Go Back   iRV2 Forums > TRAVEL TRAILER, 5th WHEEL & TRUCK CAMPER FORUMS > 5th Wheel Discussion
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 02-23-2011, 11:49 AM   #1
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 7
Weight of 5th wheel loaded.

I know you've probably seen this question a million times but here it
goes again. I know the unloaded weight is 14500. The truck we are looking
at is rated 16,100. Realistically how much added weight does a full timer load up their 5th with. Will we be right on the hairy edge?

Thanks in advance
Damon
__________________

__________________
damraw50 is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 02-23-2011, 12:20 PM   #2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 475
Most 5th wheels are used at or near the GW...the empty weight is virtually useless information. Also, the weak link with 5th wheel tow vehicles is the ability to carry the pin weight. That 16.1 tow rating is, again, not much use unless you know the cargo capacity for carrying the PW. Check the Tire and Loading Information sticker on the left side of the truck's frame.

A 5th wheel at 16k usually needs a diesel dually to stay within specs.
__________________

__________________
hooverbill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2011, 12:26 PM   #3
Moderator Emeritus
 
RustyJC's Avatar


 
Texas Boomers Club
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Cypress, Texas USA
Posts: 8,854
Hate to tell you this, but you're working with 2 fictitious numbers.

1. If you go weigh the trailer as it sits on the dealer's lot, I can almost guarantee you that it will weigh more than the "dry weight" taken from a brochure.

2. A truck's "trailer tow rating" is calculated as the truck's gross combination weight rating (GCWR) minus the truck's curb weight. Fine, except the curb weight the manufacturer uses for this calculation is for a base truck with no options or accessories (like a 5th wheel hitch, for instance) and only a 150 lb driver.

Just for grins, find out the GCWR of your truck as it is equipped (typically in the owner's manual), the GVWR of your truck (on the driver's door post) and the GVWR of the trailer you're considering (on the left front of the trailer or from the brochure). Then, load up your truck with full fuel tank(s), driver, passengers, cargo, etc. just like you're going camping and take it to the scales - most truck stops will weigh you for $8 to $10. This will give you your truck's actual laden curb weight (LCW). With this information:

Truck's GCWR minus truck's LCW = maximum allowable total weight of loaded trailer.

Truck's GVWR minus truck's LCW = maximum allowable pin (5th wheel) or tongue (TT) weight of loaded trailer.

A conservative approach in sizing a tow vehicle and trailer is to use the trailer's GVWR as the total weight of the loaded trailer and ~20% (5th wheel) or ~12% (TT) of the trailer's GVWR as the pin/tongue weight of the loaded trailer. If these numbers are less than those from the formulas above, you're within the truck manufacturer's GCWR and GVWR ratings.

Rusty
__________________
2016 Ram Longhorn 3500 Dually 4x4 CCLB, 385/900 Cummins, Aisin AS69RC, 4.10
2014.5 DRV Mobile Suites 38RSSA #6972
Come join us on a TEXAS BOOMERS rally!
RustyJC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2011, 01:40 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Ray,IN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: North America somewhere
Posts: 13,686
two thousand pounds CCC is not unreasonable, if you manage it closely. The caveat to this is, you must actually weigh that 5er to accurately determine the empty weight, otherwise you are operating blind.
__________________
2000 Winnebago Ultimate Freedom USQ40JD, ISC 8.3 Cummins 350, Spartan MM Chassis. USA 1SG, retired;PPA,Good Sam Life member,FMCA."We the people are the rightful masters of both the Congress and the Courts - not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow men who pervert the Constitution. "Abraham Lincoln"
Ray,IN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2011, 03:43 PM   #5
Community Administrator
 
NLOVNIT's Avatar


 
Pond Piggies Club
Fleetwood Owners Club
Ford Super Duty Owner
LA Gulf Coast Campers
Outdoors RV Owners Club
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 22,254
Blog Entries: 1
I would suggest you read the information on THIS WEBSITE & use its formulas for calculating your numbers.

Lori-
__________________
Lori & Dave - FMA #3415 | FMCA #F419886 | RV/MH Hall of Fame Lifetime Member
2006 Fleetwood Bounder 36Z & 2014 Honda CRV EX-L AWD, My iRV2 Photo Albums
How is it one careless match can start a forest fire but it takes a whole box to start a campfire?
NLOVNIT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2011, 04:08 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Full Timer / Vagabond
Posts: 609
I read that a single person will carry 2000 lbs of "STUFF". Add a woman to the mix and add another 1000 lbs of "STUFF".
I, as a single male full time RVer carry 2000 lbs of "STUFF". Actually I am a little over.
My truck weights are OK and my 5er weights are OK but where they get you is the truck gross combined weight rating. That is the weight of both the truck and trailer. I am right on the edge of this. Yes it is time to do some cleaning out of "STUFF" I do not use.
__________________
Ralph & Snickers
2006 3500 Chevy Dually - 8.1 - Allison
2006 30' New Horizon - Solar
ralper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2011, 07:23 PM   #7
Moderator Emeritus
 
TXiceman's Avatar


 
Vintage RV Owners Club
Texas Boomers Club
Oklahoma Boomers Club
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Full Time, TX Home Base
Posts: 17,150
Blog Entries: 21
Let' hope you are looking at a well equipped 1 ton dually. Follow the lead in Rusty's post.

ken
__________________
Amateur Radio Operator (KE5DFR)|Full-Time! - 2012 6.7L Ford Crew Cab Dually -2013 HitchHiker Champagne 38RLRSB - Travel with one Standard Schnauzer and one small Timneh African Gray Parrot
TXiceman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2011, 09:37 AM   #8
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 7
Thanks to everyone for all the help and advice! It was very helpful. We bought a 2008 Chevy 3500 Dually Diesel and are pretty confidant it will do the job. I have another question, the truck we bought has a flip-up ball hitch for a gooseneck attatchment, and I was wondering if anyone out there has any experience-opinions about using that kind of system vs a traditional 5th wheel hitch? It's less money, and it doesn't take up much space in the bed.

Thanks in advance,

Damon
__________________
damraw50 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2011, 09:46 AM   #9
Moderator Emeritus
 
RustyJC's Avatar


 
Texas Boomers Club
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Cypress, Texas USA
Posts: 8,854
I would suggest a search on "gooseneck adapters" here on iRV2 - lots of discussion on this topic. From an engineering perspective, the gooseneck adapter is an extended lever arm (think "cheater pipe") that greatly increases the torques applied to the 5th wheel pin box and frame areas. Frame failures can be (and have been) a result of using unapproved gooseneck adapters. Rather than take anecdotal evidence on which to base your decision, however, you should contact your 5th wheel manufacturer (NOT a dealer) and get their OK to use a gooseneck adapter, thus ensuring that they have designed their frame and pin box to accept these higher torque loads.

An alternative that many of us (myself included) use when both gooseneck and 5th wheel towing capabilities are required with a clean bed when neither is in use is the B&W Turnoverball gooseneck hitch with B&W's companion 5th wheel hitch that utilizes the gooseneck hitch receiver - see HERE and click on the Turnover Ball and Companion tabs.

Rusty
__________________
2016 Ram Longhorn 3500 Dually 4x4 CCLB, 385/900 Cummins, Aisin AS69RC, 4.10
2014.5 DRV Mobile Suites 38RSSA #6972
Come join us on a TEXAS BOOMERS rally!
RustyJC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2011, 07:22 PM   #10
Moderator Emeritus
 
TXiceman's Avatar


 
Vintage RV Owners Club
Texas Boomers Club
Oklahoma Boomers Club
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Full Time, TX Home Base
Posts: 17,150
Blog Entries: 21
As noted, most 5th wheel manufacturers will not warranty a trailer frame using a G/N adapter. As an engineer, I would not use the adapter on a 5er. A few manufacturers will build a special trailer frame to handle the extra stresses from using an adapter.

Why are they sold? There is a lot of stuff sold that should never be on the market.

ken
__________________
Amateur Radio Operator (KE5DFR)|Full-Time! - 2012 6.7L Ford Crew Cab Dually -2013 HitchHiker Champagne 38RLRSB - Travel with one Standard Schnauzer and one small Timneh African Gray Parrot
TXiceman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2011, 10:07 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
Ray,IN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: North America somewhere
Posts: 13,686
To follow what Ken said; if you have a Lippert Industries built frame the warranty is voided when you use a gooseneck adapter Lippert Components, Inc. - Informational Publication
or modify the frame in any way.
__________________
2000 Winnebago Ultimate Freedom USQ40JD, ISC 8.3 Cummins 350, Spartan MM Chassis. USA 1SG, retired;PPA,Good Sam Life member,FMCA."We the people are the rightful masters of both the Congress and the Courts - not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow men who pervert the Constitution. "Abraham Lincoln"
Ray,IN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2011, 09:34 AM   #12
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 7
Thanks again for all the info and advice, I will definitely avoid the gooseneck idea for my 5th wheel!! Aside from the immediate lure of a clear bed and lower cost, it does seem a bit shaky.

Damon
__________________
damraw50 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2011, 07:56 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,077
If your wanting to tow your 5er with the GN adapter I would contact your trailer manufacture as some manufactures have no issues with doing so. Some have even offered the option.
A google on the suject is a bit more subjective rather than a couple of opinions from some folks that may not like the adapter or don't feel that other folks should not use one. Lots of folks tow their 5ers with a GN adapter with no issues. Ask the trailer manufacture.

Unloaded weights is a good place to start. When you get your choices I would contact the manufacture and ask for their shipping weight for a unit with the options you want. They can get within a couple of hundred lbs with a highly optioned unit.

The 3500 DRW Chevy is a good performer for 5ers that size.
__________________
'03 Dodge 2500 Cummins HO 3.73 NV5600 Jacobs
'98 3500 DRW 454 4x4 4.10 crew cab
'97 Park Avanue RK 28' 2 slides
JIMNLIN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2011, 06:31 AM   #14
Moderator Emeritus
 
TXiceman's Avatar


 
Vintage RV Owners Club
Texas Boomers Club
Oklahoma Boomers Club
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Full Time, TX Home Base
Posts: 17,150
Blog Entries: 21
I have seen 2 high end 5ers that had the bottom of the nose torn apart getting the frame reinforced and rewelded. Both were towed using the GN adapter.

Yes some folks do get away with using a the adapter, but as a practicing mechanical engineer, I would never advise anyone to use a GN adapter without checking with the RV manufacturer first. DO NOT check with the dealer or the GN adapter manufacturer.

There are a lot of product sold on the open market that should not be sold...so buyer beware.

As for loaded weighs, we full-timed for a year in our 36.5' Avion 5er and we were within about 500# of hitting our GVWR for the trailer. The weight adds up much faster than you think when you start adding clothes, food and all of the other necessary items. It is pretty easy to add 2000# to the unloaded weight when full-timing.

Ken
__________________

__________________
Amateur Radio Operator (KE5DFR)|Full-Time! - 2012 6.7L Ford Crew Cab Dually -2013 HitchHiker Champagne 38RLRSB - Travel with one Standard Schnauzer and one small Timneh African Gray Parrot
TXiceman is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
5th wheel towing? aspeyrer Toy Haulers Discussion 27 08-04-2011 01:27 PM
new 5th wheel toy hauler aspeyrer Toy Haulers Discussion 4 02-12-2011 05:54 PM
I need Ammo. I am Thinking About Selling the MH and Buying a 5th Wheel LeeB 5th Wheel Discussion 31 01-21-2008 05:51 AM
5th Wheel and a Ford Diesel mdmalone Trailer Towing and Tow Vehicles Discussion 36 07-04-2005 10:52 AM

» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:56 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.