Diagrams

[Tonyd51]

Is there any electrical and plumbing diagrams for the 2014 anthem? Thanks in advance.

[MRUSA14]

I have asked for them repeatedly without success. The factories (both Entegra and Spartan) seem to want to guard these like they were national secrets. I don't get it. When I bought my Beaver they were a part of the standard owner's manual. I think they owe it to us to provide us with these as a means to properly troubleshoot problems in our coaches.

[Nowabeachbum]

Originally Posted by Tonyd51

Is there any electrical and plumbing diagrams for the 2014 anthem? Thanks in advance.

If you have a specific need, I'm sure they would send it to you. I was told that originally, Entegras were built without the benefit of prints. They built them based on how they built the one before it. There were almost no prints acquired from Travel Supreme. As I understand it, they have been working since the beginning on documenting everything and have completed most of the models.

[MRUSA14]

Well we all know they make frequent changes, and so any prints would have to be updated often and matched carefully to the the particular coach involved.

[sailor_lou]

The lack of coach specific documentation is the only complaint I have on my Travel Supreme and I am extremely disappointed to hear that holds true for Entegra too. Since I do ALL my own maintenance, not having wiring and plumbing diagrams makes most jobs quite a bit more difficult than they need to be.

Our first MOHO was a 97 Winne Vectra and any information required (electrical schematics and diagrams including cable routing and connector pin identification, component locations, plumbing diagrams, etc) is available on their website by year and model. There really is no excuse for a quality manufacturer not to have that info available for the owners.

Lou
05 Travel Supreme Envoy

[hogdriver]

Originally Posted by sailor_lou

The lack of coach specific documentation is the only complaint I have on my Travel Supreme and I am extremely disappointed to hear that holds true for Entegra too. Since I do ALL my own maintenance, not having wiring and plumbing diagrams makes most jobs quite a bit more difficult than they need to be.

Our first MOHO was a 97 Winne Vectra and any information required (electrical schematics and diagrams including cable routing and connector pin identification, component locations, plumbing diagrams, etc) is available on their website by year and model. There really is no excuse for a quality manufacturer not to have that info available for the owners.

Lou
05 Travel Supreme Envoy

Agree

If Entegra is not careful the modernized world will pass them by. Why not post the info on their website? Even the highest quality automobiles in the early 1900s were surpassed by the companies that modernized production and support.

[brobox]

Originally Posted by Nowabeachbum

There were almost no prints acquired from Travel Supreme.

I can attest to that, TS didn't have ANY prints. A big complaint from all of us TS owners. I do hope that Entegra does see the errors of TS and corrects that problem.

[DSL417]

Originally Posted by hogdriver

Agree

If Entegra is not careful the modernized world will pass them by. Why not post the info on their website? Even the highest quality automobiles in the early 1900s were surpassed by the companies that modernized production and support.

I agree with all that not having diagrams is unfortunate. I doubt it is company maturity in so much as drawings are very expensive to do according to standard. In government work, where there is a lack of funding, this is one of the first things to drop off an acquisition contract...then everyone scratches their heads when faced with issues that are not in the repair manual. Or, the acquisition is very expensive and comes with drawings to spec as well as a number of other best practices add-ons.

I'm not siding with Entegra on this...simply stating that spec drawings (and from a legal standpoint those are the only type you had better release) could add $3-5K more to each coach produced and sold every year, probably more. They have to be drawn by trained people, connected to the construction engineers, and then maintained (which requires a rigorous process of change control). While my interactions with both Spartan and Entegra suggest strong version control, translation of engineering drawings through some customization that is allowed in each coach (I won't get into what that means except that I do have examples) into spec drawings (ISO 9000 compliant is what you'd want from a legal standpoint) costs big bucks as well as additional staff. Just saying'...there is a cost.

[brobox]

Dave, no argument with what you are saying, but what is wrong with a simple CAD drawing for a certain model year for just wiring and plumping? I don't think most owners care about structural drawings, just simple wiring and plumbing diagram for maintenance and maybe a modification such as adding a ceiling fan.

It would be nice to look in an owners manual and see where the GFI's are located or which outlet are on the inverter. Just everyday simple things we never had with the Travel Supreme that should have been included to owners.

[papaw1]

And there are always legal disclaimer clauses.

[DSL417]

As I said...drawings are expensive...maybe they have weighed, up to this point, the number of people asking for them against the cost...I have no idea...except to say, that the business of the CS desk would suggest that most don't come close to doing any serious troubleshooting on their own. OTOH, maybe more would if they had drawings. Just one question...where do you draw the line between just simple drawings and standards-based drawings? It is the standards-based drawings that assure anyone can read them and know, or in most cases, not know, what they are looking at.

Keep in mind, it is not one, simple CAD drawing. Each model's plumbing and electrical lines run a little different.

I do think one thing...the more people who leave their two year warrantee period, the more people will want drawings and try to learn how to troubleshoot their coach problems...no one likes to spend $100/hr out of their own pocket trying to figure out where and what the problem is before it can be fixed.

[sailor_lou]

Dave,

I agree there is a cost involved, but it isn't the same as it was years ago when we had drafters laying it out on paper and mylar. Once a specific floorplan is completed, updates as the model changes each year can be performed relatively quickly and then stored electronically forever. Retrieving it after is easy and inexpensive. I would also think the manufacturer would use this info when they initially lay out the cables/pipe routings to identify quantities required and any potential obstructions. They must know beforehand how many wires are running from the front to the back of the coach and where they separate off to specific controls and loads. Determining this on construction floor can be expensive.

As you identified, a majority of owners would not understand what they are looking at, but there must be some time (and therefore cost) savings to Entegra when a coach is at an authorized service center for warranty work. However, I must admit that I've never been to a MOHO factory so I do not know their construction practices or how they interface with service techs in the field.

I guess to me the bottom line is that Winne and probably others do it successfully, so I see no reason why Entegra can't.

Lou
05 Travel Supreme Envoy

[MRUSA14]

A lot of CS calls may not even occur if drawings were included. As it is, they will be getting calls for assistance long after the 2-yr warranty is up because troubleshooting will be so difficult.

An example: When my Beaver was about 5 years old, the antenna booster lost power. I could not figure out why until I consulted the 12V schematic and saw that it was powered by a specific fuse. I replaced the fuse but after a short while it was out again. So I again consulted the schematic and saw what other items were on that circuit. By checking all the wiring to those items I was able to fix the problem without ever having called Beaver for help.

How would I be able to do this on my Entegra with no wiring diagram? How many phone calls to CS would it take?

[Tonyd51]

Thanks for all the responses. I agree that there is costs involved with drawings, but they build to some sort of spec. That, I would think, means that there are drawings already made. As some one mentioned, others do it quite well. Winnie being one of them. My last motor home was an itasca and although not specific to one mh the drawings were here on line. Up to you to decide what fit your RV.