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Old 04-10-2017, 12:53 PM   #15
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Upgrading trailer wheels is a tough find. The strongest 16" I could find with a quick search is 3,750 max weight capacity. That's about perfect for the wheels you are looking for.
https://www.southwestwheel.com/p-394-128701.aspx

There are several brands of trailer tires in size 235/85R16 with load range F or G, but most of them you probably never heard of.
This brand has been around for a long time. The reference provides info on the tire sizes I mentioned in post #10.

Carlisle Brand | Radial Trail HD Tire Information
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Old 04-12-2017, 05:24 PM   #16
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You have plenty of trailer tire. Speed rating of "L" means max sustained speed of 75 MPH. So it's okay to exceed 65 MPH if you can stand the lower MPG.

I would air up the tires to 80 PSI cold. When you weigh the wet and loaded rig on a CAT scale be sure the combined weight on the trailer tires does not exceed the combined GAWR of the trailer axles. That should be no problem because your tires have weight capacity of 3420 pounds per tire, or 13,680 pounds for all 4 tires.

With the normal 20% pin weight for that trailer when loaded to 16,000 pounds, you'd have 3,200 pounds on the tongue and 12,800 pounds on the trailer tires, or 3,200 pounds on each trailer tire. 3,200 pounds actual load per tire compared to 3,420 pounds load rating means you have plenty of trailer tire if you keep them pumped up to 80 PSI.

Here is the TRA load/inflation table for your trailer tires. Ignore the Maxxis name on that chart as it is a TRA chart that applies to all brands of ST tires.
Trailer Tire Load/Inflation Chart | Tire and Rim Assn.
RE speed. It's important to remember that the load formula for ST tires was/is based on a couple assumptions and a fact or two.
The formula was developed when the National Speed limit was 55. ST tires have a max speed rating of 65 according to US Tire & Rim Association. The recent addition of a Service Description that includes a speed symbol was instituted to avoid import duties that were imposed by FTC not the tire safety agency NHTSA.
In 2000 radial passenger and LT tires had the regulations for minimum safety by DOT were significantly improved so the technology now in those tires is much better than in many tires made before 2000. BUT ST tires did not get the improvement. It has been suggested that RV industry association lobbied against the improvement as it would have increased the cost of tires.

Also due to Interply Shear forces that trailers experience IMO I se no technical reason for tires on a trailer (ST) to be rated to carry 13% more load than LT are rated for, but that may be too technical for some.
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Old 04-13-2017, 10:33 AM   #17
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RE speed. It's important to remember that the load formula for ST tires was/is based on a couple assumptions and a fact or two.
The formula was developed when the National Speed limit was 55. ST tires have a max speed rating of 65 according to US Tire & Rim Association. The recent addition of a Service Description that includes a speed symbol was instituted to avoid import duties that were imposed by FTC not the tire safety agency NHTSA.
In 2000 radial passenger and LT tires had the regulations for minimum safety by DOT were significantly improved so the technology now in those tires is much better than in many tires made before 2000. BUT ST tires did not get the improvement. It has been suggested that RV industry association lobbied against the improvement as it would have increased the cost of tires.

Also due to Interply Shear forces that trailers experience IMO I se no technical reason for tires on a trailer (ST) to be rated to carry 13% more load than LT are rated for, but that may be too technical for some.
I’m pretty sure you don’t have a firm answer for the loads and speed letters on the ST tire sidewalls. I’ve asked you in a number of other forums for a factual answer with supporting documentation.

The information on a tire’s sidewall is certified by DOT. And, yes I know the procedure for that certification. For you to dispute that information is all well and good. But, you should say it’s in your professional opinion and not industry supported standards/facts.

If there is a double standard it needs to be validated by the DOT. We as owners and users of any type of highway tire must rely upon the statistical information provided on the tires sidewalls and in the warranty/maintenance manuals.

The DOT and tire manufacturers periodically conduct meetings to discus rules. Other representatives from organizations such as the TRA and RMA are also included in those meetings. Subjects you have presented here should maybe be presented to the TRA or RMA in the form of point papers for committee discussions. Actually, a strong argument can always be documented and sent to NHTSA for review anytime.

A feather in your cap if you can get a resolution.
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Old 04-13-2017, 09:23 PM   #18
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Tires on 5th wheel

If it were my new rig I would do the following:

1-get the wheels balanced immediately. My experience has been wheels are not balanced by the trailer mfgr.

2-as Smokey noted ensure trailer is level when hitched and not overloaded.

3-expect to replace within 2 yrs

4-when you start seeing squirrelly wear patterns replace the tires and plan to bump a weight rating if your rims can handle it. If not buy the best tires you can.

I am on TT #4 and have seen the same issues over and over.
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Old 04-13-2017, 11:16 PM   #19
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If your looking at a beefier tire that fits your size, be careful that the specs your looking at don't require 110psi unless you know that you have 8 lug wheels and axle hubs. 6 lug and you are limited to 80psi. For tires like the Sailun 235/80/R16 you can mount then on either an 8 lug or 6 lug wheel but their max psi is 80psi on the 6 lug wheel and 110 on the 8 lug wheel. The carry/load capacity is different at each load pressure..
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Old 04-14-2017, 10:35 AM   #20
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I just purchased a 2009 Cardinal. Had dealer replace tires they put on 235-85-16 14 ply tires max psi of 95. It has 6 lug hubs are you saying I can only put 80 psi on 6 lug wheel. They put on rubber valve stems I am changing them out to steal so I can put on my TPMS.
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Old 04-14-2017, 11:03 PM   #21
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I just purchased a 2009 Cardinal. Had dealer replace tires they put on 235-85-16 14 ply tires max psi of 95. It has 6 lug hubs are you saying I can only put 80 psi on 6 lug wheel. They put on rubber valve stems I am changing them out to steal so I can put on my TPMS.
Check with the wheel manufacturer. I could not find a 6 lug wheel that supported 110psi. Don't know about 95 only saw 110 and 80. I checked HiSpec wheels and a couple of trailer tire and wheel specialty shops. Its entirely possible your wheels are custom for Cardinal. Must say I am surprised they didn't at least have metal valve stems. Sometimes max psi is stamped on the inner side of the wheel.
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Old 04-14-2017, 11:13 PM   #22
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I just purchased a 2009 Cardinal. Had dealer replace tires they put on 235-85-16 14 ply tires max psi of 95. It has 6 lug hubs are you saying I can only put 80 psi on 6 lug wheel. They put on rubber valve stems I am changing them out to steal so I can put on my TPMS.
110 PSI rated rims for trailer - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com

Check out this old but relevant thread.
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Old 04-15-2017, 12:29 PM   #23
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snip

The information on a tire’s sidewall is certified by DOT. And, yes I know the procedure for that certification. For you to dispute that information is all well and good. But, you should say it’s in your professional opinion and not industry supported standards/facts.

snip
Sorry buy DOT does not "certify" tires. The "DOT" symbol is used to demonstrate the tire mfg certifies the tire will meet the current FMVSS test requirements. This is a "self certification" system. This is not my opinion but is just the facts on certification.

Tire companies run a small sample of tires on some of the regulatory tests. Which tests and how many tires are usually based on statistical sampling and historical results of a specific test, so all tests are not run on every batch of tires made every day or even every week or month.

DOT (NHTSA) only runs an even smaller sample of tires on a few regulatory tests. They do not have the budget to even test every type/ size tire even once every few years. Many tires are never tested by NHTSA.

Now if there are a number of complaints filed by owners that might meet some selection criteria established by NHTSA but it usually requires there to be fatality(s) or high probability of injury involved before a tire rises to the top of the list of items to be tested.

I am not disputing what the regulations say or what TRA publishes. I am just point out that there are IMO, reasons for ST type tires to not deliver tire life seen in P or LT type tires even when driven at the same time or speed as the ST tires that fail. It is my intent to offer my professional opinion on what people can do to hopefully realize longer tire life in RV trailer application.

Simple adherence to the regulations is no guarantee of satisfactory performance. There are just too many examples of items that pass various requirements that in fact do not deliver the suggested results.

I have identified two people here in Akron that I can talk to about ST situation. I don't yet know if they are even willing to meet with me. If they do I will see what interest, if any they have in improving the performance of tires applied in trailer service but I am not holding my breath. There are too many who are opposed to the idea of regulations at all, never mind making it tougher to pass any current regulations. Does the situation in Flint MI bring anything to mind? This at a time when regulatory limits on Lead and Mercury in water sources are being repealed or loosened.
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Old 04-15-2017, 10:12 PM   #24
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For the can of worms opened.

The DOT symbol constitutes a certification that the marked tire conforms to an applicable Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard.

Another can of worms to ponder.

When a RV trailer leaving the factory it is given a GVW or dry weight or shipping weight\, the manufacturer is allowed to use computer models to determine those weights. So when they say they weighed it, do the mean on a computer or scales?

As tire users we cannot be given a standard to go by and then have all sorts of excuses as to its validity. If the tire sidewall says a tire can provide 3042# of load capacity with a cold inflation pressure of 80 PSI there should never be any ifs, ands or buts about it. Yet, there is a service description on that same sidewall with a load index of 120. That relates to 3086# of load capacity @ the same 80 PSI . Even though the load index is not the official load capacity indicator for that tire design its still on the sidewall without an explanation. Another worm in the bait bucket.
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Old 04-16-2017, 09:05 AM   #25
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For the can of worms opened.

The DOT symbol constitutes a certification that the marked tire conforms to an applicable Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard.

Yup. That's what I said. DOT does not do the certification as many people think it is the itre MFG. I have been fighting this misconception since late '94.

Another can of worms to ponder.

When a RV trailer leaving the factory it is given a GVW or dry weight or shipping weight\, the manufacturer is allowed to use computer models to determine those weights. So when they say they weighed it, do the mean on a computer or scales? I suppose it depends who is claiming the RV is weighed when new. Guess you would need to ask the RV Co.

As tire users we cannot be given a standard to go by and then have all sorts of excuses as to its validity. If the tire sidewall says a tire can provide 3042# of load capacity with a cold inflation pressure of 80 PSI there should never be any ifs, ands or buts about it. Yet, there is a service description on that same sidewall with a load index of 120. That relates to 3086# of load capacity @ the same 80 PSI . Even though the load index is not the official load capacity indicator for that tire design its still on the sidewall without an explanation. Another worm in the bait bucket.
My comments above in RED

Yes the Service Description can be confusing if you dig too deep. I think your question of 3042# vs 3086# would best be directed at TRA as I had nothing to do with it and no one asked my opinion when they wrote the spec.

Lets go camping.
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Old 04-16-2017, 12:31 PM   #26
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My comments above in RED

Yes the Service Description can be confusing if you dig too deep. I think your question of 3042# vs 3086# would best be directed at TRA as I had nothing to do with it and no one asked my opinion when they wrote the spec.

Lets go camping.
It wasn't a question Tireman9, just information.

Sometimes in this two dimensional form of communication things may look personal. It's not good to get personal in these forums. The Mods will jump on you with all four. I was an active duty sailor for more than 31 years. If I get personal most will know it right away.
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Old 04-16-2017, 03:00 PM   #27
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Fast E

I'm good

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Old 04-16-2017, 05:55 PM   #28
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Great discussion on tires!

Thanks guys for all the input, very helpful! I am much more knowledgeable now. With a 42' Grand Design Solitude, not a toy hauler, 16,000 lbs, dual axle 7,000, 8 lug aluminum rims, I would like to buy new tires for safety, probably 235/85 R16, ST radial, speed rating L 75mph, load G 14 ply, and balanced when installing. Any suggestion on best brand and inflation, 95psi to 110 psi? Thanks!

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