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Old 10-03-2015, 06:04 PM   #29
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Be realistic. You know your budget, how far you intend to tow, and your comfort level.

Make yourself comfortable and don't over worry it.

One short tow, and you will know if you need a bigger truck. Have fun.
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Old 10-03-2015, 08:04 PM   #30
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Personally, I think one of the reasons why most folks say that "my egregiously large trailer tows just fine with my half ton truck" is either pride, ignorance, ego, or some combination thereof. How many of them that report not having any trouble are being completely honest, or at least completely informed? We'll likely never know, will we?

I do know this much. Very few people seem to express any regret for having Too Much Truck.
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Old 10-03-2015, 08:28 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by daveRG View Post
So the question I'm hoping someone will jump on is whether I can do anything about it, or is the only hope a) to get a truck with higher GVRW (or better payload numbers), or b) search for a trailer with much lower hitch weight?
GVWR of the truck is set in stone and cannot be changed by mere mortals. So either more truck or less trailer.

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Or there add-ons or modifications?
You cannot do anything (within reason) to change the GVWR. You can add airbags to mask the symptoms of being overloaded. And you can hot-rod the engine to get more power/torque so you won't be the slowpoke holding up traffic when you are so overloaded that you exceed the GCWR of your tow vehicle.

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Its just that I've read so many posts from Tundra 5.7 owners, who are towing trailers much heavier and sometimes longer than what I'm looking at and say their just fine.
They're probably just fine as far as power and torque are concerned to pull the load over the hills - because they don't exceed the GCWR. They don't know they're overloaded because they haven't bothered to weigh the wet and loaded rig. But the CAT scale will prove that their suspension is overloaded over the GVWR of their truck.

My truck has a tow rating of 8,400 pounds, and I've towed a gooseneck trailer that grossed over 20,000 pounds with no problems. But I was severely overloaded over the GVWR and rear GAWR of my poor little half-ton pickup. So I hope I never have conditions that force me to do that again.

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I'm not asking b/c of the particular TT I'm looking at, I'm trying to see if I need to be searching for a whole different type of TT.
Probably. You might be able to find a hybred TT with all the normal amenities and keep the GVWR of the trailer down to less than 5,000 pounds. But those are rare too.

So your best bet is probably a pop-up camper trailer. Some are available with GVWR less than 4,000 pounds but that have all the normal TT amenities such as hot water shower, range, furnace, AC and reefer. Here's one example:
Rockwood Tent Folding Camping Trailers by Forest River RV
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Old 10-03-2015, 08:42 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by 1bigmess View Post
Personally, I think one of the reasons why most folks say that "my egregiously large trailer tows just fine with my half ton truck" is either pride, ignorance, ego, or some combination thereof. How many of them that report not having any trouble are being completely honest, or at least completely informed? We'll likely never know, will we?

I do know this much. Very few people seem to express any regret for having Too Much Truck.
Agree.......there is no reason to live so close to the edge. You will be safer and more relaxed with a 3/4 or even a 1 ton truck.
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Old 10-04-2015, 01:20 AM   #33
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I also agree. Went through this when we were purchasing our truck and trailer 4 years ago, except in our case I was deciding whether to order the 4.10 axle ratio on the Silverado 2500. Glad we did, although it takes a toll on mileage. Knowing your rig can handle the weight is priceless. It was an inexpensive option that gave us peace of mind when climbing hills. Safety is everything. I see overloaded rigs on the road all the time. OK until something happens.
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Old 10-11-2015, 09:18 PM   #34
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Thanks for everybodys help and replies. After hours and hours on the phone with Toyota NA, Toyota SE, several dealers, and NHTSA, I finally was informed the yellow sticker increasing my weight was sent in error. So no need to add 380lbs to my trucks weight. And I did get it in writing.

So my new TT is a 2014 Jayco Jayflight Swift 264BH. GVWR 6500, UVW 4355, Hitch weight (supposedly) 415...so I should be well under my limits.

Thanks again!
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Old 10-11-2015, 09:33 PM   #35
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According to 2014 Jay Flight Swift 264BH | Jayco, Inc.
485# is the dry hitch weight of that trailer. That works out to only 11%. Plan on your hitch weight being more than that, after you start loading (if not before).
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Old 10-12-2015, 06:21 AM   #36
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Yeah I meant to write 485, that was a typo. Thanks. I knew it would be heavier than than advertised.
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Old 10-12-2015, 01:49 PM   #37
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Well, I may have a bigger problem that I just realized. Toyota sent me a notice that modifications made to my truck reduced the "cargo capacity" of my truck by 395 pounds. I am waiting to hear from Toyota what this means, b/c I never changed anything after I bought it. But if it involves the GVWR, my 7200 just went down to 6805. Minus what I've been told is a 5395 curb weight, I'm down to 1410. Minus the 615lbs tongue weight, I'm down to 795. Take away 75 pounds (guessing) for the WDH and receiver, I'm at 720. Minus me, the wife, and kids (510 for all of us), and I'm at 210. And that's without anything else in it. Is this cutting it too close?

Am I missing something here? It doesn't make sense that a 1/2 ton truck with a relatively stout towing package would basically hold just 2 adults, two kids, and 615 lbs at the rear with only a couple hundred pounds to spare.
These numbers sound closer to expected payload. The 2000 payload was probably on the base model trim. I haven't seen any 1/2 tons with 2000 payload. Maybe 1600 or 1800 with max tow. Usually around 1500, depending on model and trim level. Everything that was an option that was added to your truck before you bought it (heated seats, navigation, stereo, steps, bedliner, hitch etc) would have to come out of the payload. 1410 is within the normal average payload for a 1/2 ton truck.

Have you checked for a sticker on your driver's side door? That should list the payload (cargo capacity) after Toyota added any options to the base model.

If you loaded the 264BH TT to max 6500, you'd need 780 lbs on the tongue available in your payload.

Your current calc of 615 tongue weight works if the trailer loaded to 5125 lbs. The dry trailer weighed 4355, so that would give you 770 lbs for battery, propane,cookware,grill, bedding, clothing, groceries, camp chairs, awning rugs, kids stuff, and options not included in the advertised dry weight (like awnings, AC, microwave, outdoor kitchen). With a family and all the stuff they want to bring, you could be over the 770.

If battery, propane, AC and Awning aren't included, you could eat up half that CC in things you might not realize are using CC.

With a trailer that heavy and a family to put in the truck you are going to be VERY close, if not overweight on cargo capacity.

Check the yellow sticker on the door of the TT and see what it weighed leaving the factory. Then ask what the dealership adds (usually battery and propane, possible other options like AC). Then you'll know what it weighs before you load it up for camping. It is often quite a bit more than the advertised dry weight.
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Old 10-12-2015, 07:10 PM   #38
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Thanks,

My hitch weight is actually an advertised 485. I haven't picked it up from the dealer yet, so I have no way of weighing it to verify. And, the dealer doesn't sell the hitch I want (Equalizer E4), so I'm kind of in a catch 22. I want to buy the right weight rating E4 (10000, 12000) before I go pick up the TT, but don't know the actual hitch/tongue weight to buy without weighing the trailer...which I can't do without the hitch...
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Old 10-12-2015, 07:38 PM   #39
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The calculated hitch weight based on GVWR of camper is 780lbs, this is the max weight of the camper times 12% which is the ideal hitch weight. Take the below numbers to your hitch dealer or online and you can make your purchase before the TT arrives.
MAX TT WEIGHT...6500lbs
MAX HITCH...780lbs
Btw Congrats on the TT the Tundra will pull (and stop) it just fine.
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Old 10-13-2015, 08:44 AM   #40
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These numbers sound closer to expected payload. The 2000 payload was probably on the base model trim. I haven't seen any 1/2 tons with 2000 payload. Maybe 1600 or 1800 with max tow. Usually around 1500, depending on model and trim level. Everything that was an option that was added to your truck before you bought it (heated seats, navigation, stereo, steps, bedliner, hitch etc) would have to come out of the payload. 1410 is within the normal average payload for a 1/2 ton truck.
....
Just as an FYI, GM's max tow vehicles are near 2,000 or more for payload. My GMC Max Tow has payload at 2,050. I believe Ford with it's max payload feature are similar.
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Old 10-13-2015, 11:19 AM   #41
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True. I knew one had more payload than most but couldn't remember which. I just knew it wasn't RAM (because that's what we have). By the time most people get the trims they want, most 1/2 tons are under 2000, some significantly.

If I were shopping for a 1/2 ton, I'd definitely look for max payload! Although my friend reports his new lighter F150 with the turbo does not control his TT as well as his previous F150, so there are always trade offs.
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Old 10-13-2015, 11:36 AM   #42
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Half ton trucks have come a long way in the past few years for payload. The payload in my crew cab, well-equipped, GMC is above many 3/4 ton trucks from just a few years ago.

However the payloads are all over the place, some around 1,000 pounds, and some nearing 3,000 pounds (Ford is reported to have some base models in this range with it's reg cab version).

But these newer max tow, max payload, or heavy duty models are impressive and I believe that the big 3 will likely keep making more of those types as there seems to be a market for them.
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