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Old 08-05-2018, 07:34 PM   #1
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Confused By the Salesman! Inquiring about F-250 Towing Capacity

Hello all,

My husband and I have been having a difficult time understanding and getting straight answers on several of our questions. We are looking to full-time in a fifth wheel, and would prefer to have a washer/dryer. We've spoken to several dealership salesmen that have ASSURED us that we can tow more than what we are calculating, but online forums say differently.

Specs:
2006 Ford F-250 6.0 Diesel
3.73 axle ratio
GCWR 23000
Max trailer 16,500
Payload 2781
GVWR 9600
GVW 6819
RGAWR 6100

We expect that ourselves and cargo will be 600 lbs. The hitch will add another 300 lbs. So, by our estimation, this leaves a pin weight of 1881 lbs. The dealer was showing us fifth wheels that were around 1800+ lbs hitch weight, and telling us we would be fine. Our understanding is that this heavy of a fifth wheel would actually put us OVER our weight limit.

Our questions are:
What advertised pin weight should we be looking at that we can realistically pull? Is there a fifth wheel with a washer/dryer that falls into this weight limit? Are there specific brands that are better for more of a full-time situation than others?
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Old 08-05-2018, 09:38 PM   #2
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2006 F250 and 12,000# GVWR 5th wheel


That RAWR of 6100# is what will limit how heavy of a 5th wheel
Any heavier of a 5th wheel and you will be over the trucks RAWR due to a real world pin weight of 2400# or more


That published max tow rating of 16,500 is a mfg. marketing number using a base model with a 150# driver and 20# cargo.

You will run out of Axle capacity LONG before you reach that max tow rating
.
Even with a 12,000# GVWR 5th wheel you will be over your trucks GVWR (9600#) and payload. Not a real concern. MFG GVWR is a 'Class' distinction (under 10K) and payload is based on that GVWR.


Axle Ratings and Tire Load Ratings are the ones that you need to be concerned with and stay at or under those.


2006 F250----12k 5th wheel (GVWR)
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Old 08-06-2018, 04:13 AM   #3
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Typically for a 5th wheel a SRW F-350 is better. Simply a F-250 really does not have cargo capacity to carry many 5th wheels. A F-350 SRW will have approx. 1,000 more lbs carring capacity.
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Old 08-06-2018, 08:16 AM   #4
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Hi, updog. and and to our campfire.

Quote:
Originally Posted by updog View Post
2006 Ford F-250 6.0 Diesel
GVWR 9600

Our questions are:
What advertised pin weight should we be looking at that we can realistically pull?
You're looking for a magic number that's easy to find and easily understood. Sorry, Updog, but there's no such number. You can determine the answer, but it requires some work.

I don't agree with Old-Biscuit that the rear axle rating of your F-250 is your limiter. The GVWR of your F-250 is determined by Professional Engineers (PEs), and it is a real limiter. For your F-250, the GVWR of the F-250 is probably your limiter as to the max weight of any fifth wheel (5er) RV trailer you can tow without being overloaded.

Recognize that when full-timers move from one location to another, they must haul everything they own in/on either the tow vehicle or the 5er. So both your tow vehicle and your trailer will be loaded to the gills. So assume the weight of the 5er will be the combined GAWR of the 5er, plus 20% of the combined GVWR of the 5er as pin weight.

With that preliminary understanding, now back to your question. Ignore advertised pin weight. Assume the pin weight will be 20% of the combined GAWR of the 5er, which is average for small to medium-size 5ers. So what is that maximum pin weight? The answer requires you to do some work.

Load the F-250 with everybody and everything that will be in it when towing on a full-timer move. Don't cheat! Load everything. Most full-timers will have a carpet and furniture for a "patio" in the front yard. And probably a Bar-B-Que grill. Maybe a cast iron Dutch oven. Tool box and jacks and jack stands. Portable generator and fuel for the generator. If it will be in the bed of the pickup and not in the trailer, then load it up.

Drive to a truck stop that has a truck scale. Fill up with fuel then weigh the wet and loaded F-250. If the 5er hitch bedrails are not installed, then add the shipping weigh of the 5er hitch install kit. If the 5er hitch is not installed, then add the shipping weight of the 5er hitch.

Subtract the weight of the wet and loaded F-250 from the GVWR of the F-250, including the 5er hitch. The answer is the payload capacity available for pin weight.

Divide the payload capacity available for pin weight by 20% and the answer is the max weight of any small to medium-size 5er you can tow without being overloaded

Quote:
Is there a fifth wheel with a washer/dryer that falls into this weight limit?
Probably not, but I haven't done much research into that question. So maybe there is.

Quote:
Are there specific brands that are better for more of a full-time situation than others?
Depends on how you plan to live. If you don't want to be stuck on the Gulf coast or the border of Mexico during the winter months, then you want a "four-seasons" RV. The best known of the four-seasons RV trailer is the Artic Fox. But 4-seasons RVs are heavy, and your tow vehicle won't handle a very heavy trailer without being overloaded. For example here is a 29-foot Artic Fox 5er with optional washer/dryer, but it grosses 16k. Northwood | Arctic Fox 29-5K

Too heavy a trailer for your F-250. But they make smaller 5ers that might do the job. For example, here's a 27-footer without washer/dryer that grosses 13,400. Northwood | Arctic Fox 27-5L
If you have payload capacity available for 2,700 pounds pin weight, then that one might be your answer.

If you want an Artic Fox you can tow with your F-250, you'll probably need to choose a travel trailer (TT) instead of a 5er. TTs average 13% tongue weight, so you can tow a heavier TT than 5er without exceeding the GVWR of your F-250.

Example. 25' TT with GVWR of 10k, or tongue weight of 1,300 pounds.
Northwood | Arctic Fox 25W

Your 2006 F-250 has GVWR of 9,600. My 1999.5 had GVWR of 8,800, and it was overloaded with my 25' 5er that grossed 9,000 pounds. If you intend to be a full-timer and tow a four-seasons 5er with washer/dryer, then when you upgrade your tow vehicle, go for at least the F-350 SRW. It looks and feels almost exactly the same as the F-250, but it has almost 1,500 pounds more payload capacity available for pin weight.
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:16 AM   #5
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Thank you all for your responses. Smoky, your response is what we had understood before the dreaded dealer trip.

As for 5rs, we have been considering this one
https://www.rvusa.com/rv-guide/2016-...319rls-tr25464

Which is what brought us to the dealer, because they "had it in stock" but it magically couldn't be found

This seems to have what we want in a small enough package, if only we can find a dealer who actually has one and can look at it.
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:26 AM   #6
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Do some research on the washer and dryer. Most reports I read are people are very disappointed in them. Too small and dryer takes way too long. Remember, the dryer is working on 120 volts. Not 220 like at home. You may like having the closet space vs the W/D. Many campgrounds are notorious for having low voltage.
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Old 08-06-2018, 11:52 AM   #7
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Truck GVWR is MFGs number for 'Class' Rating, Warranty Issues....so is payload cause it is based on GVWR


Many states even allow for 'higher' registration then mfg. GVWR.....just pay the higher registration fee so mfg. GVWR is NOT a legal issue just a registration issue


Axle ratings ARE legal issues....
SO YES RAWR IS the limiting factor when towing 5th wheel



NO ONE can post an actual state law/statue that applies to being over a mfg. GVWR cause it is NOT covered.
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Old 08-06-2018, 04:20 PM   #8
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Two opinions: First, the salesman is lying. If his (or her) lips are moving, they're lying. The salesman has more excuses when whatever he told you doesn't work. Don't believe anything you can't find in the owners manual or other printed material.

Second, I absolutely love my washer and dryer (separate units). It does wash a smaller load than the one at home, big deal. The DW washes clothes whenever she has a load, it's no big deal. 110v dryer, not an issue. Smaller loads need less heat to dry. Before you decide whether or not it's a good addition, search for the washer/dryer threads on here and add up the number of folks who love them and the number who hate them. Love wins every time. What will you do with all that extra storage space that you gain from not having a WD? You'll fill it with more clothes so you can do more loads of laundry at the laundromat..........

Just so you know, with the W/D 6 feet from where you undress, and you toss the dirties into the basket 2 feet from the washer door, and you fold on the bed 4 feet from the dryer door......... you'll still lose a sock every now an again... ;-)
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Old 08-06-2018, 04:34 PM   #9
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The RV salesman credo:

"Tell the customer their tow vehicle can tow that rig, no problem".
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Old 08-06-2018, 11:14 PM   #10
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If your going to full time - I would recommend not starting out in a old used up 6.0 truck. We tried that and now I miraculously have a 2017.

Old trucks are fine when they are not literally the only form of transportation you have for yourself and your house thousands of miles from your home base... It's no longer just a minor inconvenience when something breaks.
Also remember you will be towing at max load....stuff breaks a lot more often then just the occasional light trailer tow. Your working the truck hard, much harder then most do normally.

As Old Biscuit has so helpfully pointed out (as usual, I don't know how he does it) you want a F-350 anyway due to the low axle ratings on the 250.
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Old 08-07-2018, 01:14 PM   #11
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If the 6.0 Diesel has not been "Bullet Proofed" or had similar mods done to it, and you are planning on depending on it for your only transportation. You need a different tow vehicle, or get the mods done first.

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Old 08-07-2018, 01:41 PM   #12
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Have to agree about the 6.0...horrible engine as we had 3 different company vehicles and tons of problems all costly
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Old 08-07-2018, 01:45 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlesinGA View Post
If the 6.0 Diesel has not been "Bullet Proofed" or had similar mods done to it, and you are planning on depending on it for your only transportation. You need a different tow vehicle, or get the mods done first.
Oh yes. We had it bullet proofed within the last month.
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Old 08-07-2018, 01:49 PM   #14
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Hi ! Welcome to IRV2! We're sure glad you joined the gang!

Can't answer your questions but wanted to say hello!

Good luck, happy trails, and God bless!
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