GVWR Sticker and Alterations Debate!

[FastEagle]

Lots of good information in this reference.

The reason I’ve provided it here is to get the readers to scroll down to item #8 where you will find the caveat emptor statement.

Importation and Certification FAQ's Directory--Trailers and Heavy Trucks

FastEagle

[Mr_D]

Originally Posted by FastEagle

Lots of good information in this reference.

The reason I’ve provided it here is to get the readers to scroll down to item #8 where you will find the caveat emptor statement.

Importation and Certification FAQ's Directory--Trailers and Heavy Trucks

FastEagle

Good info, in our case the rig was overweight on the front axle AS IT LEFT THE FACTORY with nothing aboard, not even a driver. It was only 50#'s but that still made it illegal.

On the 1988 Type B MH it was imported from Canada and the wheels were not rated for the vehicle's weight so it failed the NHTSA import rules.

[Bobsbeatter]

On the 1988 Type B MH it was imported from Canada and the wheels were not rated for the vehicle's weight so it failed the NHTSA import rules.[/QUOTE]

Was this due to a previous owner instaling aftermarket wheels?

[sdennislee]

Originally Posted by TXiceman

As a point of reference, a pressure vessel above 15 psig and over 10 cu. ft. volume requires an ASME U stamp per the National code, ASME Section VIII. With this stamp there is paper work, for the required calculations, tracking the welders (welders do have to be certified and tested for welding various steel and steel alloys), the material (materials have to be tested and have papers tracing its history) and pressure testing. The final pressure test has to be witnessed and signed by an ASME inspector before the U form is issued for the vessel. All of this is to provide a safe product to the public, otherwise,you would have any small back-woods welder building vessels without regard to the codes.

Now the vessel can be repaired or rerated. The ASME code requires specific procedures be followed and in some cases, a new pressure test and witnessed before the vessel can be legally placed back into service.

I would rather see some kind of specific code requirements for up rating a trucks GVWR. The specific Federal code does not adequately control the parameters of the rerating process. It does leave it open to Bubba's Bait and Axle Shoppee to do the work with little guidance.



Ken

Hey don't forget us NDT guys, we have to radiograph those welds.

[3665RE]

Originally Posted by phil57

All the continents added up to 850lbs. I am overweight with this on board and full fuel and two passengers. 40'DP
The numbers don't add up and thats all I will say until I meet with the manufacture this week and hash all this out.
My point is if this were a used MH I would be looking for ways to increase the GVW to be safe so whats wrong with having a discussion about what can be done and what can't be done.

Hi

You are very correct. If the unit is new and the manufacturer will take into their facility and modify it they have the authority to add a “modification” certificate to the doorpost.

As I mentioned the end user doesn’t have this authority. The Ford modification to convert the 250 to a 350 still required a local DOT inspector to issue approval for the increase in GVW. Then the increased GVW sticker could be put on the doorpost.

The real problem happens when you have a serious accident. That changes every thing. You may operate 10 years over weight and not have a problem with officials. But have a serious accident and every thing changes.

Definition of a serious accident. “ When one or more vehicles have to be towed from the seen of the accident”.

Phil P

[drfife]

Originally Posted by 3665RE

...The real problem happens when you have a serious accident. That changes every thing. You may operate 10 years over weight and not have a problem with officials. But have a serious accident and every thing changes....

I have not seen a documented case for an overweight private vehicle taken to court for an accident.

[Bobsbeatter]

Yawn.

[BFlinn181]

Originally Posted by drfife

I have not seen a documented case for an overweight private vehicle taken to court for an accident.

Yeah, well before 1994 I never saw a 'documented case' of anyone suing McDonalds because their coffee was too hot either. Sadly, if someone sees a hook to hang a lawsuit on, they'll do it.

[3665RE]

Originally Posted by BFlinn181

Yeah, well before 1994 I never saw a 'documented case' of anyone suing McDonalds because their coffee was too hot either. Sadly, if someone sees a hook to hang a lawsuit on, they'll do it.

Hi

You are quite correct where you see the court cases concerning vehicles that were only 50 to 100 lbs overweight are civil litigation.

Unfortunately my consulting business is for people that have Federal DOT certificates. The only state regulations I get involved in are Florida. I have a close friend that is a retired Florida Highway Patrol vehicular homicide investigator. This gives me a source of information that gives me the “edge” over a lot of the enforcement officers I have to do business with. Fortunately my business is to advise the owner / operator how to avoid these types of problems. I don’t get involved with attorneys.

The federal regulations are not aggressively pursued but the state regulations are.

The Florida Highway Patrol has many trained vehicular homicide investigators. There are many cases in the court files where the Florida Highway Patrol has brought Vehicular Homicide / manslaughter charges against the drivers of over weight vehicles. Many of them are not about hauling the weight but about stopping the weight. Florida doesn’t differentiate between private and commercial vehicles in this respect, over weight is over weight. Although I haven’t seen any Vehicular Homicide / manslaughter cases for minor over weight accidents. Most are grossly over weight.

3665RE

[BFlinn181]

Thank you, 3665RE. This argument, "I've not seen a lawsuit..." ranks right up there with, "I've driven thousands of miles with(out)..."
I could jump off a cliff and not have any problems for hundreds of feet until that final couple of inches. Seems to me this thread was started to show that modifications to GVWR are possible, but very difficult and probably costly to properly and legally document/get approved. It would seem, as I said in my first response, just buy a bigger rig or reduce the load you're carrying. All the nitpicking and justifications don't erase these facts.

[3665RE]

Originally Posted by BFlinn181

Thank you, 3665RE.

You are welcome.

How do you like your Gulf Stream? My wife and I have a widow friend with a 2002 Gulf Stream BT Cruiser and she loves it. I have been doing some minor repairs for her.

3665RE

[drfife]

The irony is, most of the vehicles over their GVWR are motorhomes.

[JIMNLIN]

Originally Posted by BFlinn181

Thank you, 3665RE. This argument, "I've not seen a lawsuit..." ranks right up there with, "I've driven thousands of miles with(out)..."
I could jump off a cliff and not have any problems for hundreds of feet until that final couple of inches. Seems to me this thread was started to show that modifications to GVWR are possible, but very difficult and probably costly to properly and legally document/get approved. It would seem, as I said in my first response, just buy a bigger rig or reduce the load you're carrying. All the nitpicking and justifications don't erase these facts.

3665RE makes a good point; "Florida doesn’t differentiate between private and commercial vehicles in this respect,"

I would add I don't know of any state that has seperate weight laws for a private use vehicle and commercial vehicle or that exempts RV from overweight violations.

As private haulers we don't have to declare a gross weight or declare a gross combined weight. However were limited by the trucks axle/tire load ratings. Over those and you have a overloaded vehicle.

Keep in mind a overload vehicle can be;

a registered gross weight violation....

a registered gross combined weight violation ....

a axle weight violation (any of the truck or trailer axles) ...

Hopefully the bigger rig will have higher axle/tire capacities as just a higher GVWR gains nothing but possible higher tags fees.

[hooverbill]

Originally Posted by drfife

The irony is, most of the vehicles over their GVWR are motorhomes.

Where did this information come from? I can't speak for other MH drivers, but when I'm loaded and ready to travel, I'm a ton (literally) under my maximum weight.

Also, I hesitate to take weight information seriously from a person who's about to pull a 17,500 pound 5th wheel with a SRW truck. Be happy to discuss numbers with you, but no way you'll be within GCWR limits.