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Old 06-01-2013, 12:30 AM   #1
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Lippert Frames

Does Columbus or Jayco use the Lippert frames?
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Old 06-01-2013, 01:43 AM   #2
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Seen them in Holiday Rambler, and Cougar, heard about them in Forest River. Do you need info on identifying them , pictures available at
www.lippertrepairparts.com
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Old 06-01-2013, 09:00 PM   #3
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Quote:
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. Do you need info on identifying them , pictures available at
www.lippertrepairparts.com
Ummmmmmm. No. Wrong Lippert. That link is to Lippert Repair Parts. If you want frames, you must go to Lippert Components:
Lippert Components
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Old 06-02-2013, 09:59 AM   #4
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Ah, the RV frames, Lippert and others, let the saga continue.
Paper thin in structural areas.

Wrong gauge tubing in structural areas (original on the left, new replacement on the right).

More paper thin stuff in the pinbox area

Oh yes, if we need to strengthen the pinbox area we just weld in some junk pieces of angle iron in there.

If the junk dealer can get $625 bucks for them they must be good enough.

Structural engineering, "we no need no stinkn' structural engineer".

Just weld that tube in the front and add those two piddly pieces of tube and an angle, should be good enough on that 36 footer.

Welding, listen we have a great apprentice program, we even post pictures of what "bad welds look like".


This way the guys can tell if they are making "progress" and moving along on the chart. For those who haven't made it all the way to the left "on the chart", there are always the dealers to catch it after customers bring the frames back.








They do know how to build "real frames" at SpaceCraft Corporation.



But that is not a very smart company, they don't even have a dealer network, they sell direct. If they just got rid of their welders, sold the frame building and bought their frames from Lippert, they could save so much dough they would have a cut for the dealers, BS and snag more customers and is some come back bitchin', the dealers' job would be to "buffer" it.

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Old 06-02-2013, 10:12 AM   #5
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You have to remember, Lippert is a manufacturer that simply welds the frames to the specifications of the end user. So low quality steel? Too thin of material? Those are,squarely on the lap of he trailer builder. Now poor welds, yes I agree that is a Lippert issue. Not all Lippert plants are the same either. Lippert has plants all over the country. Usually next door to or very close to the trailer assembly line. Some do excellent work, some the work is so poor I am suprised thet can actually get through the production line before failling.
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Old 06-02-2013, 10:13 AM   #6
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hjs,
What are you rebuilding? And why?
Thanks for the pictures of what can be wrong with a fiver frame.
Joe
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Old 06-02-2013, 11:00 AM   #7
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Just get a Northwood, they make their own frames in house.
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Old 06-02-2013, 11:17 AM   #8
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The problem with Lippert and to some extent the history repeats itself here as with Fleetwood which met its demise, is that these are no longer manufacturing companies but holding companies. They have piles of cash and run around the country sucking up profitable enterprises so they can shine brightly on the Wall Street. I don't doubt that they have technology savvy individuals in their boardroom, but I also know that in a holding company financial performance if first and foremost long before technology. If they buy a well run company and "leave it alone" then everything is swell, if they try to "improve it's performance" that's when you see things like I show above.
I spent all my life in product design and manufacture and purchased a lot of stuff from outside suppliers, huge and small and you are right the responsibility of designing the product right was on my shoulders. It was also my responsibility as a VP of Operations (read manufacturing) not to allow junk on the production floor. If Lippert sent me a truck load of frames welded like that, the truck would be going right back to where it came from.
Unfortunately, the RV industry does not have the level of sophistication seen in other industries, that's perhaps too broad, there are exceptions. Many companies are small, volume and dollar wise and they don't have a metallurgy of structural engineer on the staff. If they design a frame (and send the drawing to Lippert) it was perhaps done by their "welding guy" they keep around to fix things. The thinking in "structural terms" shown in the picture with three arrows borders on idiotic.
My question would be, if Lippert got a drawing like that, would they call the customer and ask what kind of idiot designed that or would they just build a truck load of them and send an invoice.
In two companies I ran and in one that I worked for, we did engineering design for other customers. Even our "brilliant" customers occasionally had a bad idea, you point it out to them and you certainly don't build if it goes contrary to common sense or endangers those who are going to use it.

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Old 06-02-2013, 01:59 PM   #9
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wingnut60, I "fool around" with big trucks.

What I have for a fifth you can see on this post.
Fwd Living Room.... Height/Head Room issue
It was custom build and it has massive dual frame, welded by "certified welders" in 1995 still on the road today.
Some of the pictures above came from this, piece of #@$^, yes I did buy it.

See that bulge in front cap, I took off the underbelly and what I saw there led me to the "frame expertise".

hjs
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Old 06-02-2013, 04:25 PM   #10
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Does Columbus or Jayco use the Lippert frames?
To answer your question, Jayco used Dexter Frames for many years, recently Lippert bought Dexter's Frame Business.

Our Jayco has a Dexter Frame under it.
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Old 06-02-2013, 05:03 PM   #11
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Before Dexter purchased Leland Engineering, Jayco used Leland Engineering frames.

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Old 06-02-2013, 05:21 PM   #12
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I am envious of your fabrication abilities. Not too many like you around, or at least I don't run into any.
A good welder is worth finding; a good one with pride in his work is priceless.
Joe
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Old 06-02-2013, 06:42 PM   #13
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Joe, truer words were never spoken. I designed many trucks over the years and had a hand in building them, you can see them here.
https://picasaweb.google.com/1015864...eat=directlink.
That means I needed to find shops that could take this,

and have this roll out after few months.

And the major key to the whole enterprise were skilled welders. Contrary to what some might think, there is no shortage of skilled and good welders. What is also true, that you can't find them working for a minimum wage, or even twice the minimum wage. Perhaps, that's the problem with Lippert, their compensation plan doesn't allow their shop foremen to hire welders who have attained the requisite level of welding skills.

I've had dealings with Dexter over the years and have met their engineering staff and their VP of Engineering. Absolutely outstanding group of professionals and it showed in the quality of their products and in the integrity of their designs.
It would be "interesting" to see what will happen to those two factors now that they are members of the "Lippert family".

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Old 06-02-2013, 09:12 PM   #14
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Before Dexter purchased Leland Engineering, Jayco used Leland Engineering frames.

Rusty
Yep, our first Jayco had a LeLand Frame, our current Jayco has a Dexter Frame, when we get ready for another 5er, who knows what brand / model / frame we will wind up with.
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