Beefing up a F250

[SmokeyWren]

Originally Posted by bighamstoy

Have an '02 F250 4x4 7.3 diesel XLT Crew cab short bed (hope that's enough info). Can this truck handle a 5th. Wheel with around 2500# at the pin with some suspension mods?

No, not without being severely overloaded. No suspension or other mods will change your 8,800 pounds GVWR. Air bags can level the truck to prevent the headlights from aiming at the stars, but you'll still be severely overloaded. The 7.3L diesel engine has plenty of power to PULL the heavy trailer, but not enough suspension, rear axle weight capacity, etc., to HAUL the hitch weight.

I had a similar tow vehicle. It was overloaded by 400 to 800 pounds with a 25' 5er that had one slide, GVWR of 7,900 pounds, and wet and loaded pin weight of 1,400 pounds. Mine was a 4x2 longbed diesel, with about 200 pounds more unused payload capacity than your 4x4 shorty. (The shorty is about 200 pounds lighter, and the 4x4 is about 400 pounds heavier than my 4x2 longbed, ith the same GVWR, resulting in your pickup being about 200 pounds heavier than mine.). So you'll be even more overloaded than I was. The V-10 gasser was about 600 pounds lighter than the diesel, so it had about 600 pounds more available payload. If I had had a V-10, or an F-350 SRW with 9,900 pounds GVWR, I wouldn't have been overloaded during most of my towing trips with that 25' 5er.

Whoever said the rear axles are the same in the 7.3L F-250 and the F-350 SRW hasn't read the specs. Both look the same, but the guts are different. Per the 2002 Ford Truck source Book, the F-250 rear axle is rated for 6,084 pounds @ground. The F-350 SRW rear axle is rated for 6,830 pounds @ground.

The weight ratings are established by professional engineers (PE) specializing in chassis engineering. Marketing types and even management types wouldn't dare change the weight ratings from what the PEs established. Ford would be sued, and lose the lawsuit, if they tried such a stupid move. So go by what your truck is rated for by Ford, not the opinion of internet posters who are not chassis engineer PEs.

Will the 7.3L PULL the big 5er with no problem. Of course. That diesel engine is a powerhouse, especially if pumped up to around 300 HP and 600 lb/ft torque with a towing tune. That's probably why you see so many overloaded '99-2003 F-250s with the 7.3L diesel engine. Most of the ignorant owners don't even realize they're overloaded, because the truck pulls the load so effortlessly. But the CAT scale doesn't lie. If the total of your front and rear axle weights exceed 8,800 pounds, you're overloaded.

[CampDaven]

Why not just trade for a similar vintage DRW 1 ton. You will feel better and not be wondering. And no mods to buy!!!

[caissiel]

Originally Posted by CampDaven

Why not just trade for a similar vintage DRW 1 ton. You will feel better and not be wondering. And no mods to buy!!!

With the same GCWR. But heavier truck reducing trailer capacity.

[RustyJC]

Not if you're going to stay within ALL the manufacturer's ratings. The F250 will exceed GVWR and then rear axle GAWR long before it ever reaches its GCWR. The higher GVWR and rear axle GAWR are why the 1-ton dually can handle a larger 5th wheel than a 3/4 ton SRW truck with the same GCWR.

Most later 1-ton duallies have a higher available GCWR than is available on 3/4 or 1-ton SRW trucks - that's certainly the case with mine.

Rusty

[TXiceman]

My 2012 F350 CC DRW has a GVWR or 13,300# and a GCWR of 30,000#. You cannot get that in a SRW truck.

The 3/4 ton toter drivers seem to feel they have safety in numbers. If enough of them keep telling themselves the same story, they will eventually believe it...BUT it still is not any closer to being true.

Ken

[JIMNLIN]

If it a actual max 2500 lbs it may handle it without any suspension mods to the truck which is easy to do with any size truck.

We add heavier rated springs to the rear main spring pack/higher rated wheels and tires to any truck. As mentioned by more experienced posters about the '02 F250 vs F350 SRW differences, Ford specs show the difference in the F250 and F350 is higher rated wheels/tires and springs. (6084 RAWR vs 6820 RAWR)
Ford uses the same 10.5" Sterling rear axle for the F250/F350 SRW which has the same carrier/gears /bearing/axles/brakes/truck frame according to Fleet Fords spec sheets from Fords engineers instead of what we see posted on RV websites.

First off trucks carry weight legally determined by the trucks mfg RAWR/tire load rating in the case of a pickup pulling a GN/5th wheel trailer. Your state may also have a registered weight of some kind. Some states don't.
Example only;
The F250 has a 6084 RAWR and may weigh 2800-3000 lbs unladin which leaves 3000-3200 lbs for a max axle payload. Adding your mods won't change any numbers but will give the trucks rear suspension the ability to carry more weight.

Also a 36'-38' toy hauler is going to be in the 15k possible 18k = 3000-4000 lbs of pin weight. IMO thats out of your older F250 realistic expectations. And its well above the 12500 lb tow rating Ford gives the '02 F250/F350 SRW and DRW trucks.

[caissiel]

I would not attemt to tow any toyhauler with a SRW. The pin weights are unpredictable. Due to allowable weights for storage.

[Deck]

Be careful with the air bag idea. They are great for leveling a load, but will do absolutely nothing to increase your GVWR. If you overload your truck, its overloaded! Level or not. Period.

[bighamstoy]

Thanks for all the input. A rep at camping world said this to me the other day. "Basically, a dual axel 5er can be towed by a 3/4 ton truck, a triple axel takes a 1 ton" Not an exact quote, but close. I assume he is incorrect....Anyway, seems we have three options.... 1. Buy an F350 DRW & 5er toy hauler. 2. Buy a motorhome & I enclosed trailer for Harley/Jeep. 3. Buy a much smaller TT toy hauler so it tows easier than my FS3000, which is 35' long....

[mga60tw]

Originally Posted by TXiceman

My 2012 F350 CC DRW has a GVWR or 13,300# and a GCWR of 30,000#. You cannot get that in a SRW truck.

The 3/4 ton toter drivers seem to feel they have safety in numbers. If enough of them keep telling themselves the same story, they will eventually believe it...BUT it still is not any closer to being true.

Ken

Don't forget all the 1/2 ton drivers who think their F150 and Tundra can tow anything. I have been on the road for the last 3 months and have seen so many 1/2 tons towing fifth wheels and 30 foot trailers that it really scares me. Do your homework and don't put yourself, family and others in danger. Just because you can tow it doesn't mean you should!!

[V-Man]

I know this is an old thread, but just my $0.01 worth (not worth 2 cents, but maybe worth 1):

I've got a huge toy hauler 5th wheel. Towing this critter with a Dodge 3/4 ton diesel (for now). It's legal if I load it very very lightly. Only a little gas in the generator tank, none in the other gas tank, no water (fresh, grey, or black), only a little bit of food, and just the clothes I'll need for the trip. Doing it this way, I'm just barely under max ratings for my truck. It pulls great, stops great, but . . . the handling in high cross winds leaves a little to be desired. I need the stability of the dual rear wheels and the lower center of gravity allowed by loading the heavy stuff that I have to leave at home for now.

I will be upgrading the truck to either a medium duty (class 6; both Freightliner and International make some nice ones) or heavy duty (class 8) before fully loading my trailer and going full time. In fact, getting the proper tow vehicle is the only thing left to do before going full time!

[Bamaman]

I bought a 2003 F250 crewcab 2wd SRW SWB truck new, and have just purchase my first fifth wheel. In reading online, I now realize the shortcoming of any 3/4 ton truck is the ability to handle heavy bed loads--and PIN weight is a big consideration.

I bought a Grand Design 323BHS fifth wheel with a 2000 lb. pin weight and a total dry weight of 12K. I have the power to tow more, but I'm really at my maximum weight limit.

To prepare such a truck, you should start by adding a B&M or TruCool automatic transmission filter ($150). Then, a set of Air Ride rear airbags would be great ($270). I have a D-P tuner installed ($310) with a 60 hp tow program. A pyrometer/transmission/boost gauge set is required ($303). I put a 16K B&W Patriot fifth wheel hitch ($325) and Curt's custom frame mount for the cross rails ($195). A Curt wiring kit is $65.

And any truck used in towing should be aligned and checked to make sure the brakes, front and rear suspension and tires are at 100% condition.

But if you're intending to tow one of the 3K/14K full size toy haulers, there's no substitution to dual rear wheel 1 tons. Trade your truck, and then do the same modifications I've made.

[99-Am.Star]

I think if any one is asking how they can beef up their truck already knows they are well over the weight that is allowed. If they want to take the chance then I won't be able to stop them. However I will say this, If they wreck and involve me, I will ask that their rig be weighed, and that information be placed in the accident report. Please think about the other people you will affect with your choice.
OK, now you can go ahead and flame me for telling the truth. My flame suit is on so you won't hurt me........

[bighamstoy]

So, do they make any toy hauler 5ers that are light enough for my F250? Looking at a Hyper Lite 30HFS5 XLR by Forest River.