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Old 08-27-2013, 12:25 PM   #99
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I still don't get it. An electrician or plumber requires a licence to work on your house. But a dealer or hitch shop can hook up your trailer without a licence or any kind of discussion on hitch safety. Seeing as the last person to hook your trailer is typically the dealer and not the TV manufacturer, perhaps they should be required to have a licence and install a sticker that shows it complies with safety requirements. I know I wouldn't hesitate to have to pay a little more if they were required to do this.
Being an installer and dealer, I would be totally ok with getting a license. It's the ones who would fail their tests that give me a bad name.
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Old 08-27-2013, 01:48 PM   #100
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Maybe a newbie lawyer will get in a bad accident some day and destroy his/her truck and trailer and sue the pants off everyone involved. Maybe that's what it will take to change things for the better.

I still don't get it. An electrician or plumber requires a licence to work on your house. But a dealer or hitch shop can hook up your trailer without a licence or any kind of discussion on hitch safety. Seeing as the last person to hook your trailer is typically the dealer and not the TV manufacturer, perhaps they should be required to have a licence and install a sticker that shows it complies with safety requirements. I know I wouldn't hesitate to have to pay a little more if they were required to do this.
Licensing does not ensure safety, nor does government oversight, imho. Frankly, I don't need the government to protect me from myself nor protect others from me, and I have no confidence they will effectively protect me from others through any sort of licensing program. The only thing that sort of regulation will do effectively is drive up prices by squashing competition.
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Old 08-27-2013, 02:25 PM   #101
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Licensing does not ensure safety, nor does government oversight, imho. Frankly, I don't need the government to protect me from myself nor protect others from me, and I have no confidence they will effectively protect me from others through any sort of licensing program. The only thing that sort of regulation will do effectively is drive up prices by squashing competition.
Really? Go out and get a bid for work on your house from a non licensed contractor. Better get two, one form a licensed contractor also, cause the non licensed one will definitely do it wrong. How about no licensing for fire fighters, police. How about non certified technicians working on your truck. Licensing creates a standard by which everyone adheres to. Without licensing you don't have the proper training. Without proper training you get substandard results. Just because some services don't produce good results is no reason to say all licensing is wrong.

Seems to me there's was plenty of competition between licensed services.

Too much tea party thinking IMO.
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Old 08-27-2013, 02:47 PM   #102
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Really? Go out and get a bid for work on your house from a non licensed contractor. Better get two, one form a licensed contractor also, cause the non licensed one will definitely do it wrong. How about no licensing for fire fighters, police. How about non certified technicians working on your truck. Licensing creates a standard by which everyone adheres to. Without licensing you don't have the proper training. Without proper training you get substandard results. Just because some services don't produce good results is no reason to say all licensing is wrong.

Seems to me there's was plenty of competition between licensed services.

Too much tea party thinking IMO.
I'm all for certifications. I'm just not for the government REQUIRING them. Licensing (different from certifications) is just another government boondoggle.

I have a non-licensed contractor work on my house all the time, builds barns and outbuildings for me as well. Does excellent work. Does it right the FIRST time. The only 'licensed' contractor I ever had on my property ripped me off, and I ended up in court suing him. He's now a high school math teacher (go figure).

I, for instance, am an I.T. professional, and I carry several certifications, but no licenses. I perform excellent work, and will put it up against any "licensed" contractor in my field. None of my certifications are from government certification boards. I submit that ANY professional field (police, fire, etc) could be handled the same way more efficiently and produce better results.
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Old 08-27-2013, 09:55 PM   #103
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Licensing - now that's funny. Look at all the idiot drivers on our roadways to see what licensing will get you.
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Old 08-28-2013, 01:43 AM   #104
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Ramblin is absolutely right!!!
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Old 08-28-2013, 03:22 AM   #105
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Instructions

I think even an instruction sheet would have been helpful. I specifically asked what the physics were behind the weight distribution hitch to attempt to grasp the details. The service tech was not able to explain the physics behind the WDH. I found this rather odd, but was planning on doing research in the future to educate myself. Unfortunately, that did not happen first. I still don't know, based on my wheel base and poundage overage, that it would have made a difference. I think there was no tongue weight...literally.

I do blame the TV dealer. When I specifically ask if the trailer is safe to pull with my vehicle and they say, yes...they are the experts and should recommend what is safe.

Still frustrated!
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Old 08-28-2013, 06:39 AM   #106
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NRiley - IMO, there is enough blame for everybody here. The important (and amazing) thing is that you and your family weren't hurt!
What are the lessons that you have learned that could prevent this from happening to someone else?
I have my thoughts, but it would be interesting to hear what you think first.
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Old 08-28-2013, 07:36 AM   #107
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You need to get an adequate TV. Get a 3/4 ton or 1 ton truck, the suspension is much stiffer and will control the TT. Soft 1/2 ton suspensions will not control the TT as you have found out.
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Old 08-28-2013, 09:02 AM   #108
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Licensing - now that's funny. Look at all the idiot drivers on our roadways to see what licensing will get you.
Then explain how you would regulate driving w/o a license. You can't. You need proof that the driver took the necessary steps to qualify to drive. Then when they abuse their privilege how would you penalize them? Can't take something away that doesn't exist. You're [moderator edit]way of thinking would take us back to the days of horses and buggy's.
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Old 08-28-2013, 09:10 AM   #109
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Then explain how you would regulate driving w/o a license. You can't. You need proof that the driver took the necessary steps to qualify to drive. Then when they abuse their privilege how would you penalize them? Can't take something away that doesn't exist. You're [moderator edit] way of thinking would take us back to the days of horses and buggy's.
The flip side to this, and what has been suggested in this thread about RV dealers, would be to require Automobile dealerships to train everyone who purchases a car to drive it, and then hold the DEALERSHIP responsible if the driver then goes out and has an accident. Is this not idiocy as well?
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Old 08-28-2013, 09:29 AM   #110
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The flip side to this, and what has been suggested in this thread about RV dealers, would be to require Automobile dealerships to train everyone who purchases a car to drive it, and then hold the DEALERSHIP responsible if the driver then goes out and has an accident. Is this not idiocy as well?
I think that you have mixed in additional requirements. It is the job of the dealership to explain HOW the vehicle is to be operated; i.e. all of the controls, maximums and limitations, and where to find additional information pertaining to this and maintenance schedules etc. Included in this would be maximums for towing if so equipped. It's not their job to teach you how to drive it.

That said, if the RV dealers do not take the responsibility of properly educating their customers, the Government eventually will, and I foresee that to include licensing for towing as well.
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Old 08-28-2013, 09:52 AM   #111
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When did you deal with the last salesperson who actually knew there product? The last car I last bought had features on it (I had researched on the internet) that the salesman didn't know it had. He'd been selling that brand for 25 years. My wife and I were shopping for a washing machine and the salesperson couldn't explain where you put fabric softener for the fabric softener setting. (After finding a manual, it said you needed a fabric softener 'ball' to toss in the machine.)
Growing up on a cabin cruiser, I saw lots of new boat owners who couldn't tie a knot, let alone operate a boat, set an anchor, or any of the necessary skills to safely operate a boat. Best entertainment was sitting by the boat launch ramp and count the mistakes.
What is not sold with an RV is the knowledge of the complicated nature of the beast. Loading, hooking up, operating the various systems, is skimmed over to close a sale, just like in the boating industry. Perhaps a giant pamphlet pasted to the entry door saying "Read me first" with some critical tips would be in order, but many wouldn't even open it. Fact is, unless you grew up experiencing RV life, you might not know the ins and outs of safe use. We all grew up with automobiles, so we saw how to operate one sitting next to a parent and then a driver's ed. class or license test.

You can't legislate common sense.
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Old 08-28-2013, 11:06 AM   #112
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The flip side to this, and what has been suggested in this thread about RV dealers, would be to require Automobile dealerships to train everyone who purchases a car to drive it, and then hold the DEALERSHIP responsible if the driver then goes out and has an accident. Is this not idiocy as well?
I think we are all OT. RV dealers are trying to make a sale. Some are cheese balls and some are genuinely helping the customer. I've been on dealer lots looking at TT's and had one of the sales people tell me I could tow a TT with the truck I had. I ended up talking to the manager and he said no way. It's more about RV dealers being responsible sales people than anything. Take away the cheese balls and you would have less example like the OP had. Problem is too many sales people have no conscience. Not even the government could regulate morality.
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