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Old 07-19-2012, 12:08 PM   #29
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Tsmith, Welcome to IRV2.com! Great post, keep them coming! Always good to hear from an industry expert!
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Old 07-19-2012, 12:30 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsmith View Post
... The act of removing sulfur from fuel is done with high heat. Therefore it dries the fuel (removes the lubricity)....
Lubricity should not be a problem, from Wikipedia:


"Sulfur is not a lubricant in of itself, but it can combine with the nickel content in many metal alloys to form a low melting point eutectic alloy that can increase lubricity. The process used to reduce the sulfur also reduces the fuel's lubricating properties. Lubricity is a measure of the fuel's ability to lubricate and protect the various parts of the engine's fuel injection system from wear. The processing required to reduce sulfur to 15 ppm also removes naturally-occurring lubricity agents in diesel fuel. To manage this change ASTM International (formerly the American Society for Testing and Materials) adopted the lubricity specification defined in ASTM D975[12] for all diesel fuels and this standard went into effect January 1, 2005.[13] The D975 standard defines two USLD standards, Grade No. 2-D S15 (regular ULSD) and Grade No. 1-D S15 (a higher volatility fuel with a lower gelling temperature than regular ULSD)."
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Old 07-19-2012, 10:06 PM   #31
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TSmith - welcome to irv2...
well said...

Cat320 -I too use wikipedia sometimes...
but I always take it with a grain of salt since it's an anyone can edit it product, isn't it ?
but so are my post on an rv website

Do we have a snopes for irv2 and wikipedia "
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Old 07-20-2012, 12:41 PM   #32
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Thank you all. One last note. I know first hand of the ASTM spec, the one most fuel plants only seem to hit when GOVERNMENT inspected. I'd rather add and additive then trust the government with my hard earned investment.

Well off to Sturgis for the rally......
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Old 07-20-2012, 07:04 PM   #33
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Cat320,
I just have trouble trusting my engine to something that is suppose to happen.
I have also seen ISSN 0148-7191 (SAE 2009-01-0848 Diesel Lubricity Requirements of Future Fuel Injection Equipment ).

According to Bosch, "EN 590 lubricity spec. (HFRR 460 µm max.) successfully prevents field problems" sooooo greater than that does not? With pressures up to 1600 bar (~ 23,200 psi)..... hmmmmm

The Engine Manufacturers Association (EMA) has suggested and requested that the HFRR standard be set at 460 or better, 400 perferred.
European Union (EU) had set a standard of HFRR 460.
The US, ASTM has set its standard at HFRR 520.

For me that is another I will not get a cup of coffee the day I fill up, to allow me to pay for the additive, to make me feel better.
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Old 07-20-2012, 10:51 PM   #34
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I run Opti-Lube Opti-Lube Fuel Improver | Oil Fortifier | Block Grease in every tankful. I originally bought it to make sure I was receiving the lubricity I need. As one poster stated, I don't beleive the fuel I buy is always up to snuff....you know the refinery and oil business is sooooo trustworthy. Read Opti-Lube's website and some independent studies on lubricity. I don't take them as gospel, but beleive there is some truth in the information.

Either way, the decision to run an additive is a personal one. Some get soooo wound around the axle when someone else runs an additive.....why do you care, it's not your money.

I use the Opti-Lube and my coach runs BETTER/SMOOTEHR. On the fill-ups where I know I'm going to be climbing some heavy grades, I increase what I normally add.

The Opti-Lube adds to the bottom line of my fuel costs, but I beleive in it.

If you don't feel like spending the money for an additive, please don't try to impose your opinion on those that do.
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Old 07-21-2012, 07:58 AM   #35
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[QUOTE=Damon Outlaw;1236934]The OEM's market their own brands of diesel fuel additives, but don't recommend them? That doesn't make sense...QUOTE]

Turbo Diesel

My MH is new and I have a lot of money invested so to spend a few extra dollars to add a fuel additive sounds like good preventative maintenance to me. Cummings markets fuel additives so by this alone they recommend its use.
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Old 07-21-2012, 08:39 AM   #36
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[QUOTE=TheArnolds;1250509]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Damon Outlaw View Post
The OEM's market their own brands of diesel fuel additives, but don't recommend them? That doesn't make sense...QUOTE]

Turbo Diesel

My MH is new and I have a lot of money invested so to spend a few extra dollars to add a fuel additive sounds like good preventative maintenance to me. Cummings markets fuel additives so by this alone they recommend its use.
Exactly!
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Old 07-21-2012, 03:46 PM   #37
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[QUOTE=TheArnolds;1250509]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Damon Outlaw View Post
The OEM's market their own brands of diesel fuel additives, but don't recommend them? That doesn't make sense...QUOTE]

Turbo Diesel

My MH is new and I have a lot of money invested so to spend a few extra dollars to add a fuel additive sounds like good preventative maintenance to me. Cummings markets fuel additives so by this alone they recommend its use.
If you'll look in your manual and call Cummins, they will tell you they do not recommend any additives be put in the fuel...I've called them. They make additives because some people are going to put them in the fuel regardless of what they say and they know people with other brands of engines will use them.
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Old 07-21-2012, 07:10 PM   #38
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[QUOTE=Cat320;1250898]
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheArnolds View Post

If you'll look in your manual and call Cummins, they will tell you they do not recommend any additives be put in the fuel...I've called them. They make additives because some people are going to put them in the fuel regardless of what they say and they know people with other brands of engines will use them.
Thanks for the suggestion to contact Cummings. I will ask Cummings if I use a Cummings branded additive will it void my warranty? Will it harm my engine in any way? If the answer is no to both of these questions then it is my decision to use or not use.

I will report back as to the results of my conversation with Cummings.
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Old 07-22-2012, 02:17 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheArnolds

Thanks for the suggestion to contact Cummings. I will ask Cummings if I use a Cummings branded additive will it void my warranty? Will it harm my engine in any way? If the answer is no to both of these questions then it is my decision to use or not use.

I will report back as to the results of my conversation with Cummings.
Good idea...the question about the warranty vs using a Cummins product. Looking forward to hearing what they say.
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Old 07-23-2012, 04:26 PM   #40
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Good idea...the question about the warranty vs using a Cummins product. Looking forward to hearing what they say.
Please look at the PDF file attached;

Recreational Vehicle Maintenance and Operation
ISB Series Diesel
Quick Reference Guide
Includes information on 6.7- and 5.9-liter ISB electronic engines, from EPA ‘98 to current.

http://cumminsengines.com/assets/pdf/4971286.pdf

Referencing page #2:

"Other Fuel Additives
Any fuel additive product should be accompanied with
data supporting its performance and benefit. Engine failures
caused by incorrect fuel are NOT covered under warranty.
It is not the policy of Cummins to test, approve or endorse
any product not manufactured or sold by Cummins."

I am going to check further but it would appear that Cummings is not saying "NO" additives. They know that additives are sold and used so they want you to use a tested and approved product by Cummings...
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Old 07-23-2012, 07:26 PM   #41
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But they say basically the same thing about non Cummins oil and having to use a Fleetguard filter.

Per Service Bulletin Cummins® Engine Oil and Oil Analysis Recommendations
' As these oils will have directionally thinner oil films than 15W40 oils, top quality Fleetguard® filters must be used above 20°C [70°F]. Some oil suppliers might claim better fuel economy for these oils. Cummins Inc. can neither approve nor disapprove any product not manufactured by Cummins Inc.'
' Obtain the oil supplier's commitment that the oil will give satisfactory performance in Cummins® engines, or do not use the oil.'
'The same oil change intervals must be applied to synthetic oils that are applied to petroleum (mineral) based engine oils.'

Just saying...
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Old 07-23-2012, 07:42 PM   #42
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The ULSD already contains all the additives that are needed unless you need an anti-gel in cold weather.
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