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Old 08-17-2017, 07:51 PM   #1
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Black tank flush

I am trying to find out what happens inside the black tank when using the black tank flush hose. It this a spray inside the tank or does it just fill the tank with water so you can dump it.

I did watch the video about having the flush hooked up and adding water to bring the tank to 95% before the tank was dumped. Made sense, as did filling the tank a second time and dumping again.

My question is prompted by a continued issue with the black tank readings. When we dump the monitor goes to zero. Then we flush the toilet once, maybe twice, and the reading jumps to 70%. It stays there until we flush a few more times and then the reading goes back to normal for what we feel is in the tank. Say around 20% and then behaves normally.

Today I dumped the black tank and the monitor was at zero. Then I turned on the back flush and a few seconds later the tank jumped to 75%. I continued to let the flush run and a few minutes later the tank reading went down to 20% and with the flush still running rose normally.

We have run through the Pine Sol and many of the tank chemicals on the market and suggest here when I wrote about the problem before.

Now I would like to get a handle on the issue. Entegra and NIRVC has looked at it and were going to replace the sensors, but after they dumped the tank the reading was normal so they felt all was good. At the time I had not realized that all it took was a couple of flushes before it acted up again.

BTW, I did run the Sea Level diagnostics and when the readings are normal the P sensitivity was in the 40 range and when it was reading high the P sensitivity was down in the 5 or 6 range.

Thanks all....
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Old 08-17-2017, 08:14 PM   #2
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Mine does the same thing. I figured it was the sprayer getting the sided of the tank wet. A few minutes after draining the tank it is back to reading 0 so it has never bothered me.

When back flushing the tank, I only use the gauge to check how full the tank is before dumping, after that, it's the sight method.
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Old 08-17-2017, 08:14 PM   #3
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The flush is like one of those sprayer wands you used to stick down the toilet, except it is hard mounted within the top portion of the tank.

What you're describing sounds like some or all of the sensor has become detached from the tank wall.

My first effort would be to remove the passenger's side wall that covers the fresh tank and see if you can locate the sensors. I believe they are on the door side.

-Matt
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Old 08-18-2017, 12:06 AM   #4
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Sorry to counteract your observations but I think my 2014 sprayer works fine. Like Chuck posted a few years back I dump my black tank then flush for a short time, then close the valve and flood the tank via the sprayer, then open the valve again.

So far, no odors, and my gages seem to read correctly.

Maybe my poo is better than your poo. Living full time in the RV and obviously using the potty. I think the secret is lots of water.
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Old 08-18-2017, 01:34 AM   #5
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Tank monitors were invented by a 'evil minded' individual to taunt RV owners.

Get the sensor wet and it has a read out.
Get some TP on sensor and it has a read out
Get some poo on sensor and it has a read out
Get scale on sensor and it has a read out

RV tanks used to NOT have monitors/sensors. Having them doesn;t make it any better or improved

I haven't looked at my monitors (tank levels/battery state) in over 9 yrs.
I really don't care. I know how long we can go based on water usage.

Besides......
If toilet bumps...time to dump
If sinks/shower starts draining slower then usual....time to dump
If water pump goes 'burruuup' then need more water and should have already dumped tanks.

I dump when full...black first then do a couple of minutes flush (sprayer in tank) and watch flow coming out (clear adapter). Close dump valve,,,, add couple gallons back into tank so bottom stays wet and then dump grey tanks (2).
Done until next time to dump.

Monitors.....only thing good for is to drive RVrs crazy
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Old 08-18-2017, 04:50 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old-Biscuit View Post
Tank monitors were invented by a 'evil minded' individual to taunt RV owners.

Get the sensor wet and it has a read out.
Get some TP on sensor and it has a read out
Get some poo on sensor and it has a read out
Get scale on sensor and it has a read out

RV tanks used to NOT have monitors/sensors. Having them doesn;t make it any better or improved

I haven't looked at my monitors (tank levels/battery state) in over 9 yrs.
I really don't care. I know how long we can go based on water usage.

Besides......
If toilet bumps...time to dump
If sinks/shower starts draining slower then usual....time to dump
If water pump goes 'burruuup' then need more water and should have already dumped tanks.

I dump when full...black first then do a couple of minutes flush (sprayer in tank) and watch flow coming out (clear adapter). Close dump valve,,,, add couple gallons back into tank so bottom stays wet and then dump grey tanks (2).
Done until next time to dump.

Monitors.....only thing good for is to drive RVrs crazy
A macerator toilet is not going to burp.
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Old 08-18-2017, 07:51 AM   #7
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We've been fulltiming for over a year and have not had any issues with the black tank or the sensors. We flush and dump the tank similar to you. Dump tank, then fill to about 80 or so % with clean water, then dump again. After this I then dump the grey water.

After dumping I put about 20% of clean water in the tank before we use it to help keep the bottom wet and also have solids float instead of sitting on the bottom. The water also sloshes around as we drive helping to clean the side walls of the tank.

Every so offen I drop a couple of laundry detergent pods into the tank to help clean it. I'll add about 30% clean water in the tank, then drop the pods in and drive to our next stop. Once there, I'll clean the tank again and we're good to go.

Not sure if this will help you or if this is something you do, but if you don't do it i suppose it wouldn't hurt to try.....

Good luck...
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Old 08-18-2017, 08:49 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by DeWat View Post
A macerator toilet is not going to burp.
Tank full macerator won't turn on.......time to dump
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Old 08-18-2017, 09:07 AM   #9
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I've found that the SeeLevel system works quite well. Unlike traditional in-tank sensors the SeeLevel sensor is a self-adhesive strip that attaches to the outside of the tank so the sensor itself cannot get fouled. It uses a small radio signal that leaves the right side of the strip and is received at the left side. It has many elements so you can get some nice accurate tradings. It calculates the level based on signal refraction. When the signal passes through the portion of the tank where there is liquid, the signal refracts so the sensor knows this is the correct level and displays it in 2% increments on the display.

The calculation is based on the difference between the signal passing through the liquid and the signal passing through the empty tank portion above the liquid. This method allows for variances in tank thickness.

However, if you get a 1/2" buildup of sludge in a given spot, the system can report a false reading. Also, if you run your tank flusher you may be spraying sludge off the top portion of the tank walls which will slide down and give temporary false readings. Once the tank walls are clean the reading will once again be accurate.

I did have a situation once in 13 years of using SeeLevel where the black tank reading was accurate until I drained the tank. Then suddenly they jumped up to around 42% and stayed there when the tank was empty. Once I started to use the tank the readings returned to being accurate as soon as I filled it to 7%. It turned out I had a buildup of sludge at the 42% level. Once I gave the tank a really good cleaning with Happy Camper's Extreme Cleaner everything worked great again.

I have the information and link on the black tank sprayer someplace but can't find it right now. I have even considered adding a second head to my black tank to improve its operation and minimize flushing time.
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Old 08-18-2017, 11:09 AM   #10
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Thanks Mark, the situation you had once in 13 years sound very similar to mine. We have tried several tank solutions, but I don't think we tried Happy Camper so I will do that asap. As far as sludge buildup... this issue started when our coach was only 6 months old. I did run the tank flush for around an hour after dumping the tank, refilling with fresh water and dumping it again. The issue came back as soon as I flushed the toilet a couple of times and the reading turn to normal when the tank was around 20%.

Will let all know if Happy Camper does the trick ...
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Old 08-18-2017, 12:25 PM   #11
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Jim when we took delivery of our coach direct from Entegra, the holding tank was 68% full, how long and by who, I don't have a clue. Generator had 28 hours on the first delivery, and 46 hours on it when we took the second deliver at Entegra. The delivery guys aren't suppose to use those items, but they do.
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Old 08-18-2017, 01:39 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoHoGo View Post
Thanks Mark, the situation you had once in 13 years sound very similar to mine. We have tried several tank solutions, but I don't think we tried Happy Camper so I will do that asap. As far as sludge buildup... this issue started when our coach was only 6 months old. I did run the tank flush for around an hour after dumping the tank, refilling with fresh water and dumping it again. The issue came back as soon as I flushed the toilet a couple of times and the reading turn to normal when the tank was around 20%.

Will let all know if Happy Camper does the trick ...
Keep in mind that this isn't the regular Happy Camper that you normally use. This is their "extreme" version which is designed for major cleanings like this.

I should also mention that I no longer use Happy Camper, which is a dry product. I went with Pure Power Blue, which is a liquid that was recommended to me by Don Shapansky, the owner of SeeLevel. The reason that I went this way is because I added a reservoir tank with pump (windshield washer from a Bluebird, which is identical to what Entegra uses) back by the tanks to add liquid chemical. I then wired it to a switch inside the coach. So I needed a liquid rather than a powder. Pure Power also makes a purple chemical for sensor cleaning (it's smells bad though) which probably works as well as Happy Camper Extreme.
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Old 08-18-2017, 03:11 PM   #13
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Jim when we took delivery of our coach direct from Entegra, the holding tank was 68% full, how long and by who, I don't have a clue. Generator had 28 hours on the first delivery, and 46 hours on it when we took the second deliver at Entegra. The delivery guys aren't suppose to use those items, but they do.
LOL, Our gen set had 80 hours on it at delivery. When we were at Spartan, Entegra did foot the bill for the initial 50 hour service. Around 300 bucks, so I made sure during the Spartan training to learn how to do the next one :-)
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Old 08-18-2017, 03:37 PM   #14
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Black Tank Flush

Below are 3 pix of the modification I made to my 2016 Anthem.

1.Cut on discharge pipe and drilled hole through wet bay.
2. New routing of 1 1/2 inch ABS pipe to side.
3. Adaption of 1 1/2 inch cam lock connectors with length of clear plastic hose to observe when tank is cleanly flushed.

I clear black tank and then refill twice to approximately 20% and re flush. Then clear grey tank to sterilize hose with soapy water. Then flush Black tank with clean water to clear hose.

If doing this before next leg of travel, put 5 to 10 lbs of ice cubes into black tank just before getting on the road. This will roll around clearing any stuck on debris and will melt for next discharge.
Knock on wood, but this has worked for me for me since first RV 15 years ago.

Good luck and smooth travels...The Balladeer

P.S. This also allows gravity evacuation of the grey tank at campsite hookup.
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