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Old 02-15-2008, 06:38 AM   #1
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I am shopping for a 3/4 ton truck. I have tried all truck sites and the intenet looking for the max weight a truck can take for the king pin. On the GM site I found a rating of 3000 lbs max weight for the king pin regardless of the size of the 5th wheel. Every other OEM truck site lists 15 - 25% of the 5th's GVWR. Can I assume that the max weight could be considered as a payload rate for the truck? The 5er we like has a pin weight of 1420, well within the GMC 2500HD CC 4x2 LB 6.0 engine 4,10 axle. The 5er GVWR is 8600. I have used the 5th wheel calculator at
http://changingears.com/rv-sec-calc-...eight-fw.shtml

It shows my truck and 5er is within what I require.
GVWR 9200
GCWR 21000
Curb Wt 5954
Max Tow 13000 WD Hitch 4.10 axle
Max King Pin Weight 3000
RGAWR 6084

The calculator shows the following:

Max trailer weight = 12000 lbs;
Max Trailer weight with margin of 20% = 9600 lbs.
Max King Pin Weight = 3000 lbs.
Max King Pin Weight with margin of 25% = 2400 lbs.

I have used the V10 in the Ford with the 4.10 axle with the same max pin weight and it is identical to the GMC's calculations.

The Dodge with the hemi is less at 11200, 8960, 2800, and 2240 with my chosen 5er.

Can anyone on this board confrim or deny the 3000 lbs max pin weight on both the Ford and Dodge?

Using the same calculator on the duramax diesel, there is no advantage to getting it, as the figures are the same as above, which makes me believe that I am in error somewhere.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks
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Old 02-15-2008, 06:38 AM   #2
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I am shopping for a 3/4 ton truck. I have tried all truck sites and the intenet looking for the max weight a truck can take for the king pin. On the GM site I found a rating of 3000 lbs max weight for the king pin regardless of the size of the 5th wheel. Every other OEM truck site lists 15 - 25% of the 5th's GVWR. Can I assume that the max weight could be considered as a payload rate for the truck? The 5er we like has a pin weight of 1420, well within the GMC 2500HD CC 4x2 LB 6.0 engine 4,10 axle. The 5er GVWR is 8600. I have used the 5th wheel calculator at
http://changingears.com/rv-sec-calc-...eight-fw.shtml

It shows my truck and 5er is within what I require.
GVWR 9200
GCWR 21000
Curb Wt 5954
Max Tow 13000 WD Hitch 4.10 axle
Max King Pin Weight 3000
RGAWR 6084

The calculator shows the following:

Max trailer weight = 12000 lbs;
Max Trailer weight with margin of 20% = 9600 lbs.
Max King Pin Weight = 3000 lbs.
Max King Pin Weight with margin of 25% = 2400 lbs.

I have used the V10 in the Ford with the 4.10 axle with the same max pin weight and it is identical to the GMC's calculations.

The Dodge with the hemi is less at 11200, 8960, 2800, and 2240 with my chosen 5er.

Can anyone on this board confrim or deny the 3000 lbs max pin weight on both the Ford and Dodge?

Using the same calculator on the duramax diesel, there is no advantage to getting it, as the figures are the same as above, which makes me believe that I am in error somewhere.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks
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Old 02-15-2008, 06:49 AM   #3
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What's missing (and tough to get when shopping) is the truck's laden curb weight (LCW). That's the weight of the truck with driver, passengers, pets, full fuel tank, options, accessories, cargo, 5th wheel hitch, etc. The manufacturer's published curb weight is typically that of a base truck with only a 150 lb driver, so the LCW can be significantly greater than the manufacturer's curb weight.

With the LCW, calculation of maximum allowable pin weight is easy:

Maximum allowable loaded pin weight = Truck's GVWR minus Truck's LCW

Although you didn't ask, the LCW is also vital in calculating the maximum allowable total loaded trailer weight:

Maximum allowable loaded trailer weight (total) = Truck's GCWR minus Truck's LCW.

The conservative approach when evaluating a 5th wheel is to use the trailer's GVWR as its total weight and 20% of the trailer's GVWR as its laden pin weight.

Rusty
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Old 02-15-2008, 09:52 AM   #4
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Without the actual truck and taking it to the scales, you are really taking a shot in the dark. MAx payload is generally calculated by the manufacturer using a bare bones strippo truck with maybe 5 gal of gas in the tank and a 150 pound driver. Or some variation of it. It will not have a lot do do with the real world. If you want to get an estimate of the net ready to camp weight, use 7000 pounds. My 2500HD ext cab 4X4 diesel weighed ready to camp 7500 pounds, so I am fairly comfortable using that number for a gasser. So, if you were to use 7000 pounds in ready to camp weight that would leave you 2200 pounds for pin weight. A 8600 GVWR fiver would have a pin weight of 1720 pounds, so in theory you would be just fine.
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Old 02-15-2008, 01:48 PM   #5
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DON'T TAKE ANYTHING PRINTED TO JUDGE YOUR WEIGHTS.

The curb weights they list for GM vehicles are regular cab, 4x2 with no options. I went through the same thing when I was looking at the GM's. The salesmen even repeated I could have a 3000K pin weight with a 4x4, crew cab , diesel , 2500.. I said okay and now weigh it, they didn't want to do it at first, but I told them no deal if they don't. If it comes in at the curb weight as they stated I would give them cash on the spot.

Shipping weight listed for that truck was 6200lbs, leaving 3000 curb for pin at max GVWR of 9200lbs.

After weighing it with full tank, me and salesman in the truck. Weight was 7400lbs.. I looked at the salesman and said, Hmmm, only 1800lbs of payload. We drove back and we then enlightened the sales manager who swore the printed numbers were correct.

Now add in 200lbs for hitch and then I was down to 1600lbs of payload. By the time I was done adding bedliner, aux tank, roll top cover, junk in the cab I was lucking to have 1200lbs max payload.

Sadly, it forced me to buy a Ford f350 with a GVWR of 11,400lbs.
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Old 02-16-2008, 11:10 AM   #6
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My biggest regret in getting my F250 was that I didn't get a F-350. My reasons would be the same as Creeper's. There are a lot of 5'ers that I've wanted, but had to pass. IMHO, I'd get a one ton and be done with it.

(It's like a garage; you think it's big enough, but it never really is.
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Old 02-16-2008, 11:42 AM   #7
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It's a safety factor to have excess capacity, and it's never a good idea to be towing right at, or over, the load limits.
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Old 02-16-2008, 04:32 PM   #8
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An F250 diesel will scale around 7200 to 7400# normal ready to travel mode. The F350 crewcab dually will run around 8000# plus ready to travel.

You sure hear a lot of folks complaining about not enough truck, but seldom hear about too much truck.

Ken
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