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Old 01-13-2008, 05:16 AM   #1
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I have noticed in other RV forums that the people that insist it is just fine to tow a 15000 pound Fifth wheel with a SRW pickup often justify it by
trying to convince themselves that the only ratings that are important are the ones they can meet. Their pin weight puts them over their GVWR but that is fine because they are not over their
rear axle rating. Some are over both GVWR and rear axle ratings but that is OK because they are within their combined rating. Unbelievable but true, and what is worse is that some of these people try to convince others to do the same silly thing. I find it so ridiculous that this group will also complain that the GVWR on their trailers is not as high as they want it to be.
They want to be able to overload their pickups even more than they already do. Yes, I have seen posters that really try to stay within the trailer's GVWR but are "comfortable" being over a 1000 pounds too much on the truck's GVWR . This weight issue keeps coming up and when you argue about it with high posters on some forums, they simply kick you off the site. I have seen misinformation on these forums that has caused new Rvers to go out and buy the wrong truck for the unit they want.
People like myself are called weight policeman by the overweight crowd .
So glad to find an RV forum where the moderators agree with me on the weight issue.
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Old 01-13-2008, 06:56 AM   #2
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I for one would love to see all RV forums adopt a moritorium on weight related posts.

People are going to either use common sense when matching tow vehicles to their campers or not, and NO manner of "weight police" preaching is going to change anything.
tc
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Old 01-13-2008, 07:11 AM   #3
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I believe we still owe it to the "newbies" who are trying to size a truck and trailer combo to walk them through the process. At the end of the day, however, you're right - everyone will make his/her own decision and build the justification required to validate that decision in his/her own mind.

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Old 01-13-2008, 08:26 AM   #4
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I for one am a person that is/has been shouted down and even cursed at on the other forums for stating the simple fact that towing overloaded is no fun. I am from the "been there, done that" group. My fiver in sig was pulled for two years with a 2500HD GM offering. And believe me it was no fun being pushed all over the road at every curve, turn. I have finally just given up and am choosing mot to post any more on the subject until the moderators get a handle on the obscene comments put forth against people like me. There was a guy, former GM engineer who laid it out pretty clearly how the numbers are arrived at by the manufacturers, but he too was shouted down. So I guess there are a lot of people towing overloaded and the only way they can justify doing so is to scream louder than the rest of us.
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Old 01-13-2008, 11:30 AM   #5
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I promise this is the first time and the last time that I will start a new topic on the weight issue.
I have no intent on ever changing a person's mind once he has decided to tow overweight, my only concern is when these overweight people try to convince new people than every model of fifth wheel made is just fine with a SRW TV.
Then these new people should hear the rest of the story.
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Old 01-13-2008, 11:32 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by 450Donn:
I for one am a person that is/has been shouted down and even cursed at on the other forums for stating the simple fact that towing overloaded is no fun....I have finally just given up and am choosing mot to post any more on the subject until the moderators get a handle on the obscene comments put forth against people like me. There was a guy, former GM engineer who laid it out pretty clearly how the numbers are arrived at by the manufacturers, but he too was shouted down.
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Old 01-13-2008, 05:07 PM   #7
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I for one am very impressed with the common coutesy practiced on this site. I think the moderators do an excellent job of keeping this forum clean and friendly. Weight topics seem to be a hotly debated topic, but it is on the person looking for advice to take all the information/opinions offered and make a decision for themselves. There are folks on here who adimently beleive that you can't tow anything with a 1/2 ton pickup except a popup, and others who would tow a 30' fiver with one, but everyone respects the others opinions and offers the best advice they can.
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Old 01-15-2008, 03:47 PM   #8
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I have been watching these forums, and the highways, ever since I joined 7 years ago. These observations have me convinced that 70% of the fifth wheel rigs on the highway are overweight. I expect that there will be a bad accident, the other party will have the rig weighed, and then sue the owner into homelessness. Things will start to change then.

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Old 01-15-2008, 03:55 PM   #9
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but everyone respects the others opinions and offers the best advice they can....
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Old 01-15-2008, 07:08 PM   #10
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I only have one question for wrenchtraveller - why did you zero in on SRW owners. I don't think everyone pulling a 5ver needs to be driving a dually. My truck's GVWR is 9900 lbs. Loaded with fuel, hitch and 2 people it weighed 7266 on the scales giving me a payload of 2634. The tongue weight of my 5ver is 1980 so I feel very comfortable towing my rig with my SRW truck.
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Old 01-16-2008, 06:07 AM   #11
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Don,

Wrenchtraveler cited the example of a 15,000 lb 5th wheel. Of course, many are heavier. A 15,000 5th wheel would have a pin weight of around 3,000 lbs. In your case, 7,266 lbs curb weight + 3,000 lbs pin weight equals 10,266 lbs GVW, 366 lbs over your truck's 9,900 lb GVWR, yet probably well within your truck's "manufacturer's trailer tow rating". That's precisely the trap that the SRW owner can walk into when looking at HEAVY 5th wheels.

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Old 01-16-2008, 06:53 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by allendp:
I only have one question for wrenchtraveller - why did you zero in on SRW owners. I don't think everyone pulling a 5ver needs to be driving a dually. My truck's GVWR is 9900 lbs. Loaded with fuel, hitch and 2 people it weighed 7266 on the scales giving me a payload of 2634. The tongue weight of my 5ver is 1980 so I feel very comfortable towing my rig with my SRW truck.
Don,
Please I mean no disrespect, but I would like to know how did you arrive at the pin weight of 1980 pounds? Was this taken from the manufacturers brochure, or did you take it to the scales? Reason I ask, is that my Cedar Creek had an advertised pin weight of 1780 pounds and in real life it scales at closer to 3000 pounds when the trailer is loaded and ready to camp.
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Old 01-16-2008, 07:10 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by RustyJC:
I believe we still owe it to the "newbies" who are trying to size a truck and trailer combo to walk them through the process. At the end of the day, however, you're right - everyone will make his/her own decision and build the justification required to validate that decision in his/her own mind.

Rusty
I think Rusty hit the nail on the head.[LIST]<LI>Inform the public not to believe the salesman when they say "x unit can be towed with x vehicle.<LI>Show them how to find all the weights for the towing unit and the towed unit.<LI>Explain the dry weight and loaded weight concept.<LI>Explain how to use scales to find their own answers.<LI>In the end, let them choose their own path.<LI>Do all the above with no flames or ill will.
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Old 01-17-2008, 05:00 AM   #14
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Originally posted by allendp:
I only have one question for wrenchtraveller - why did you zero in on SRW owners. I don't think everyone pulling a 5ver needs to be driving a dually. My truck's GVWR is 9900 lbs. Loaded with fuel, hitch and 2 people it weighed 7266 on the scales giving me a payload of 2634. The tongue weight of my 5ver is 1980 so I feel very comfortable towing my rig with my SRW truck.
Hi Don, my intension was not to zero in on SRW pickup owners. I own a SRW pickup myself and prefer it to a duallie in looks and size so I was careful to research my Fifth wheel specs.
My 05 F350 SRW has an 11200 pound GVWR. Previous to 05 Fords, 9900 was the max GVWR on SRW.
This increase in payload keeps my 06 Montana within my specs. My model is the 2955RL which is
33 feet long and puts 2600 pounds on the pin when loaded up the way I travel. I used to own an 04 F350 with a 9900 pound GVWR and the way I load my trailer would overload that truck.
Everything you put in the cab or the box is part of your payload and so is your pin weight.
Some people may tow larger trailers than mine with a SRW and stay within their specs.I could not because my model has most of the storage up front like most fivers. My washer/dryer is over the pin so for me if I want a larger Montana, I will have to go to a duallie. On the Montana owners site, we had very esteemed members towing over 1000 pounds overweight which is completely their own private matter but they would try and convince newbies this was perfectly acceptable.
That is when it became a public matter to myself and others. On the MOC website, when you disagree with esteemed members, you are simply booted off as I was. Love and harmony is a wonderful thing but when it promotes ignorance it loses it's charm.Take care and Happy travels.
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