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Old 07-16-2019, 01:41 PM   #1
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Brand Spanking New to this F150 Questions

Hello all! I thank you in advance for reading this and replying

My hubby and I are brand spanking new to RVing. We are so new we don't even have an RV yet. We are looking at TTs and Class C motorhomes. We aren't very handy. Our boys are going off to college in the US. We are Canucks through and through but think, why not get something where we can visit the boys and do some sightseeing while there. We also love to play at any local casinos so that's on our radars too!

As it stands right now we have a few Ford F150s. We are in the process of trading in our 2017 truck for a new one and I want to make a good decision on what to get based on a travel trailer I saw and liked and towing safety. My hubby can't understand what I'm trying to explain to him with payload etc (and probably because I don't really understand it myself, but I'm getting there.)

The truck is a Ford F150 V6 engine 3.5 ecoboost. The axle is 3.55 I believe is what the salesman told me. I am asking these questions to the salesman based on what I'm reading but don't really understand what all of it means. Between the salesman and my hubby I can't really get to what I think we should need/want so I just told the salesman to put a hold on what my hubby ordered and wait for my word. Hubby has given me to today to figure out if this truck is enough for the trailer we want.

The inside of the door sticker says: The combined weight of occupants and cargo should never exceed 816kg or 1800lbs ETA: The combined occupants could be 800 lbs if the 4 of us travel together, or 400lbs for just hubby and I. Let's say 450lbs if we bring the two teeny ween dogs we have

The GVWR is: 3175kg (7000lbs)
Front GAWR 1565kg (3450 lb)
Rear GAWR 1724 Kg (3800 LB)

I don't know where to get the payload number from this.

The max size trailer we were looking at is the cougar 1/2 ton 26RKS
WeightDry Weight 6,575 lbs.Payload Capacity 2,225 lbs.GVWR 8,800 lbs.Hitch Weight 810 lbs.

I asked about max towing package the salesman told me not necessary, but I'm not listening to him. Nice enough guy, but he doesn't really know. I don't want to be white knuckling my entire trip.

Is this way too big for the F150?

sorry if this is a stupid question and the answer is obvious, lol I am learning and respect the opinions of those who have RV'ed before me!

If this TT is too big, what would a good size trailer specs be?

ETA: the hubby isn't sold on a F250 because he thinks we wouldn't be towing as much as we would be driving so gas would be a factor for every day driving. Our kids going away would leave us with one vehicle. This one. so thoughts on gas if we did get a F250?

Thank you again!
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Old 07-16-2019, 01:58 PM   #2
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Any half ton truck like the F-150 is best if the trailer had a GVWR of 6,500lbs.

A trailer with a GVWR of 8,800 lbs is best towed with a F-250.

Here are guidelines I use for a trailers GVWR:

0 - 6,500lbs - F-150
6,501 - 10,000lbs - F-250
> 10,000 lbs - F-350.

You can substitute Ram and GM 1500 for Ford F-150. You can substitute Ram and GM 2500 for Ford -250. And Ram and GM 3500 for Ford F-350.

So the trailer you are looking at I think is too heavy for a F-150. You do want the tow package on any truck you get.

The Ford 3.5 Eco-Boost is the best towing gas engine in any half ton truck. 2nd best towing in half ton truck is GM 6.2 litre.

GM is building some really nice trucks. For your 8,800lb. GVWR the redesigned GM 2500 truck with the new 6.6 litre gas motor would be a good match.
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Old 07-16-2019, 02:19 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by tuffr2 View Post
Any half ton truck like the F-150 is best if the trailer had a GVWR of 6,500lbs.

A trailer with a GVWR of 8,800 lbs is best towed with a F-250.

Here are guidelines I use for a trailers GVWR:

0 - 6,500lbs - F-150
6,501 - 10,000lbs - F-250
> 10,000 lbs - F-350.

You can substitute Ram and GM 1500 for Ford F-150. You can substitute Ram and GM 2500 for Ford -250. And Ram and GM 3500 for Ford F-350.

So the trailer you are looking at I think is too heavy for a F-150. You do want the tow package on any truck you get.

The Ford 3.5 Eco-Boost is the best towing gas engine in any half ton truck. 2nd best towing in half ton truck is GM 6.2 litre.

GM is building some really nice trucks. For your 8,800lb. GVWR the redesigned GM 2500 truck with the new 6.6 litre gas motor would be a good match.
Thank you for replying! So I need to be looking at the trailers GVWR as my first step if we are going with this particular truck. So goodbye Cougar 26RKS. :( LOL OR...Hello F250? Lol. Back to the drawing board I guess.
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Old 07-16-2019, 02:28 PM   #4
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Way too big? No! But you likely will not like the towing experience at those weights.
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Old 07-16-2019, 02:59 PM   #5
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In the last 12 years I had a Honda Ridgeline, F-150, F-450, and now a F-250 depending on what I was towing.

The Honda Ridgeline was rated to tow 5,000lbs. My very 1st trailer was 4,400 dry. I loaded about 300lbs to it. The Ridgine could not tow it very easy. I personally would rate the Ridgeline at 3,500lbs in a travel trailer.

What you run into is a travel trailer has big flat sides, a huge flat straight up and down back, and not an overly areodynamic front. This is the toughest type of trailer to tow. A F-150 can tow a flat bed trailer loaded with bricks easier than a travel trailer, or even a boat easier than a travel trailer.

Towing with a short wheelbase can not control the trailer. Towing with my Honda Ridgeline was a white knuckle tow at 65mph. Lots of semi trucks zooming by would 1st push my rig to the right then suck it to the left as it passed. That same trailer towed with my F-150 controlled the trailer so passing semi trucks did not affect my rig at all. I think the wheelbase on the Honda Ridgeline was too short.

Every iteration of a redesigned truck the wheelbase is increased. The redesigned GM 2500/3500 increased the wheelbase by over 5". Same for both the redesigned 2019 Ram and GM 1500 series trucks. Now they are about the same as the Ford F-150 since the 2015 redesign.

Ford does build a 'special' F-150 that can tow your 8,800lb. GVWR trailer. That is a F-150 with the Heavy Duty Payload Package (HDPP). Google that package, you will see the frame is thicker, the wheelbase is 164" the tires are 'E' rated with more lugs on the wheels, tow mirrors and a payload of around 2,800lbs. Typically this truck needs to be ordered. I have never seen it sitting on any dealer lots...ever.

Look at the Winnebago Mini trailers. They make lots of floorplans. Fyi - Winnebago makes small (Micro Mini), mid sized (Mini) and larger (Mini Plus) travel trailers. The Mini size could be towed with a F-150 I think.

I bought a F-250 in anticipation of buying a Winnebago Mini Plus 27RBDS with a 8,800lb GVWR.
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Old 07-16-2019, 03:06 PM   #6
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My daily driver for the last 15 or more years in order:

2001 Audi s4
2007 Tundra 1/2 Ton
2010 Chevy 2500 gasser
2013 Chevy 2500 Diesel
2016 GMC 2500 Diesel
2019 GMC 3500 DRW Diesel.

Towing aside, my favorite unloaded daily-driver after the Audi was the 2016 Diesel, followed by the 2013 diesel. My new 2019 DRW is still in the running but its too new to make the call. My least favorite was the 2500 Gasser. I just love, love, love driving the diesel trucks, loaded or unloaded. They are powerful, planted, quiet, and all around awesome vehicles. I'll never not have a diesel as long as they are legal. And you can tow what you are looking to tow without white knuckles or a lot of math.

(The Audi was a 450+HP chipped and modded rocket ship and not really fair to compare to the trucks).

Go drive a modern diesel before you make a decision. (I'd look hard at the GM trucks, as I like the ride and lack of road noise better than the Ford or Ram products, but all three make very solid trucks--just a matter of preference).
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Old 07-16-2019, 04:32 PM   #7
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Your salesman will do anything to make a sale. In case no one has ever told you, most 1/2 ton trucks look like serious work trucks, however most have the springing of an old Crown Victoria. Most 1/2 tons are really for looking good.

Your best bet would be to order a RV Package/Max Tow F150 with the 3.5 ecoboost that probably comes with the 3.73 gear ratio. You can probably save money by ordering it just like what suits your specific needs. Max tow packages are seldom found on dealer lots, unfortunately.

That truck would tow a 7000 pound trailer with all your stuff. Otherwise, go to a F250 with the 6.2 engine if it's going to be used for daily driving.
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Old 07-16-2019, 09:31 PM   #8
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Quote:
The GVWR is: 3175kg (7000lbs)
Front GAWR 1565kg (3450 lb)
Rear GAWR 1724 Kg (3800 LB)
This is one of the smaller F150 with a 7000 gvwr and 3800 rawr. Not enough truck for a 8800 gvwr TT.

The F150 comes in several different GVWR/RAWR packages.

At the top is the F150HDPP with a 7850 gvwr and bigger 4800 rawr and is good for approx 2400-2500 lb in the bed payload

Next down is a 7600 gvwr and 4550 rawr good for approx 2000-2200 lb in the bed payload.

3rd one down is a 7050 gvwr and 4050 rawr good for around 1800 lbs in the bed.

4th down is a 6800-7000 gvwr with tiny 3800 rawr good for maybe 1500 lb in the bed.
They all come with the 5.0 v8 or the 3.5 Ecoboost engine.

"MAX TOW" option ??
Includes:
• 3.55 Electronic-locking rear-axle
• 4-pin/7-pin wiring harness
• 36 Gallon fuel tank
• Auxiliary transmission oil cooler
• Engine oil cooler
• Class IV trailer hitch receiver
• Pro Trailer Backup Assist with Tailgate LED
• Smart Trailer Tow Connector (standard on LARIAT and higher)
• Integrated Trailer Brake Controller
• Upgraded front stabilizer bar
• Upgraded rear bumper

As you see its a good package for towing but it doesn't make the small F150 you looked at tow max loads.

The first two F150 packages I mentioned above will have no problems pulling a 8800 gvwr TT.
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Old 07-16-2019, 10:05 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elaine77 View Post
Hello all! I thank you in advance for reading this and replying




The inside of the door sticker says: The combined weight of occupants and cargo should never exceed 816kg or 1800lbs ETA: The combined occupants could be 800 lbs if the 4 of us travel together, or 400lbs for just hubby and I. Let's say 450lbs if we bring the two teeny ween dogs we have

The GVWR is: 3175kg (7000lbs)
Front GAWR 1565kg (3450 lb)
Rear GAWR 1724 Kg (3800 LB)

I don't know where to get the payload number from this.
Combined weight of occupants and cargo ; IS the payload number.
So 1800 pound for that truck and that's not much .
I had a 93 Dodge Dakota with 1850 payload.
Remember that all the payload capacity is available at the rear axle , and that's where it's most important .
I'm a firm believer that the RV industries advertising of trailers as 1/2 ton tow able is a farce because probably only 10 % of half tons made are capable of towing the units they're selling.
I towed my first three 5th wheel trailers with the Dakota but the heaviest had a GVWR of 6,500 lbs, and I was running under the trucks GVWR , RAWR and GCVW. Even then coming out of Calgary on a 42C day I had to turn the A/C off to keep from overheating . On arrival home my DW started scouring the papers for a bigger truck .
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Old 07-16-2019, 11:14 PM   #10
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I’m so thankful for all your responses. Admittedly my hubby and I are pretty naive when it comes to this stuff. Case in point , I asked the salesman about the axle. He told me it was a 3.55, I watched a video on how to check what the axle is and it’s actually 3.31. Hubby sent a text to the salesman to ask again to give him a chance to answer correctly and if he doesn’t, time for a new salesman.

I’m going to show my hubby all of this information. He’s been Of the opinion “well I see joe down the street towing with an F-150 “ and I always say “doesn’t mean Joe down the street is towing safely “
LAst thing I want is to cause an accident because I was towing unsafely.

I did ask about the max tow package was told they didn’t have one and would have to order.

Does the HDPP come with the max tow package?
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Old 07-17-2019, 12:20 AM   #11
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Another important factor in all this , the truck's max tow rating is determined with the truck EMPTY except for a 150 lb driver.

So every pound in the truck over that 150 , has to be deducted from the tow weight.

JMHO: The push to sell 1/2 ton trucks , is all due to the " Corporate fuel economy " requirements . The manufacturers built trucks that will give decent economy ;running empty ; and give them a high tow rating because the economy towing has no bearing on the " Corporate fuel economy " They want to sell as many 1/2 tons as possible to keep the CFE up.
Case in point , my Dakota would get 22 MPG ( Canadian Gallon ) empty and 8 towing , the 3/4 ton that replaced it , would get 17 empty and 11 towing. With the same trailer . The trailer was at the tow limit of the Dakota ( 6500 lbs) , but well under the 3/4 ton's 14,400. Even my last 5er, 9,990 GVWR , didn't drop the 3/4 ton mileage.
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Old 07-17-2019, 03:35 AM   #12
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There are two packages you need. Package #1 is Max Tow.
Package #2 is HDPP

The HDPP option makes the F-150 more like a F-250. A F-150 with Max Tow and HDPP is a better daily driver than a F-250.
The cost will be the same as a F-250 so most people will buy a F-250. A F-250 at this point becomes more bang for your $$$$. Do a Google image search on F-150 HDPP to see what that truck looks like. You will see a F-150 on steroids.

Another truck that you might consider is the Nissan Titan HD. It is Nissan's version of a more capable half ton truck. Nissan uses two engines in this truck. One is diesel and one is a gas engine. I am talking about the gas engine as it will have more payload than the diesel engine. I expect payload to be above 2,000lbs.

And yet another truck is the GMC or Chevy 1500 with all their towing and payload stuff added. They increased the wheelbase for their redesigned 2019 model year trucks and added capability. I am not sure what package GM calls it I think NXT or something like that. Anyway the new GMC and Chevy 1500 trucks are very nice and with the 6.2 litre gas engine competes with Ford 3.5 Eco-Boost.

Payload is used to carry the 1,200lbs of tongue weight of the trailer. Oh, RV manufactures give bogus tongue weights and often times without a battery and propane. Your storage area is in front and storage under the bed will put weight on the tongue. And a general rule is to use 20% of GVWR for the tongue weight. Yikes 20% of 8,800 lbs but for a rear kitchen it might be 15% of 8,800lbs. Still kinda heavy.

Also when I started trailer camping I started with paper plates, cups and bowls and plastic spoons forks and knives. After a few years I switched to much much heavier real silverware heavy coffee mugs, real bowls, added a Keurig so it is easy to add weight to your trailer.
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Old 07-17-2019, 09:17 AM   #13
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Some of the new 2019 GM 1/2 tons are rated to carry 1200 lbs. on the conventional hitch without weight distribution and have enough stated payload capacity to pull an an 8-10k trailer. I am still not sure I'd want to but if you are set on a half ton they might be worth investigating. Pay attention to the hitch carry-weight rating on whatever rig you buy.
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Old 07-17-2019, 09:23 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elaine77 View Post
Is this way too big for the F150?

Will it work for you? Maybe... It depends on your own abilities and requirements.
I tow an 8000lb GVWR toyhauler with a 2.7 Ecoboost F150 because I feel that it's a more heavy duty engine but what works for me may not be the same for you.
If you are on the fence then I suggest going to a bigger truck or a smaller trailer.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tuffr2 View Post
Ford does build a 'special' F-150 that can tow your 8,800lb. GVWR trailer. That is a F-150 with the Heavy Duty Payload Package (HDPP). Google that package, you will see the frame is thicker, the wheelbase is 164" the tires are 'E' rated with more lugs on the wheels, tow mirrors and a payload of around 2,800lbs. Typically this truck needs to be ordered. I have never seen it sitting on any dealer lots...ever.

HDPP F150's have the same .1" frame thickness as a regular F150.
2015+ F150's came with light duty (LD) or heavy duty (HD) frames. Frame thickness has nothing to do with engine size. The LD is .087" thick and the HD is .1" thick. I do not believe any 4x4 F150 ever came with a LD frame.
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