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Old 09-29-2016, 12:17 PM   #1
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5th wheel and a 3/4 ton diesel short bed?

I've read some posts that a 3/4 ton is fine but you need to stay under a certain footage like 35' or less. Which is fine for me.

Also read that a short bed will work just need a sliding hitch.

I'm just curious if others have a 3/4 ton diesel short bed and if it's a bad experience overall with a 5th wheel or if it's no problem.

I'm considering switching to a 5th from a class A because I already have this truck and I sort of want to get out from under this high dollar class A before it loses too much more value. I just am curious what others experience is with a similar setup. I really like the ease of the class A, but my friend that has a 5th said his is just as easy to setup.
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Old 09-29-2016, 12:47 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandonrv View Post
I've read some posts that a 3/4 ton is fine but you need to stay under a certain footage like 35' or less. Which is fine for me.

Also read that a short bed will work just need a sliding hitch.

I'm just curious if others have a 3/4 ton diesel short bed and if it's a bad experience overall with a 5th wheel or if it's no problem.

I'm considering switching to a 5th from a class A because I already have this truck and I sort of want to get out from under this high dollar class A before it loses too much more value. I just am curious what others experience is with a similar setup. I really like the ease of the class A, but my friend that has a 5th said his is just as easy to setup.
It really depends on the weight of the specific trailer as well as the specific specs for the truck. Also, it's best to stay within the capabilities of your truck by using the math (I am sure SmokeyWren will be along soon with that) instead of going by what someone tells you or what you see others do. There are many that are more than happy to give you horrible advice when it comes to towing, even here. But listen to people like SmokyWren. Also, please remember, you not only need to pull the trailer, but stop it too.
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Old 09-29-2016, 12:50 PM   #3
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I have an 06 duramax 6' bed with a kz 5er. No issues with mine at all. It's a lighter 5er so that helps but I wouldn't be afraid at all to go heavier. I bought a reese 16k slider but never have to slide the hitch.....the extended pin box and design of the front of the 5er give me plenty of room. I can go almost 90 degrees if I had to and frankly if you're having the turn it that far you're not doing it right. I rarely ever have to get it sharp enough to where the cab/5er clearance is even remotely close.
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Old 09-29-2016, 12:52 PM   #4
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Brandonrv,
I have a 04 f-250 crewcab short bed diesel and pull a 36' Bighorn with a hitch weight of 1995lbs and the rig weights around 13000lbs.
I have no problem pulling it with this truck, my mileage went down to around 12mpg.
As for the sliding hitch I have one but didn't need it as most of the newer 5th wheels are designed so you can turn without hitting the cab.
I would suggest getting air bags for the rear as they help the ride.
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Old 09-29-2016, 12:56 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raineman View Post
It really depends on the weight of the specific trailer as well as the specific specs for the truck. Also, it's best to stay within the capabilities of your truck by using the math (I am sure SmokeyWren will be along soon with that) instead of going by what someone tells you or what you see others do. There are many that are more than happy to give you horrible advice when it comes to towing, even here. But listen to people like SmokyWren. Also, please remember, you not only need to pull the trailer, but stop it too.
The truck can tow 18,000 lbs and has a payload of 3800.

The trailers I'm looking at are in the 32'-34' range and are 11k lbs fully loaded and 1750 hitch weight so it's all well within the abilities of the truck.

Just not really any way for me to test pull a trailer since I don't even have the hitch yet. So i was mainly curious the comfort level people have with a similar setup.


I don't want it to be a hassle such that I don't enjoy taking the trailer out.
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Old 09-29-2016, 05:10 PM   #6
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I have an AF27-5 and tow with a Ext Cab GMC 2500 short bed. I'd recommend a B&W companion and be sure you get a fiver with an extended pin box for sure and a curved front if possible. Towed a 34' flat front before with no problems. Just watch your weights and you'll be fine.
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Old 09-29-2016, 07:13 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandonrv View Post
I've read some posts that a 3/4 ton is fine but you need to stay under a certain footage like 35' or less. Which is fine for me.

Also read that a short bed will work just need a sliding hitch.

I'm just curious if others have a 3/4 ton diesel short bed and if it's a bad experience overall with a 5th wheel or if it's no problem.

I'm considering switching to a 5th from a class A because I already have this truck and I sort of want to get out from under this high dollar class A before it loses too much more value. I just am curious what others experience is with a similar setup. I really like the ease of the class A, but my friend that has a 5th said his is just as easy to setup.
As others have said, the new nose cap designs minimize any issues with towing/turning with a short bed truck. We have the Anderson Ultimate hitch. No slider and no problems. We've had to make more than one U turn since buying our Cougar and never worried about it after seeing what we could do the first time. We've also had to back into some pretty tight places and have not had any issues.
IMHO Landing our 5th wheel is easier than unhooking the TOAD
As for set up, look into an auto leveling system. Ours is equipped with the LCI 4 point version and we like it for the added convenience.
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Old 09-29-2016, 08:26 PM   #8
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I am on my third fifth wheel being towed with short bed trucks! I am now pulling a 34RL Cedar Creek 5th wheel with a 2008 Ram Mega Cab diesel 2500. This has a short bed 6'.5"" but has the same wheel base as a Crew Cab long bed truck. I am using a Reese manual slider hitch and a Trailair king pin box when towing. The truck has air bags for improve ride when towing.
I towed the Cedar Creek out west last year to Utah, Colorado, Arizona and New Mexico wiithout any issue the truck ran great. I have towed almost 10,000 miles on this trailer without any issues at all,this is a great combination.
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Old 09-29-2016, 08:31 PM   #9
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I towed my 08 big country with a short bed F250 diesel for several years with no problems. Never had a slider hitch and never worried about the 5ver hitting the cab. I now have a heavier 5ver that I tow with a long bed DRW. As far as ease of setting up the 5ver. I have the 6 point auto leveling system and after I unhook I press a button and while it levels itself I'm hooking up the electrical and water. Takes me less than 15 minutes and it's very easy. After watching people set up class A's, mine doesn't take any less to setup especially if they have a toad to unload and in that case they take longer.
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Old 09-29-2016, 09:33 PM   #10
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As far as weights go -

Put your truck on the scales and keep the following in mind -

- Your GVWR is the total weight that can rest on the 4 tires of the truck.
Keep in mind that GVWR includes everything you put in the truck (people, fuel, and... hitch weight of the trailer)

- Your rear axle rating is the max load your rear axle can carry. Note that your tires also have a load rating on them. To get the most out of your set up you need to make sure your rear tire pair is at least load rated to the rear axle rating, preferably more (the load rating I am referencing is the load rating number on the sidewall, not the range letter -D, E, etc)

What you should do is this:
Load your truck as you would on a trip. Figure up how much the people in the truck weigh if they can't be along with you. Weigh the truck - total weight, the weight on the front axle, and the weight on the rear axle. Take your GVWR and subtract your total weight. This is the real-world available left-over payload.

Payload isn't a number printed in a product guide, a spec the manufacturer gives a vehicle, etc. Any spec'd payload usually includes everything resting on the 4 tires of the truck that is above the dry weight of the truck. The only true way to find out is to measure and do a little math based on GVWR.

Now the catch - if the weight is distributed right you should have no trouble getting this payload under the rear axle rating. You may be surprised with the numbers, though. Just always make sure that what ever weight you add to the truck that you never exceed the rear axle rating, or tire load rating (which ever is less).

In my case my truck is about 8500lbs with me in it, so figure 8900lbs loaded for the example. My GVWR is 11,500lbs. Subtract 8900lbs and what is left is 2600lbs for the pin weight of the hitch.

Note, also, that the basements of 5th wheels are well in front of the axle, in fact closer to the hitch. The majority of the weight you put in the basement is adding to your pin weight. Dry 5th wheel weights are pretty much meaningless. If you take the GVWR of the 5th wheel and factor 20-25% of the gross as pin weight this will get you close. In my example - if I work that backwards at 20% pin weight being 2600lbs that correlates to a gross trailer weight of 13,000lbs. Not much. That is.. if I stay within all the numbers.
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Old 09-29-2016, 09:38 PM   #11
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i have a 2008 3/4 Chevy with 6.6 diesel pulling 35 ft Holiday Rambler - i have a slender hitch and can put the trailer anywhere i need to

14k is at the top end of weight - even with new breaks - and electric brakes set to the highest level it was a bit concerning trying to stop that much weight on 6% or better grades. i added the Banks Turbo break and have looked back - the newer version have the turbo brakes- so i would recommend added breaking - this is after 8 years pulling my trailer all over the west
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Old 09-30-2016, 08:47 AM   #12
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2015 Silverado 2500HD pulling a Cougar 28SGS (31'5" ) Our truck is a short bed (6'4") and crew cab. NO probs with our "Non Slider" B&W Patriot hitch. As mentioned before alot of these newer 5vrs have a "max turn" (curved) nose and or a extended pin box... Ours has Plenty of room... No need here for a slider, but could be on other setups.
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Old 09-30-2016, 01:42 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandonrv View Post
The truck can tow 18,000 lbs and has a payload of 3800.

The trailers I'm looking at are in the 32'-34' range and are 11k lbs fully loaded and 1750 hitch weight so it's all well within the abilities of the truck.

Just not really any way for me to test pull a trailer since I don't even have the hitch yet. So i was mainly curious the comfort level people have with a similar setup.


I don't want it to be a hassle such that I don't enjoy taking the trailer out.
Your numbers sound a little high for a 3/4 ton, might want to double check them. Better no for sure then be super bummed out. It takes a lot of add-a-boys to make up for the one oooops.
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Old 10-01-2016, 09:38 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyFishn View Post
As far as weights go -

Put your truck on the scales and keep the following in mind -

- Your GVWR is the total weight that can rest on the 4 tires of the truck.
Keep in mind that GVWR includes everything you put in the truck (people, fuel, and... hitch weight of the trailer)

- Your rear axle rating is the max load your rear axle can carry. Note that your tires also have a load rating on them. To get the most out of your set up you need to make sure your rear tire pair is at least load rated to the rear axle rating, preferably more (the load rating I am referencing is the load rating number on the sidewall, not the range letter -D, E, etc)

What you should do is this:
Load your truck as you would on a trip. Figure up how much the people in the truck weigh if they can't be along with you. Weigh the truck - total weight, the weight on the front axle, and the weight on the rear axle. Take your GVWR and subtract your total weight. This is the real-world available left-over payload.

Payload isn't a number printed in a product guide, a spec the manufacturer gives a vehicle, etc. Any spec'd payload usually includes everything resting on the 4 tires of the truck that is above the dry weight of the truck. The only true way to find out is to measure and do a little math based on GVWR.

Now the catch - if the weight is distributed right you should have no trouble getting this payload under the rear axle rating. You may be surprised with the numbers, though. Just always make sure that what ever weight you add to the truck that you never exceed the rear axle rating, or tire load rating (which ever is less).

In my case my truck is about 8500lbs with me in it, so figure 8900lbs loaded for the example. My GVWR is 11,500lbs. Subtract 8900lbs and what is left is 2600lbs for the pin weight of the hitch.

Note, also, that the basements of 5th wheels are well in front of the axle, in fact closer to the hitch. The majority of the weight you put in the basement is adding to your pin weight. Dry 5th wheel weights are pretty much meaningless. If you take the GVWR of the 5th wheel and factor 20-25% of the gross as pin weight this will get you close. In my example - if I work that backwards at 20% pin weight being 2600lbs that correlates to a gross trailer weight of 13,000lbs. Not much. That is.. if I stay within all the numbers.

Well said!

This is good advise...

Here is my experience:

My 39' Cedar Creek 36CKTS loaded up had a pin weight of 3200 lbs and put me over on my GVWR and RAWR of the 2015 Ram 2500 CCSB Cummins I was towing it with.

The truck towed fine and handeled good. The rig also stopped great because I added disc brakes to the Cedar Creek.

I felt comfortable with the rig...until I weighed it loaded and found out I was over on the rear axle by 200 lbs and 2000 lbs over the GVWR.

For my trailer... for 3 reasons it needed to be behind a truck with higher ratings:

1. Legalities
2. Insurance
3. Peace of mind

I now have a 2016 Ram 3500 CCLB Dually. The higher gear ratio and 4 tire rear axle platform has made for an even better towing experience than with the 2500.

BTW the old truck....(2500 CCSB Diesel) had a 17100 lbs towing max and a listed payload of 2100 lbs. The stated capabilities of your 3/4 ton seem too high to me too.

HTH!
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