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Old 02-28-2015, 12:06 AM   #71
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Quote:
My LT tires on the unit are now 6 years old and I have no fear.
Never lost a tire in 13 years. Lost 2 ST trailer tires per year before using LT tires 13 Years ago. So after 20 tires in 10 years I have a reason to use LTs.
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Regardless of all the BS in this thread, the quote above is a commen one. LT tires work! My trailer carries ~ 11,500 on the tires. The ST tires that came with my trailer were supposed to be good to 14,000 pounds. One blew up and did $1000 damage to my trailer. Inspection of the remaining tires found that another one was about to go. I filed a claim and the tire distributor bought all 5 of my ST tires back. I got nothing for damages (pictures and story found around post 15 in this thread).

I switched to LT tires. I added a tire pressure monitoring system. I have not had any tire trouble since (10,000 miles).

Anybody that that has a TPMS system can testify about how much tire pressure varies with temperature. Trying to keep ST tires at a cold inflation pressure of 80#s (E rated) is a pain in the butt. On the other hand, I feel comfortable starting out with my LT G rated tires anywhere from 95 -105 pound. The TPMS system tells me that the pressure goes up ~12#s and the temperature goes up ~ 7 degrees as the tires come up to operating temperature.

I'll never spend money on ST tires again.
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Old 02-28-2015, 08:07 AM   #72
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Tires every three years? What a joke, install quality US made tires and change every 6 years and not worry about a blowout!
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Old 03-01-2015, 06:16 AM   #73
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Tire discussions alway bring out lots of mis-information and food for thought. Yes, many people have good experiences with doing what is not recommended but that does not work for all cases. Every rig weights different and is traveled a different number of miles/year over different conditions of roadway and at different speeds.

The most important of these issues is to be educated and make the right decisions. It is your life and investment that may be at stack.

Lots of information is available online from experts not personal experiences that may not apply to your specific situation.
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Old 03-01-2015, 09:07 AM   #74
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Tireman 9 - questions

If an ST tire is rated at 3500 pounds, what is the tire manufacturer's designed in safety margin?

If an ST tire is supposed to be inflated to 80 pounds, what is the actual safe operating range (where the tire can support the designed weight)?

What is the industry accepted error range for tire pressure gauges?

True or False
ST tires have thinner sidewalls than like sized LT tires.

ST tires have less tread depth than like sized LT tires.

ST tires deteriorate faster due to environmental conditions than LT tires.

The ST category of tires exist primarily for cost reasons. The advertised load range can be increased because the tires do not have to be rated for motive forces, i.e., a smaller tire can be used on trailers.

The air carries the weight, the tire holds the air.
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Old 03-01-2015, 10:05 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andy29847 View Post
Tireman 9 - questions

If an ST tire is rated at 3500 pounds, what is the tire manufacturer's designed in safety margin? Never seen a published range. The legal requirements are that 100% of the tires will pass certain tests based on the max load. As with every manufactured product there is variation. Only the tire company knows the consistency of their process so most will apply a nominal statistical test. If you buy something like chain that has a 500# test, all you can count on is that it will not fail at 500# with no guarantee it will not fail at 501#.

If an ST tire is supposed to be inflated to 80 pounds, what is the actual safe operating range (where the tire can support the designed weight)?
If the tire says 3000# MAx at 80 psi then 80psi would be the minimum cold inflation. If you do not exceed the max speed rating for the tire and do not exceed the max load of the tire the pressure increase due to normal operation is acceptable range.

What is the industry accepted error range for tire pressure gauges? Never seen a published number but I consider +/- 5% to 7% of the target measuring pressure to be the time the gauge becomes a tent peg or door stop.

True or False
ST tires have thinner sidewalls than like sized LT tires. Never seen a multi-tire comparison. Probably similar. I would not consider this a meaningful comparison.

ST tires have less tread depth than like sized LT tires. Probably do as this is a normal feature of St and are one of the factors that allow St tires to be rated for more load than same size LT type.

ST tires deteriorate faster due to environmental conditions than LT tires. Never seen direct lab test. Some may be better some worse. Just as all LT tires do not have identical rubber compound in sidewall same goes for ST.

The ST category of tires exist primarily for cost reasons. The advertised load range can be increased because the tires do not have to be rated for motive forces, i.e., a smaller tire can be used on trailers. No idea why the catigory was developed 50 years ago

The air carries the weight, the tire holds the air. Finally one I can answer as you would like. TRUE.
Answers in red.

I am not evading the simple yes/no answer but as an engineer I deal in facts and data. If there are 25 different LT tires and 15 different ST tires in the same size is it reasonable to expect anyone to have compared all 375 possible combinations to know the answer to the simple sidewall thickness question? Especially since thiickness is not a meaningful measure of sidewall strength which I think is what you really wanted to know.
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Old 03-01-2015, 07:46 PM   #76
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Tireman9 - thanks for the fast reply. I understand that you can't deal in generalizations.

Your earlier posts, the list of issues that cause tire failure, struck chord (pun) with me. When I filed a claim after one the tires on my trailer blew up, the tire distributor stated that I had run the tires under-inflated or overloaded.

Everyone says run them a maximum inflation (80#s for my tires). I did. Still, one tire blew apart and another tire showed signs of the elements of the tire separating. My tires were rated at 3500#s. My trailer was carrying ~11,500 pounds on the wheels, i.e., I had a generous safety margin regarding tire loading. My tires were checked and were set at 80 pounds at 60 the morning of my flat. It was 95 when I had my flat. When the tire came apart, it was probably running 95-100 pounds of pressure. Inspection of the remaining 3 tires showed some uneven tread wear - the edges were worn more than the centers. I can't explain that. I am still using the same tire gauge. When I use it, it reads within 1-2 pounds of my TPMS. I believe I was getting a good pressure reading when I checked my tires. I believe the tires that came on my trailer were poorly made. The tire distributor bought them back from me (including the bad ones).

This is my first big trailer. I have run motorcycle trailers for years. The ST tires on the motorcycle trailers are never heavily loaded. The sidewalls always crack from environmental issues before the tread is worn off. I have never had any car or truck tires crack from environmental exposure.

This week I am on the road. I was in an RV park with another RVer who had a new Montana 5th wheel. His GVWR, as printed on the side of the trailer, was more that 16,500 pounds. He had the same size tires that came on my 13,672 pound trailer. I didn't know what to say, so I said nothing. I hope he has a better experience than I did. He is running a lot closer to the load limits of the tires than I was.

The only extenuating circumstance to my flat was road conditions. I was on I-20 near the MS/AL line. I ran through a section where the road bed had sunk in places. I hit the first depression at 62, and it felt like I was on a roller coaster. I had to slow to 50 before I felt comfortable on that section of road. Momentary loads on the tires had to be high, probably well in excess of 3500 pounds. I deduce from what you said that tire manufacturers do not test tires for the conditions I found on the road.

No questions here for you. Just some anecdotal info. I am holding on to what I have learned. Lots of people have trouble with ST tires. You seldom hear about RVers' having trouble once they switch to LT tires.
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Old 03-01-2015, 09:25 PM   #77
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Manufacturers install the cheapest axles, wheels and tire combinations a subcontractor bids for a set GAWR designed frame regardless of whether its a park model or a TT or a Fifthwheel.
The standard OEM tires in my opinion should be considered delivery tires only as the majority of towables including Park models, TT and fifthwheels are moved to seasonal campgrounds and never moved again.
Therefore if I was the manufacturers why would I want to spend any more than the barest of minimums specs to meet DOT regulations for tires that likely will only ever travel from the factory to the dealership and to a campground once.
Folks consider the OEM tires delivery tires only and demand a quality tires be put on your unit before you are stranded at the side of the road with thousands of dollars of damage. My goodness the cheap ST's blow up just hanging on the spare tire rack on the back bumpers.
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Old 03-01-2015, 10:15 PM   #78
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But my experience with failing ST titres was that they were 200% the cost of the trouble free LT tire that replace them. At first because a tire nearly lasted 2 years I was looking at cost savings. Then the LT lasted more then 7 years and 50k miles.
A tire inflated at 80 lbs will increase pressure and temperature much faster then a tire inflated at 110 lbs carrying the same loads.
But capacities are almost equal. On my G tires if one has lower pressure cold. It's most likely it will have highest temperature and pressure once on the road. For that reason when I installed under rated LTs I increased the pressures above the max and they ran for the 7 years with no problem.

I am not a tire engineer but have 40 years of experience improving the OEM supplied equipment. I never used warranty favours because we needed to have equipment that did not fail. So we always modified.
I never could understand how OEM did not improve but I did know that competition was dictating the quality of the product.
We will be discussing this one 20 years from now and the ST tires will still be used and failing. Because it's the nature of the beast. I have been saying this story since 98 and it never changes.
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