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Old 12-08-2019, 03:39 AM   #1
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Pro/Con 2018 newer, Ram vs Chev vs Ford diesel engines

Pro/Cons of 2018-newer Ram vs Chev vs Ford diesel pickups?

I will be buying a 2018 or newer 3/4 or 1 ton pickup within 3 months. I have been waiting to see reviews on the 2020 7.3 F250 before making a decision, because it SHOULD do everything I need it to do when pulling my TT, but, if the fuel mileage on the new 7.3 is not to my liking, I will probably choose a diesel truck instead.

I am not a brand loyalist when it comes to Ford, Chevy or Ram and I have no doubt that each has it’s Pros and Cons, only, I have no idea what the pros and cons are for these new diesel trucks.

What can you tell me about reliability, ease of maintenance, repair costs, fuel efficiency, maintenance costs, etc?

Why is one brand better or worse than another brand?

I thank you for your time and consideration.
Ken
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Old 12-08-2019, 05:55 AM   #2
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If specifically looking at a diesel make sure you understand all the complexity in a diesel engine. They are all the same complexity so it does not matter which one you pick. All the trucks have solid frames and will drive a lot better than an older truck.

I had a 2012 super duty diesel dually truck for 6.5 trouble free years towing a 5th wheel. When I sold the 5th wheel I got rid of the diesel truck and went to a simpler 6.2 liter gas engine F-250.

In the last month I test drove a 2019 SRW F-350 diesel, a 2020 Chevy 2500HD 6.6 gas, a 2020 Ram 2500 mega cab 6.4 litre gas truck.

Even though the diesel engine has been greatly refined it is still not as refined as the gas engine. My 2017 F-250 6.2 gas truck is way more refined than my 2012 diesel dullay was. Refined means less NHV. Noise, Harsness and Vibration. My 2017 F-250 is more refined then the 2019 F-350 diesel I test drove.

Of the trucks that I test drove I liked the 2020 Chevy 2500HD the best. The independant front suspension allows the Chevy truck to ride better than my good riding F-250. The Chevy also felt like it had more power too which on paper it does.

Oh, payloads on the trucks. The F-350 diesel was around 3,200lbs. The Chevy 2500HD was 3,290lbs the Ram was 2,800lbs. My 2017 F-250 has 3,497 lbs. of payload. My F-250 is 2WD with a locking rear diff.

Oh, the 2020 Chevy 2500HD has a 2,000lb tongue capacity factory hitch while my 2017 F-250 only has a 1,500lb tougue capacity hitch.

Last Frame improvments:

Ford - 2017
Ram - 2019
GM - 2020

Ford redesigned their super duty trucks in 2017 and Ram and GM have now caught up.

Best feature in newer trucks is the back up camera. Helps a lot when hooking up.

Edit - I just watched a YouTube video on EGR, SCR, DPF, DEF ect.

If you buy a diesel you need to understand how to keep the exhaust system working. Got to drive the truck under load to have enough heat to clean the DPF. Also you need to understand the DEF system and what happens if it gets too old.

My thought is the 7.3 gas engine with the 10 speed will get ok milage.
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Old 12-08-2019, 07:02 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by Zoomschwortz View Post
Why is one brand better or worse than another brand?
Hi, Ken -

I earned my BBA in accounting in 1961, and later my MBA way back in 1968, and spent my career juggling numbers. And I've been a "car nut" since even before 1957 when I had a hot-rod 1951 Flat-head Ford that I won races with at Yellow Belly drag strip in Dallas. So I care about the automotive business as well as the automotive culture.

Back in the bad ole days of 2007-'08, GM and Chrysler went bankrupt. Ford management was a little smarter (along with a little better luck?) and avoided bankruptcy.

Chrysler (manufacturer of Dodge including RAM) ended up owned and controlled by F.I.A.T. (fix it again, Tony). GM sold out their loyal investors by making their GM stock and bonds virtually worthless, ruining the retirement plans of thousands of GM employees and retires and loyalists. Ford management motored on and didn't screw their employees and investors.

So today with roughly equal products from the "Big Three", I'll choose a Ford.

And I've had excellent service from my recent Ford pickups. 1999.5 F-250 diesel I owned for 10 years and 200,000 miles. 2012 F-150 3.5L EcoBoost I owned for 7 years and ~80,000 miles. I liked that pickup so much that I ordered the same drivetrain in the replacement 2019 in my sig. Before the 2008 fiasco, I owned several different Chrysler and GM products and had good service from them too.
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Old 12-08-2019, 07:10 AM   #4
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diesels

The new diesels are very quiet and powerful. Complex yes. I open the hood on my 2017 F350 6.7 Powerstroke and I cant see the engine under all the stuff on top. All big 3 diesels are good. The gas motors have allot less emission controls on them compared to the diesel. Now if you tow the diesel is the way to go. It is not just the power but with exhaust brake really helps on hills and emergency stopping. The fuel mileage on the diesel empty will be 16 to 20 MPG. Depends on gearing and SRW vs DRW. Fords new 10 Speed will help due to the .63 overdrive in 10th gear. Allison 6 speed runs a .614 and Ram has a .63 in the Aisin trans. Towing mileage in all 3 will probably 10MPG or so. The diesel will hold OD without shifting. The gas motors will shift allot out of overdrive pulling and will get 8 MPG to 10 MPG towing. Running empty 14 to 16 MPG. Both will need good maintenance to keep them reliable. Bad fuel and mixing DEF in your fuel on a new diesel is the biggest problem. My 06 Cummins has 123000 worry free miles. My 17 F350 has 13400 worry free miles. I drove all 3 1 ton diesels and bought the ford. All three were great. It is a tough decision and a big investment. I would recommend test driving all three gas and diesels.
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Old 12-08-2019, 08:52 AM   #5
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Here is my opinion after owning a couple Dodge/Ram and A couple of GMC trucks and having towed with my friends Ford. They are all good trucks with some comfort differences and a small amount of drivetrain differences. The Ram has a better exhaust brake and the Ford and GMC are quieter and smoother. Pick the one that feels the best when you sit in it and drive it. I should add that i had a Ram 6.4 gas and drive the same for work and would never buy a gas truck to pull any kind of load for long distances. The constant shifting and rpm level of the gas truck wears on you. Short trips i could deal with gas.
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Old 12-08-2019, 09:13 AM   #6
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People get all wigged out about the gasser revving. I bet if you didn't hear it it would be a non issue. I know that in our Camry that I can barely tell when it down shifts. The noise reduction is greater in the Camry. My ram 6.4 is noisier so it becomes more irritating as the day goes on.
The nice thing about a diesel is they don't down shift nearly as much and get much better mpg's when towing.
As far as the newer ones go, if you're looking at used then the Ram would be my choice. Up util 2019 Ram uses the CP3 HPFP. It' more robust and less susceptible to issues compared to the CP.4 used by Ford and GM. With that being said Ford and GM have had very few HPFP issues of late.
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Old 12-08-2019, 11:00 AM   #7
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People get all wigged out about the gasser revving. I bet if you didn't hear it it would be a non issue. I know that in our Camry that I can barely tell when it down shifts. The noise reduction is greater in the Camry. My ram 6.4 is noisier so it becomes more irritating as the day goes on.
The nice thing about a diesel is they don't down shift nearly as much and get much better mpg's when towing.
As far as the newer ones go, if you're looking at used then the Ram would be my choice. Up util 2019 Ram uses the CP3 HPFP. It' more robust and less susceptible to issues compared to the CP.4 used by Ford and GM. With that being said Ford and GM have had very few HPFP issues of late.
As far as I know GM dropped Bosch somewhere in 2017 and now use Denso for the entire fuel system. No more CP3 nor CP4 issues. I've heard of a few odd issues here and there but my GM dealer tech buddies tell me they're pretty solid.

I agree on gassers. Mine revs like crazy up hills but does the job. If I was constantly in the hills like I was this summer it would be diesel for sure. I'm researching for the retirement truck.
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Old 12-08-2019, 11:10 AM   #8
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Just remember if the engine needs any major maintenance the Cab must be removed on the Ford and Chevy's
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Old 12-08-2019, 11:29 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by Zoomschwortz View Post
Pro/Cons of 2018-newer Ram vs Chev vs Ford diesel pickups?

I will be buying a 2018 or newer 3/4 or 1 ton pickup within 3 months. I have been waiting to see reviews on the 2020 7.3 F250 before making a decision, because it SHOULD do everything I need it to do when pulling my TT, but, if the fuel mileage on the new 7.3 is not to my liking, I will probably choose a diesel truck instead.

I am not a brand loyalist when it comes to Ford, Chevy or Ram and I have no doubt that each has itís Pros and Cons, only, I have no idea what the pros and cons are for these new diesel trucks.

What can you tell me about reliability, ease of maintenance, repair costs, fuel efficiency, maintenance costs, etc?

Why is one brand better or worse than another brand?

I thank you for your time and consideration.
Ken
Ken,

First let me say when we were in Business we were all in on Fords/Macks - and the old 7.3 was a Beast. Fuel pump every now and again but they Never died on us.

Now flip to the Present day - Closed the business 20 years ago and my younger brother went to Dodge - so he has had a number of them for the last 20 years - they all served him well - but rode Hard.

Over the last year he was convinced by one of his RV buddies to buy a new One Ton Chevy DuroMax - OMG what a Truck - they have married the engine and transmission beautifully - and it rides almost as well as My Lexus!

I drove with him to Texas last week in the truck with his 5th wheel to trade on a New to Him class A - pulling at 74 on cruise control we were getting just under 9 mpg's and it pulled and rode great. We got there and I drove it back no load and with speeds from 60 - 80 depending on the locations - following him out of Texas in one 50 mile stretch I got 28.3 mpg's - Really - (in the computer it gives you mileage over the last 50 miles) - truck was amazing - great ride - Power to Spare - Quiet - did I mention the Ride was Great!

Pretty sure even driving off the interstate and through the Smokies I averaged close to 23 going over 75 - so if I were ever to get a new truck it would be the Chevy DuraMax.

Just one man's opinion who has owned and driven them all.

JMHO,
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Old 12-08-2019, 11:30 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Zoomschwortz View Post
I have been waiting to see reviews on the 2020 7.3 F250 before making a decision, because it SHOULD do everything I need it to do when pulling my TT, but, if the fuel mileage on the new 7.3 is not to my liking, I will probably choose a diesel truck instead.
2020 Ford SuerDuty with 7.3L (gas) and 10 speed transmission should be shipping NOW, but they will be in short supply.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoomschwortz View Post
... I have no idea what the pros and cons are for these new diesel trucks.

What can you tell me about reliability, ease of maintenance, repair costs, fuel efficiency, maintenance costs, etc?
Newer diesel pickups are very complex. Maintenance is expensive. Fuel economy is down significant;t from the "old days". DEF is an additional expense In general, the reliability of the engines is good, but because of the complexity, repairs can be very expensive !

IMHO, a diesel engine should only be considered if you drive a large number of miles per year (50,000 or more) or you have a payload that exceed the capacity of the gasoline engine.

For brand, there is a reason that Ford is #1 in truck sales ! The Cummins engine in the Ram is very good, but it does NOT make up for a lot of short falls in the rest of the truck.
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Old 12-08-2019, 12:09 PM   #11
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My 97 Ford dsl got at best 15 mpg. My 2018 Gmc dsl get 20+ all day long.
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Old 12-08-2019, 11:51 PM   #12
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Motor Trend Magazine just selected the Ram HD as their Truck of the Year. The Duramax/10 speed Allison beat the Ram in most performance and towing testing. However, The Ram's up-to-date interiors and exterior styling swung it for them. It was also mentioned that the price/value relationship for new Rams was the best of the big three. The only Ford they tested was the Ranger. Cummins made many major improvements to the Ram's diesel, but you are going to need to buy new to get them.
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Old 12-09-2019, 12:38 PM   #13
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As far as I know GM dropped Bosch somewhere in 2017 and now use Denso for the entire fuel system. No more CP3 nor CP4 issues. I've heard of a few odd issues here and there but my GM dealer tech buddies tell me they're pretty solid.

I agree on gassers. Mine revs like crazy up hills but does the job. If I was constantly in the hills like I was this summer it would be diesel for sure. I'm researching for the retirement truck.
2017 was the first year of the new engine (L5P) and also the first year with the new Denso fuel pump.

As far a complexity, we own two gas burners and one diesel and they are all complex anymore. I consider myself a pretty mechanic and all the newer vehicles are very complex, there's not a lot you can fix yourself anymore.
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Old 12-09-2019, 12:44 PM   #14
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2017 was the first year of the new engine (L5P) and also the first year with the new Denso fuel pump.

As far a complexity, we own two gas burners and one diesel and they are all complex anymore. I consider myself a pretty mechanic and all the newer vehicles are very complex, there's not a lot you can fix yourself anymore.
I'm a professional mechanic but I won't call myself pretty.

The newer diesels are awesome right up until they need work done or get in regen mode, then they kinda suck. It is what it is, if you need a diesel, you have no choice unless you like older, ratty,worn and noisy diesels.

The newer gassers are complex but nowhere near as difficult to work on as any modern diesel. At least almost any decent garage can bring the in for most work required.
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