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Old 10-10-2016, 09:50 AM   #505
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Cool, now you can BBQ and have a propane campfire inside when it rains. Never mind the carbon monoxide.
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Old 10-10-2016, 10:57 AM   #506
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To answer some questions: In the new ORV units some have eliminated the sliding seat portion of the dinette to opt for a larger nicer table.

In some units with the larger slide per Kevin they actually added a support member inside the dinette to help eliminate the sagging issues with the larger slides. Since they already had backing in that location it was an easy solution to eliminate the potential sag on the larger slides. They do recommend that the slide only be sat in while fully extended since it's not supported in it's full length unless extended where it sits on the pin rollers and the mechanism helps support the slide. They added more pin rollers on some models for additional support. The smaller slides in some models now have schwinteck slides on top and bottom for ease of operation and I would think some additional support ( not sure about that but it would ease function on slide operation).

4X4 and others concern about ventilation is well founded because folks have died while camping in a tent with LP heaters going to stay warm. If it can happen in a tent it can happen in an rv because they're much better sealed. In today's world I'd opt for electric heating because it's much safer but I've used lp heaters in the past many times with ventilation they work very well. Lbzya is a smart guy so I'm sure he'll take the necessary precautions. Trouble with Carbon monoxide is it's puts you into a deeper sleep until you go into the final one so you can't normally wake up to stop it. Crack 2 ventilation sources just to be safe.
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Old 10-10-2016, 06:09 PM   #507
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Thanks Skeetsbo for the complement.

Indeed, two windows will be cracked and the bathroom maxx air vent set to a lower setting. Aside from the oxygen, LP produces moisture so having fresh air coming through is a must. I agree with electric and that is what we generally use if we have hook ups.
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Old 10-11-2016, 06:05 PM   #508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motcrew12 View Post
How do you vent an LP appliance like that?

Here are a couple of the warnings that come with the Buddy heaters sold in Canada & Massachusetts.

WARNING:
DO NOT USE THIS HEATER INSIDE!

CARBON MONOXIDE HAZARD

This appliance can produce carbon monoxide which has no odor.
Using it in an enclosed space can kill you.
Never use this appliance in an enclosed space such as a camper, tent, car or home.

http://www.mrheater.com/downloads/dl...anada_2016.pdf
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Old 10-11-2016, 09:08 PM   #509
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Just like I said in the other topic thread where you posted the exact same thing, ...

If a window is open, it no longer meets the definition of "enclosed".

Quote:
en·close
verb
1. surround or close off on all sides.
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Old 10-12-2016, 12:09 PM   #510
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N00b question: why is the regular furnace not adequate?
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Old 10-12-2016, 02:03 PM   #511
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1: Noisy, in some peoples mind. My wife's almost deaf, so it doesn't bother her!!

2: If not hooked up to electric, uses too much battery. Bigger deal with only one battery!!

3: Propane use! But in reality, they don't use that much!! If hooked up to elec, then use an electric space heater!!

4: Something to argue aboot!!!!
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Old 10-13-2016, 02:06 AM   #512
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N00b question: why is the regular furnace not adequate?
The heater in our 270dbhs draws 6 amps. When we used it in the low 30's the heater will will drain two 6V batteries in 14-18hours. Battery capacity at 32F is 15-20% less than it is at 70F.
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Old 10-13-2016, 11:03 PM   #513
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The heater in our 270dbhs draws 6 amps. When we used it in the low 30's the heater will will drain two 6V batteries in 14-18hours. Battery capacity at 32F is 15-20% less than it is at 70F.
This is where LiFePO4 batteries shine especially since you can keep them in the conditioned living area because they don't vent like other batteries. They also have a much better weight to power ratio than lead acid batteries.

That said, your numbers just don't make sense unless you have small batteries. Knowing the AH rating of the batteries would help understand why they only last 14-18 hours. Also what else is running during that time.
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Old 10-14-2016, 07:34 AM   #514
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This is where LiFePO4 batteries shine especially since you can keep them in the conditioned living area because they don't vent like other batteries. They also have a mu and better weight to power ratio than lead acid batteries.

That said, your numbers just don't make sense unless you have small batteries. Knowing the AH rating of the batteries would help understand why they only last 14-18 hours. Also what else is running during that time.
Most of us with lead-acid batteries don't want to discharge them much over 50% of max capacity as that severely reduces their lifetime. So a pair might have an "effective" Ah rating of only 110Ah, reduced by 20% in cold weather to ~90Ah. Perhaps jtbuilds does his calculations similarly.

Like you say, LiFePO4 has many nice properties (for another one, you can use ~80% of their Ah rating), but they're still very expensive, require some additional electronics and relays to ensure each cell is balanced and not over or under charged. Also they shouldn't be charged at freezing temperatures (although they can be stored and discharged then). I looked long and hard at them, but eventually just added a couple more gc2s to the pair I already had.
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Old 10-14-2016, 10:46 AM   #515
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Most of us with lead-acid batteries don't want to discharge them much over 50% of max capacity as that severely reduces their lifetime. So a pair might have an "effective" Ah rating of only 110Ah, reduced by 20% in cold weather to ~90Ah. Perhaps jtbuilds does his calculations similarly.
Yea, if you running at those levels I can see running out of power quickly. You really would need 200AH or more to be safe.

Quote:
Like you say, LiFePO4 has many nice properties (for another one, you can use ~80% of their Ah rating), but they're still very expensive, require some additional electronics and relays to ensure each cell is balanced and not over or under charged. Also they shouldn't be charged at freezing temperatures (although they can be stored and discharged then). I looked long and hard at them, but eventually just added a couple more gc2s to the pair I already had.
I agree that they are expensive but I wouldn't worry about the extra electronics to keep them balances. The added electronics isn't expensive or hard to install. You can get complete kits with all of the electronics already installed. You can also charge from a lead acid charger if it cab be reprogrammed although they are not optimum. Even Progressive Dynamics is making LiFePO4 chargers that are basically a drop in replacement for the lead acid charger/converters currently in use.

At least we're getting closer every day.
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Old 10-15-2016, 11:03 AM   #516
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N00b question: why is the regular furnace not adequate?
As many have said, the factory furnace is loud, uses a ton of fuel and drains the batteries very fast. The RV furnaces are behind the times when it comes efficiency. One could retire quickly if they wanted spend the time and design and manufacture a furnace that is quiet and say 98% efficient. Better yet a heat pump that runs on 12 volts.
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Old 10-21-2016, 05:21 PM   #517
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Getting back to the subject of this thread!!!

New, larger table for us!!
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Old 10-21-2016, 11:30 PM   #518
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Getting back to the subject of this thread!!!

New, larger table for us!!
Nicely done! Kudos! In answer to a long ago post, we are well settled in Pasco, made it through the summer (with AC) and are planning our winter get away. In the meantime, I'm replacing the power cord receptacle in the rig and adding a new satellite TV input connector that will be within 2 feet of the receiver. (I am suspicious of the long cables, and their terminals, in the rig.)

Cheers!

Bob
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