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Old 09-13-2018, 09:27 AM   #15
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One important note; Do not leave the scale ticket on the dash when you take it in for warranty work!
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Old 09-13-2018, 09:56 AM   #16
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I had similar numbers to yours when I first bought my trailer and with careful loading and adjusting I was able to make it work. I got pretty tired of constantly worrying about weight and it was inconvenient to find water at our destination sometimes but it was workable. When you tow at the limit like that there is much less wiggle room for loading.

You also will get pushed around by wind and passing trucks more since the trailer will weigh considerably more than the truck. I was quite surprised at the difference in feel and control after switching to a 3/4 ton. Not that it was unsafe before but it is so much easier to drive now. Not worn out after a day of towing and I can bring anything I want. A 35 MPH wind was the limit of how far I could push it before and now I feel safe with gusts over 50 MPH.

So you be the judge. You can certainly make this work with a trip to the scales to dial in your hitch. I recommend having truck and trailer loaded as you would be and bring your tools to adjust the hitch. Also bring a tape measure to make sure the trailer is level when hooked up. It should be within an inch front to back, slightly nose down is preferable to slightly nose up. Truck and trailer should look straight and level when adjusted properly. If you adjust the hitch you will need to check the level again as it will change.

Get all 3 weights: 1. Truck and trailer loaded with WD hitch engaged. 2. Truck and trailer without WD hitch engaged. 3. Truck only

That will tell the whole story. Even a small adjustment will have an effect on how it drives.
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Old 09-13-2018, 01:07 PM   #17
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You sound like an intelligent guy - I think somewhere deep inside you know what the right thing to do is. If you were the type that pushes to limits you wouldn't bother posting a question.

I went through this a few months ago and my personal journey is documented a couple of threads below yours. While getting a new vehicle hurt the pocket book and wasn't budgeted for, I have absolutely ZERO regrets. The first time towing was such a difference I regret not doing it sooner.
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Old 09-13-2018, 01:34 PM   #18
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...ummm...I guess I just contradicted myself - there was ONE regret
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Old 09-13-2018, 03:44 PM   #19
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Get all 3 weights: 1. Truck and trailer loaded with WD hitch engaged. 2. Truck and trailer without WD hitch engaged. 3. Truck only
Can anybody tell me what useful information you get from weight number 2?
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Old 09-13-2018, 05:31 PM   #20
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[QUOTE=ScoobyDoo;4399565]Can anybody tell me what useful information you get from weight number 2?[/QUOTE

im guessing so you know how your dispersing your load with the wd hitch. if youve made the front tires lighter or kept them the same. it would help alot with adjusting your setup.
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Old 09-13-2018, 08:36 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
Can anybody tell me what useful information you get from weight number 2?
Here's a run down of what you use the weights for and how to get them

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1073...w?usp=drivesdk
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Old 09-14-2018, 07:02 AM   #22
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I have read repeatedly you need to weigh with the bars loose.

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Originally Posted by Jshopes81 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
Can anybody tell me what useful information you get from weight number 2?
im guessing so you know how your dispersing your load with the wd hitch. if youve made the front tires lighter or kept them the same. it would help alot with adjusting your setup.
If TW is defined as the weight of trailer carried on the TV, then weight transferred to trailer axle by WDH is no longer the TW that must be in the magic 10-15% range.
If you have a scale on a jack under the coupler, as you lower the jack, that scale reading will increase, as long as you are in the travel of trailer suspension. When you unhook the bars, the trailer nose drops, so any calculations based on those numbers will be off.
Changing the tension on bars will change the amount of weight transferred off the rear axle of TV, but the percentage going to steer/trailer is fixed with any combination.
2 passes across the scale, first with the trailer hooked up, highway ready, and the 2nd with the trailer parked out of the way. A little thought, and arithmetic, you can get the actual numbers you need.
How much weight is the trailer removing from steer, and WDH not moving back? Compare steer with and without trailer....
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Old 09-14-2018, 07:11 AM   #23
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Thank you all.

The truck seemed to pull fine, it worked on some not too steep hills and such but it's a strong engine. I live and travel in the east so not much in the way of real mountains. We may make a trip or 2 to the Smokies but even that's nothing like the western mountains.

I was concerned about the numbers but several posts helped to reduce those fears. I've read so many posts, articles, etc. that go on about safety margins, overloading vehicles, etc. My wife actually was very much worried about the weight. We were getting some "porpoising" so she started Googling and found several articles saying that was a symptom of overloading. I was thinking new shocks or air bags.

So, do I want a new truck? Well yeah, who doesn't? But I'm a cheapskate and don't want to pay for a new truck. I did find a nice deal on a new 2500 Laramie, but even at a deal it's $45k.

There's a truck stop real close so I may go play with some loads and see where everything falls. I need to spend some time thinking about anything we may want to add weight wise as well.
I can tell you what helped my 1/2 ton towing a bunch - upgrade to stiffer walled tires. I had a 2014 F-150 EB with the heavy tow package. My TT fully loaded is about 6K. On the stock tires, I would air up to 44lbs but still had the mushy ride. My next set of tires (GY Wranglers were only good for about 28k miles with about 10k of that towing) were Cooper AT3 with a C load rating. That fixed it! I considered LT tires but didn't want to lose all the ride quality. The C load tires were perfect.

On that note, I just upgraded to an F-250 last week. We are looking at small 5th wheels. We are really interested in the Grand Design 150 series, but my 150, even with the heavy tow package, doesn't have enough capacity by the numbers to pull one of the so-called 1/2 ton trailers. Like you, I ran the numbers up and down. I didn't want to trade my truck, but there was no way we could pull any of them except the smallest without the upgrade.

I suggest that if you are not looking to upgrade your TT within the next year, use what you have. It is plenty capable. If you are planning to upgrade in the next year, it might be worth considering a new truck.
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Old 09-15-2018, 09:41 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
I have read repeatedly you need to weigh with the bars loose.



If TW is defined as the weight of trailer carried on the TV, then weight transferred to trailer axle by WDH is no longer the TW that must be in the magic 10-15% range.
If you have a scale on a jack under the coupler, as you lower the jack, that scale reading will increase, as long as you are in the travel of trailer suspension. When you unhook the bars, the trailer nose drops, so any calculations based on those numbers will be off.
Changing the tension on bars will change the amount of weight transferred off the rear axle of TV, but the percentage going to steer/trailer is fixed with any combination.
2 passes across the scale, first with the trailer hooked up, highway ready, and the 2nd with the trailer parked out of the way. A little thought, and arithmetic, you can get the actual numbers you need.
How much weight is the trailer removing from steer, and WDH not moving back? Compare steer with and without trailer....

Without this weigh you will not know the true percentage of tongue weight. And since a re-weigh costs just $2 and takes less than 5 minutes including removing and re-attaching the bars I don't know why you would not want this crucial information. Without it you cannot know how well the hitch is adjusted or whether you have dangerously low tongue weight.

I see lots of people towing with terrible setups. Trailers that are a foot or more un-level, no break-away switch, safety chains throwing sparks as they go down the road. It doesn't take much time to get it right. A couple hours, some big wrenches and less than $20.

The CAT scale app lets you weigh using your smartphone and emails your scale tickets. Free app and super easy to use. Here is my last weigh. The first three are the three weights you need, with bars, without bars and truck only. The fourth ticket shows the weight with bars after adding one washer to the hitch head.

Just one washer made a noticeable improvement to a setup that was already pretty good. Less bounce over bridge approaches and less push from passing semis.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf truckonly.pdf (232.9 KB, 5 views)
File Type: pdf truckandtrailernobars (1).pdf (232.9 KB, 5 views)
File Type: pdf truckandtrailerwbars.pdf (232.9 KB, 5 views)
File Type: pdf truckandtraileradjusted.pdf (232.9 KB, 6 views)
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Old 09-15-2018, 10:43 AM   #25
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Without this weigh you will not know the true percentage of tongue weight. And since a re-weigh costs just $2 and takes less than 5 minutes including removing and re-attaching the bars I don't know why you would not want this crucial information. Without it you cannot know how well the hitch is adjusted or whether you have dangerously low tongue weight.
With the info from 1 and 3, I can see the GW of the trailer is 7240 lbs. So the magic range for a TT TW would be 724,(10%) to 1086(15%) With your first check you where 920.
Sure, that 2nd weigh gives you info, but it is not useful info. Weights 1 and 3 tell you that the steer is 240 lbs lighter with the trailer, than without it. Sure, making it heavier would help.

Quote:
I see lots of people towing with terrible setups. Trailers that are a foot or more un-level, no break-away switch, safety chains throwing sparks as they go down the road. It doesn't take much time to get it right. A couple hours, some big wrenches and less than $20.
No doubt, there are a lot that don't know or care, but that 2nd weight won't help them. Maybe if the state did roadside safety checks, like CMVs and like CMVs if it don't pass it don't move...

Quote:
Just one washer made a noticeable improvement to a setup that was already pretty good. Less bounce over bridge approaches and less push from passing semis.
I would bet on that comparing weight 3 to 4. BTW, what happened to that 40 lbs?
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Old 09-15-2018, 05:44 PM   #26
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I get the impression you really want to use a 1/2 ton truck. I think you can. Maybe not with your current 1/2 ton but maybe a more capable 1/2 ton. I see variances in like trucks of about 400 lbs. If you look for the right 1/2 ton truck you might find more.

I know incrematental improvements have been made every few years with 2019 being big improvements for Ram and Chevy. 2015 was last big improvement for Ford.

Just maybe look for the most capable 2015 F-150 Eco-Boost 3.5 you can find. Then compare it to what you have. If not too much difference then you have a very capable 1/2 ton already. I am thinking they made a bunch of 3.5 Eco-Boost XLT trucks with a 1800 - 1900lb cargo capacity.

Good luck
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Old 09-16-2018, 10:58 AM   #27
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I get the impression you really want to use a 1/2 ton truck. I think you can. Maybe not with your current 1/2 ton but maybe a more capable 1/2 ton. I see variances in like trucks of about 400 lbs. If you look for the right 1/2 ton truck you might find more.
I don't understand this. He is right on the numbers with the truck he has. Maybe some adjustment on the hitch to make it better. Tires when needed. (If you wear out tires in half their life time, maybe put heavier on the back now, and save the rears to use on front later.
If he replaces the truck might as well go with the 3/4 ton. He sounds young enough that his wife will want a bigger trailer soon
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Old 09-16-2018, 11:28 AM   #28
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A 1/2 ton truck drives like a car. He is maxing out the truck he has now. 1/2 ton trucks come with different capcities. My logic is to find a 1/2 ton truck with more capacity.

A 3/4 ton truck, although greatly improved, still does not make a good daily driver mostly now because of the low gas milage.
A 3/4 ton truck will get approx. 5 miles less per gallon of gas.

I agree, that a 3/4 ton truck is a much better towing platform. That normally one moves up from 1/2 ton to 3/4 ton. I currently drive a 3/4 ton truck and really like it. I do not like the miles per gallon though.

Just saying, at least look for a 1/2 truck with more capacity.
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