were assured our coach would be plugged into 50 amp power while it was in care of the service department while we were away. We were told we could leave items in our fridge and freezer which was great to know as our main concern was to make sure our batteries would not be drained and damaged.

When we returned yesterday to pick up the coach we found it plugged in but our freezer had obviously melted and re-frozen. We know this because when we left we placed a penny on top of a frozen container of water. When we returned the penny was on the bottom of the container under the frozen ice. So....the block of ice had melted and refrozen. We have pitched everything from the freezer as we have no idea how long it was off.

So, here’s the concern. If the fridge quit, the batteries were likely drained. No idea for how long. We have always been careful to make sure our batteries never got below 12.1 volts so they always had at least 50% charge. Now we could have batteries that have been totally drained at least once and we have no idea for how long.

We are still at the dealership and meeting with our service writer this morning to go over things before we check out. They have been very good to offer to replace everything in our fridge but the bigger concern is how much damage has been done and how long will it be before we need to replace our possibly damaged batteries?

Any suggestions as to handle this would be appreciated.

[Earl II]

Suggest you have them do a check on the batteries so you can discuss the issue before you leave. What does your energy information show the voltage on your batteries to be now? If they are very low, they are most likely damaged and will not hold a charge. The service people may not replace them for you but may give you a break on the cost of replacements.

[Gary.Jones]

Jim

Really surprised and saddened to hear that you have had this problem. What is most difficult to understand is that it sounds like the repair facility was very aware of the need to have the coach plugged in, and yet, someone either forgot to do it, or more likely, plugged it into a circuit that had been tripped by someone else and failed to check on its condition periodically. That is really a shame, and doubly disappointing.

Now I am no battery expert, but owners have fairly frequently reported similar situations maybe in their own storage facility or at various storage locations on the road, and the general opinion of owners "in the know" is that a small number of discharges below 12 volts probably does not kill a whole battery bank, but potentially weakens the bank if the discharges are deep and long.

My recommendation would be to raise your concerns with the service coordidnator and make sure that issue is reported to someone who is in a position to make contingency plans, and then I would probably take the coach on the road and do some typical "boondocking" and see how the battery bank is handling typical charge and discharge cycles. You dont really know how long it was without charging although you're pretty sure that it was at least for several days, and you can assume it was deep. But a few nights of regular boondocking will tell you pretty quickly what damage was done, if any. If severe, I would head back to the dealer to have a discussion. (You know that a lot of dealers dont even try to keep a coach charged while in the shop and let the batteries drop to very low levels all the time (although usually on a coach that has no one using it or leaving food in it)). JMO

As the owner said immediately above, I would suggest that you have the battery bank load tested before you leave.

Im sure that you will get other opinions and good advice.

Gary

[photraveller]

First I love the penny / quarter test. Good thing you used it, or you might have gotten very sick!

Yes, I would challenge them to load check both the house and chassis batteries. That's the least they could do for destroying all your food.

I'd also make sure your advisor knows that it was left unplugged long enough to destroy all you frozen / refrigerated food!

Now for the batteries??? A lot will depend on just how long they left them sit dead, and even the ambient temperatures while they were dead. An occasional overnight to couple of days of dead and the batteries might survive without much long term damage. If it was week or more? I would say you probably suffered long term noticeable damage.

Of course, if you don't boondock you might never "notice" that damage, but it will still have shorten the life of those batteries. JMO

Steve

[twinboat]

Most inverters cut out at 10.5 volts or at 0% state of charge.

If there wasn't any other loads, and they held at that voltage for a short time, 1 or 2 days, your batteries should be OK. You may have lost a few days of life.

Discharging to 0% state of charge is OK occasionally.

What you don't know is how long they sat discharged and if they were completely discharged due to other parasitic draws.

Shop records should be able to account for the RVs movements and possably when it happened.

There is a capacity test that can be done. I would select one random battery and do it.

An example is, if you have a 200 AH battery rated at the 20 AH rating, place a 10 amp load ( 5 amps per 100 AH ) for 20 hours and the battery should still hold 10.5 volts or 5.3 volts, if a 6 volt battery, at the end of the test.

Here is a State of Charge / Depth of Discharge chart that show that deep discharges are not instant end of battery life incident.

[brobox]

Best test would be to load test each battery. If one is bad it will show. There is no guaranty long term if the batteries have been weakened. The low battery cutoff is set to 10.5v volts on the newer coaches, so the chance of them being drain down lower are slim.

Here is another one, I had bad batteries from the factory on the 14 due to bad weather and sitting awhile before delivery. Question would be were the batteries 100% before the dealer?

[Butte64]

It won’t help now, but something you can do next time, or something others reading this can do, is turn OFF your inverter while at the dealer. Your refrigerator will be off while it it is not plugged in but that should not be a long time and won’t be a problem since it is not being opened. Another thing is to set the LBCO to the value PJ recommends for your batteries.

Note that even at a good dealer bad things can happen like power surges, overheated circuit breakers, failed power boxes,etc. just because it is plugged in does not mean it will always have power so for any long term away from coach be prepared for it not to have power. Even when my coach is in my garage I turn off the inverter if I am not going to be around for a week or more.

[KennyGolub]

I would see about them replacing the batteries.


Last spring, I towed out 2018 Jeep for traveling three days. At night, I totally forgot (one of many senior moments) to turn off the braking system.


When we arrived at our destination, the battery was so dead, I couldn't even unlock the doors with the remote.


I got it jumped and restarted, but here is the catch: Although it would start and run fine, the automatic stop/restart when stopping, no longer functioned. The control panel for it always said battery is too low for it to function. The battery never again charged enough for it to work again. It didn't bother me that it no longer worked, but it did teach me a bit about what happens to a relatively new battery when it is fully discharged.


.

[RayandWendy]

Originally Posted by KennyGolub

I would see about them replacing the batteries.


Last spring, I towed out 2018 Jeep for traveling three days. At night, I totally forgot (one of many senior moments) to turn off the braking system.


When we arrived at our destination, the battery was so dead, I couldn't even unlock the doors with the remote.


I got it jumped and restarted, but here is the catch: Although it would start and run fine, the automatic stop/restart when stopping, no longer functioned. The control panel for it always said battery is too low for it to function. The battery never again charged enough for it to work again. It didn't bother me that it no longer worked, but it did teach me a bit about what happens to a relatively new battery when it is fully discharged.


.

I have a 2018 Jeep JL with Auto Stop/Start. You know there are 2 batteries in the Jeep.

[KennyGolub]

Originally Posted by RayandWendy

I have a 2018 Jeep JL with Auto Stop/Start. You know there are 2 batteries in the Jeep.

I was not aware of that, but in any case, it's moot for me. I traded it in.
And no, I didn't trade it just because of the battery.

.

[Scooter]

How about dealer doing the load test and giving you written results. Now spend the day & night outside their shop....boondocking; to see what's what.

[Gary.Jones]

I patronize a well respected RV Dealer/repair shop. I have observed the guys who move coaches many times on the way into the shop and on the way back out again that afternoon. What I have observed is 1.) conscientious plugging and unplugging and re-reeling my power cord each time, and 2.) the guys moving my coach are good about always having it plugged-in, however 3) I have NEVER seen those guys check either my vegatouch or my Progressive hard wired electrical management system read out to make sure that there is ACTUALLY power going into the coach. They plug it in and disappear. If there were a dead circuit, I am sure that my coach would sit without power until it was moved to a new location or someone noticed that the power line was dead.

That is part of the reason that I try to NEVER leave my coach at any repair facility for any period of time for more than 8 hours. Its a pain in the butt, but I always stay with the coach and expect to sleep in it every night. Its a real PITA because that means that Dee and I sit in the Honda from when they take it in the morning until they bring it back that night which is boring and inconvenient as we have to supervise our 2 cats that travel with us. We hold the cats and the four of us creatures sit in the Honda all day, often during the summer, and almost always with the AC running all day. Maybe we can escape for 40 minutes to eat lunch somewhere, but only at places where we can park the car right in front of the restaurant and keep an eye on it as the motor and AC is running all the time.

I've left the coach one time for a week to get hail damage repaired/repainted, but then we stripped out all things from the coach refrig. and presumed that there would be a high probability that it might end up with no power while simultaneously praying that it was never more than 8 hours so my battery bank would still be in good shape.

Gary

[lonfu]

I can't believe you left food in a frig in a moho for 2 months when not using it and expected the shop to monitor your food and to keep the frig running.

Most batt warranties are a year. Most modern energy management systems have low voltage cuttoff so batts won't completely discharge. More than likely your batts are fine just needed to be recharged. Was there a local power outage? Perhaps the power company should be paying for your groceries.

Perhaps the shop had to disconnect the power to safely preform the work, order parts and it took them several days to do this. A lot of possibilities there....

Sounds like the service manager is doing you a huge favor. Chalk it up as a RV life lesson and get down the road.

[RubiconTrail]

I use the penny test too, even at home, because of snow outages (broken branches and inaccessibility) and PG&E Public Safety Power Shutoffs. I have a backup generator, but becasue we are remodeling it isn't automatic, so every time we leave the house, we are taking a chance. I don't worry about the Cornerstone, because it is plugged into the construction generator that the guys use every day for 8-10 hours.

Sorry for being long winded, more story...The refrigerator in the shop is NOT on a backup and when the power goes out, the fridge get shut off. About two months ago we lost power due to a PSPS while we were out of town. It lasted almost three days, (67 hours from what I can tell). The ambient temperature in the shop was 70 degrees during the day, and around 60 at night. When I got back the power was still off, and I immediately went and checked the fridge because I was worried. The ice maker was leaking a little (maybe 1/4 cup of water), and the food inside was almost 100% frozen. The quarter was still on top of the frozen block in the cool whip tub.

So here's my point...Your fridge had to have been off for an extended period for the penny to sink, and to me that means it is likely the batteries were also deeply discharged for an extended period. So I DO think you should be worried.

I think Gary has a good idea. Immediately boondock for a few days and get an idea of how your batteries compared to when you used them before. If you haven't boondocked before and don't know what to expect, you should get an overnight out of your battery bank pretty easily if they are fully charged when you begin the evening.

Sorry for your trouble, difficult lesson learned!