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Old 08-30-2012, 10:33 AM   #15
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Those are the working numbers that Ken could use if he were out shopping for a new 5th wheel. To stay within the truck manufacturer's ratings, he would look for a 5th wheel with a ... LOADED (not brochure, shipping or dry) pin weight of no more than 4,490 lbs.
Good job, Rusty. But there's a fly in the ointment. No where will you find a spec for loaded pin weight. So you must estimate based on percentage of the trailer's GVWR.

One reasonable estimate of the percentage of pin weight is to divide the dry pin weight by the dry weight of the trailer. That can get you in the ballpark on most trailers. But if the answer is much less than 0.20 (20%) for a 5er, then you could be in for a big unpleasant surprise by being overloaded when you cross the scale the first time with a wet and loaded rig.

"One-ton" duallys don't usually have a problem with not enough GVWR to tow the trailer you want to tow that's within the GCWR capability of the truck. But SRW pickups, and especially three-quarter-ton SRW pickups such 250s and 2500s towing a 5er or goose often can't get even close to the GCWR of the pickup without exceeding the GVWR of the pickup. And the so-called one-ton SRW pickups towing a 5er or goose often will exceed the GVWR of the pickup before reaching the GCWR of the pickup.
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Old 08-30-2012, 10:59 AM   #16
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Smokey,

You had mentioned that in post #7, so I didn't think it necessary to go through the pin weight estimation calculation process once again.

Rusty
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Old 08-30-2012, 02:06 PM   #17
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I just wanted to jump in there on Hooverbills "Cargo" calculation.... The C in GCWR is not cargo....but combined.

Ken
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Old 08-30-2012, 02:20 PM   #18
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I just wanted to jump in there on Hooverbills "Cargo" calculation.... The C in GCWR is not cargo....but combined.

Ken
Sorry guys, I added to the confusion with that typo.

Of course it's Combined since it refers to the combined weights of the TV and the RV. The way the forum is set up, I can't go back in and change it now.
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Old 08-30-2012, 06:30 PM   #19
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Hooverbill, the forum is set fro you to have edit right son your post for either 30 or 60 minutes...I forgot which one.

Ken
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Old 08-31-2012, 10:06 PM   #20
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I have another question. I'm trying to understand why the Laramie Mega Cab SB DRW has a meager payload of just over 2500# yet a rear GAWR of over 9000#.

Are these two different considerations or is there a correlation concerning the hitch weight of a 5ver?

"grasshopper."
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Old 09-01-2012, 07:53 PM   #21
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Dodge, as all LDT makers, figures their payloads by using the trucks GVWR which ranges from 10500 GVWR on some 3500 DRW models.
LDT Truck makers like Dodge set GVWR conservativly low hense a low payload.

Many folks (private and commercial) simply use the DRWs 9350 RAWR/tire capacities for figuring payloads on the rear suspension.
Other folks have their opinions.
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Old 09-01-2012, 09:25 PM   #22
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3000lb pin weight on my 2012 DRW 3500 truck just drops about 1 inch when I hook up my Alpine 3600RS 5th wheel. I agree with the axle weight of 9350 lbs that is posted on my door post
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Old 09-01-2012, 10:16 PM   #23
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So then I am hearing that there is no correlation between the two and that axle weight is the factor when looking at how much capacity is placed on the bed of the truck.
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Old 09-01-2012, 11:00 PM   #24
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datedd, if you read the small print and notes in the manufacturers tow ratings, it will note that you are not to exceed any of the three ratings...not under on one or tow and over on the one of you choice.

Ken
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Old 09-02-2012, 02:20 AM   #25
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The ratings don't make sense if a 3500# pin weight is OK for a 9560# RGAWR but not for a payload of 2500#

It does make sense if loading is transferred from pin to the axle and to the ground, the dual tires and their weight ratings being considered as well.
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Old 09-02-2012, 02:08 PM   #26
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It may not make sense, but that is the way the manufacturers rate the trucks. a lot of SRW drivers and 3/4 ton drivers like to take that approach to getting by with a SRW truck in their mind....BUT they are exceeding the manufacturers ratings none-the-less. The axle only approach does not consider the limits that the truck manufacturer places on the chassis frame or suspension.

What makes even less sense is the way the Texas DPS determines a total combined GCWR for a vehicle and trailer. They add the GVWR of the truck to the GVWR of the trailer.

Ken
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Old 09-02-2012, 09:47 PM   #27
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I can see how 3/4 ton folks may want to squeeze every ounce out of their truck to tow that 15k 5ver and the payload in my previous message mentioned a payload for a SB dually more commonly seen in 3/4 trucks. That's why I was astonished.

The numbers for the LB crew cab Dodge 3500 duallys made more sense. I would think a SB dually weighing less than a LB dually would have more capacity. I guess you can't judge a book by its cover.
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Old 09-03-2012, 09:34 AM   #28
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All the info you want is available HERE.

Rusty
As I look at the specs sheet for the Ram 3500 Trucks, some of the numbers are in red, with yellow highlighting. So let's say on page 21, a LB Crew Cab Laramie DRW. There are two lines for the 3.73 Axle ratio. Everything on that line is the same EXCEPT for the GCWR and Max Trail which are 21000# and 13000# respectively, OR the line below it which is highlighted and reads: 25000# and 16600#

What makes these two different if everything else on the two lines are the same? What's with the highlighting? How is a person when buying the truck know which one of these they are getting? This formatting is throughout all of the pages of this spec sheet.
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