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Old 10-16-2019, 05:03 PM   #1
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Pairing truck and 5th wheel feedback needed

Help please. I am running into something similar to previous person asking. Currently got 2018 GMC denali duramax short bed truck paired with TT 2015 Palomino Solaire Ultra Lite 318TSBHK and 7125 UVW. Looking at 5th wheel which is 2016 KZ Durango 346BHQ with UVW 11,270, hitch 2,090 and GVWR 13,400. Will this setup work to upgrade to 5th wheel or any thoughts/feedback will be appreciated. Thanks!
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Old 10-16-2019, 05:37 PM   #2
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Fivers GVWR is over 13K pounds. That translates to a pin weight north of 2600 pounds using the 20% rule. Add 250 pounds for a slider hitch. So conservative numbers put you at 2850 pounds directly over the rear axle.
Since you did not say and it is a short bed I assume it is a 2500? Did you weigh the truck loaded ready to travel yet? What you need most is ready to travel rear axle weight. You also need the RAWR which is rear axle weight rating. Then you can do the simple math RAWR minus scaled weight. Do you have 2850 pounds left over for the pin weight?
To be honest with you the simple answer is NO!
Had a 2500 D/A a few years ago. Made the mistake your trying to do. Bought a 36 foor fiver with a GVWR of 13,750 pounds. Once we were loaded up ready to go, DW, me and dog we were 1800 pounds over the trucks GVWR all of that was on the rear axle. That put me over the tire load ratings. Sadly after spending hundreds of dollars in upgrades we swapped for a dually and never looked back. Towing was never the issue, loading was and is your problem.
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Old 10-16-2019, 05:55 PM   #3
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Yes fiver GVWR is 13400. Yes it’s 2500HD but diesel and was told can’t ever go wrong with diesel engine. However I do understand your point on payload. No never did any scale type. Just wanted to research prior to upgrading into fiver. So based on what I am hearing, it’s either stay with current TT or upgrade into lighter fiver? What’s fiver max I should be considering?
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Old 10-16-2019, 06:07 PM   #4
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Your truck will pull it but you maybe maxed out on rear rear gawr. My friend has same truck with a 32 ft 5th wheel. He is 11500 lbs scaled. He has 1900 lbs hitch weight. He is almost at rear tire load. Manufacturer specs does not include all your stuff for camping. My 5th wheel is 600lbs heavier on the hitch then manufacturer specs. I would weight your truck and see what your payload is. I did the same thing when I moved to my 5th wheel and had to buy a bigger truck. My friend is looking at going to a 275/65r20 to give him more rear tire load.
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Old 10-16-2019, 06:55 PM   #5
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Ok basically I can go to scale with truck empty including myself of course and get that accurate weight then figure out where I am at right? Truck is 3.73 axel ratio, max TT is 13,500 and GCWR is 25,300 according to owner’s manual. Does this help with anything?
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Old 10-16-2019, 07:58 PM   #6
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not really. WE know a new gen diesl can pull heavy loads.
GM gives their 2500 trucks a 6200 rawr.
Rear axle may weigh in the 3000 lb range leaving a 3200 lb in the bed payload.

Your on the right track on weighing the trucks front and rear axles separately. That way you know how much weight can be placed on the rear axle/tires/rear suspension.

I pull a 11200 lb 5er with a '03 2500 Dodge/Cummins 6000 rawr. Rear axle loads run around 5200-5400 lbs when towing depending on how we load the combo.No issues at all starting/stoping or handling 10k mountain passes.
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Old 10-16-2019, 08:23 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hans-barak View Post
Ok basically I can go to scale with truck empty including myself of course and get that accurate weight then figure out where I am at right? Truck is 3.73 axel ratio, max TT is 13,500 and GCWR is 25,300 according to ownerís manual. Does this help with anything?
No,no,NO!
Go to the acales loaded like your ready to go camping. That means all family members, full tank of fuel, plus what ever else you would normally carry for a trip.
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Old 10-16-2019, 08:26 PM   #8
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Ok. Is there a way to find this rear axel ratio without going to scale just to have a ballpark before I actually go? My yellow sticker on door say 2155 payload so I figured that’s a number to not max or exceed with passengers, hitch weight and pin weight unless there is other stuff I need to include.
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Old 10-16-2019, 08:47 PM   #9
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I can’t go to scale hooked up, I don’t have a 5th wheel. I currently have pull behind TT which when hooked with weight distribution setup, the truck doesn’t even know it’s behind it. I thought I would just go to scale to get accurate truck payload I guess.
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Old 10-16-2019, 09:41 PM   #10
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I canít go to scale hooked up, I donít have a 5th wheel. I currently have pull behind TT which when hooked with weight distribution setup, the truck doesnít even know itís behind it. I thought I would just go to scale to get accurate truck payload I guess.


Forget about your engine being able to "pull" a heavy load. That's not the issue. Diesels are much heavier than gas engines and actually reduce your available payload.

Your rear axle is the weak link. That's what separates 3/4 tons from 1 tons and dually's...

Stick with the lighter TT.
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Old 10-16-2019, 10:05 PM   #11
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Yikes, 2,155 lbs cargo capacity is not high enough to carry the pin weight of very many 5th wheels and certainly not a 40' long KZ. Most of the storage in a 5th wheel is in the front and will add even more weight to the pin weight.

The 250/2500 series trucks are good at towing travel trailers but not carrying the pin weight of a 5th wheel.

350/3500 series trucks are better at carrying that weight. For example a F-350 carry approx 1,300 - 1,500lbs more than a F-250.

Dually trucks can typically carry 1,500 - 2,000 lbs more then single rear wheel 350/3500 series trucks.
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Old 10-16-2019, 10:57 PM   #12
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My first duramax was a 2009 2500 and we pulled an Everest 5th wheel grossing at 14,000. Trailer pulled fine, no issues. I'd say go for it.
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Old 10-16-2019, 11:04 PM   #13
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There you go. 'Go For It'

Lots of opinions.

You will only be 1,000lbs overweight.

A 2009 was before GM strengthen the frame in 2011...ugh
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Old 10-16-2019, 11:05 PM   #14
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My first duramax was a 2009 2500 and we pulled an Everest 5th wheel grossing at 14,000. Trailer pulled fine, no issues. I'd say go for it.


now you had to just go wake up the weight police didnít you
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