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Old 09-29-2012, 05:50 PM   #29
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Torque equals pull. They call them diesel locomotives for a reason. Not to many gas powered trains out there. Diesel vs. Gas is right up there with Chevy vs. Ford and all those dang tow dolly vs. Four down threads.
Dont want to burst your bubble but trains are not driven directly by the diesel engine. They drive the generator that produces the electricity for the electric wheel motors.
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Old 09-30-2012, 02:46 PM   #30
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"Its only in the states that discourages diesels. If there were an increase of diesell cars there would be a much greater decrease of polution as it was proven by VW in california.

Gas is cheap as US export diesel to Europe and import gas.

Our diesel formulation here in Canada is closer to Europe and we have no pump problem like in tje states.

Its kill the diesel ideas that are the problem , its the only fuel for transportation that with the help of cheaper natural gas will power us to the future. Gas is out of my needs for the pass 20 years and will never turn back. And I alway drive by cost.

Any used diesel truck stock is way better then all the new light gas ones. Gas truck are build for comfort and need modificatios to pull without probllems like springs and exhaust manifold.

My own opinion."
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:00 PM   #31
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Sure, no problem. If you want more to read, let me know. The mandate to ULSD has created a myriad of problems. At work, the mechanics are seeing more injector/pump issues than previously with low sulfur fuels. Once the government gets involved, things go to hell in a hand basket rather quickly...

EGR Systems and Lubricating Oil in Diesel Engines
Huh? That article is about EGR and says nothing about low-sulfur fuels, other than that high sulfur content makes the negative effects of EGR worse (which is actually a counter-argument to the idea that ULSD is bad.) It the fuel manufacturer doesn't maintain sufficient lubricity then that could affect fuel system (not engine) longevity, but that is a different thing than ULSD being the culprit. So again, I'd be interested in seeing any info indicating that ULSD itself contributes to shorter engine life (unless by 'engine' you really meant 'fuel pump'?)
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:09 PM   #32
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Just as a FYI if you eat your fuel pump with it being upstream of your injectors you will eat your engine... ask some of the guys over in the Ford forums with Bosch fuel pumps.
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Old 09-30-2012, 08:25 PM   #33
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All the Locomotives I know about are diesel-electric locomotivies. Diesel engine turns a generator which powers the electric motors that provide the go power. Sort of a hybred we've had since WW-II.
HowStuffWorks "How Diesel Locomotives Work"
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Old 09-30-2012, 09:05 PM   #34
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Ok train geeks, you burst my bubble! Do these electric motors require great torque to turn? Does turning these huge electric motors make the train move? Is the diesel engine not the main source of power or do the electric motors turn themselves? The statement was more metaphoric than anything. Someone will now come along and correct me on how the diesel turns a generator which turns the electric motors which is connected to the.......I will never get that wasted 5 minutes of my life back.
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Old 09-30-2012, 09:22 PM   #35
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If you really want to talk about torque, look at an electric motor. Real low end torque.
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Old 10-01-2012, 05:49 AM   #36
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If you really want to talk about torque, look at an electric motor. Real low end torque.
Unfortunately half of the MH weight would be batteries... and replacing 10 or 20 k of batteries.... ouch.
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Old 10-01-2012, 09:34 AM   #37
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Unfortunately half of the MH weight would be batteries... and replacing 10 or 20 k of batteries.... ouch.
Depends on the hybred design. You could design it so that the batteries are used only to crank the engine, with just enough extra capacity to smooth out the flow of electricity from the generator to the electric motor(s). It wouldn't run on battery power only, the way most modern hybreds can run on battery power only - the engine would have to be running to supply enough power to the generator to produce the electric power required to turn the drive wheels. The way a locomotive is designed.
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Old 10-01-2012, 10:59 AM   #38
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Depends on the hybred design. You could design it so that the batteries are used only to crank the engine, with just enough extra capacity to smooth out the flow of electricity from the generator to the electric motor(s). It wouldn't run on battery power only, the way most modern hybreds can run on battery power only - the engine would have to be running to supply enough power to the generator to produce the electric power required to turn the drive wheels. The way a locomotive is designed.
I do apologize, I was not looking at it from a engineering stance.
So would you use the AC or the DC version (strength or economy)? Would we have pusher units sitting at the base of the Rockies to push you up?
The only batteries on a locomotive are for starting, does that count as the current widely accepted definition?
Just busting chops.... (for those that don't see it)
Full electric locomotives are more efficient at point of use.
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Old 10-02-2012, 06:52 PM   #39
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DC

Off topic but...

Yep, diesel engine powers DC generator in the locomotive

One important thing about electric motors, they can deliver torque at zero RPM, something an internal combustion engine cannot.

Also DC motors have several definite advantages. Very precise speed control and ability to be reversed easily. Run1, run2, etc for locomotives. Dynamic braking is also important when power generated by the DC Traction motors can be used to slow down the locomotive.

Steam engines were not so economical but were mighty powerful. The expansive force of steam is very efficient in delivering power but it's all in how you make the steam. As suggested, in the Cajon Pass into California steam locomotives were used to help push the heavy freight up the grade.
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Old 11-01-2012, 08:54 AM   #40
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This is good information. I am considering buying a diesel over gas as we plan to step up to a 5th wheel soon. I do plan to purchase a truck I can keep while (10 + yrs), as we plan to have a 5th wheel until the kids are out at a minimum. My issue was cost vs reward. I've seen gas 2500's with 200+ on them also. What about the service of a diesel? Is it more, less, or about the same? Although I only tow about 10 times a year, that's through various terrains. I plan to do more mountain camping and feel the diesel would be the best purchase.
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Old 11-01-2012, 08:11 PM   #41
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I've seen gas 2500's with 200+ on them also. What about the service of a diesel? Is it more, less, or about the same?
Assuming the same level of maintenance and TLC, a diesel engine will last at least twice as long as a gasser of the same power and doing the same amount of work.

For every one-ton dually gasser you can show me with over 200,000 miles on the clock, I can show you a one-ton dually diesel with over 500,000 miles on the clock.

But the engine is only part of the story. The transmission and other parts of the drivetrain will go south before the engine in a diesel. Things like water pumps, altenators, and AC compressors don't know and don't care what king of fuel the engine is burning.

In my '99.5 F-250 diesel, the automagic tranny was infamous for going south at about 100,000 miles. When it reached 112,000 miles and still going strong, I bit the bullet and had an expensive bullet-proof overhaul done on the tranny. I later sold the pickup with about 197,000 miles on the clock after over 11 years of mostly towing service. I expect that truck will still be going strong when it reaches 500,000 miles if the current owner continues to give it the TLC that I gave it.
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:54 PM   #42
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Take the diesel put of its torque curve and there nothing a well geared large cubic inch gasser can eat up a diesel. As someone noted its the gear ratio that can make or break any pickup. You take either gas or diesel and get them out of there power and it doesn't matter.

An old straight six large cubes gas will out pull anything from idle.
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