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Old 04-23-2014, 06:53 AM   #15
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Taken is correct. Don't waste your time money and stress level trying to combine those two pieces of equipment. And it sounds like even if you did, the vehicle would be at its match towing that heavier trailer. F250 or any other brand truck in the 2500 category. Those trucks are just as nice, if not nicer than the one you mentioned. I looked at and pretended I could purchase a 2015 f250. That is the most luxurious vehicle I have ever seen.


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Old 04-23-2014, 06:54 AM   #16
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Also look at what most people are towing with, also a good indicator on a half decent tow vehicle...


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Old 04-25-2014, 10:38 AM   #17
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Thank you everyone. You help is greatly appreciated.

It looks like right now we are going to go with another trailer (don't know what, yet). We like the Minnies a lot, and hope to get something like the 2201DS in future, but the 2 2101s the local dealer has are enough heavier than the online specs that we aren't comfortable towing them with our car.

Again, thanks.
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Old 04-25-2014, 05:59 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RGene7001 View Post
For me Traverse is quite capable for the job. CANAM matched enclave/traverse with much heavier trailers. Their design is similar to German crossovers, and any of them will outtow most half ton pickups. I would give it a try. Problems may be expected even with bigger TV.
Usually they stem from soft high-sidewall tires(bigger wheels are better), long rear overhangs, which can be negated by Hensley or other sway free hitch. Suspensions are much more firm and composed nowadays as well
Good luck
I would not use CanAM RV as a reference or resourses. They are the Kings of overselling what you can tow. Oh man listen to me. Now I sound like the Weight P{olice too. Anyway case in point are these videos. See for yourself. I like the VW Jette one myself.

Can-Am RV :: Jetta towing Visa

Can-Am RV :: T&C Van towing 34 Airstream

Can-Am RV :: Ford Freestar towing A/S & Surveyor
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Old 04-25-2014, 08:22 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by CanadianCrew View Post
I would not use CanAM RV as a reference or resourses. They are the Kings of overselling what you can tow. Oh man listen to me. Now I sound like the Weight P{olice too. Anyway case in point are these videos. See for yourself. I like the VW Jette one myself.

Can-Am RV :: Jetta towing Visa

Can-Am RV :: T&C Van towing 34 Airstream

Can-Am RV :: Ford Freestar towing A/S & Surveyor
Well, some of their combinations are showcases and not very practical. Airstream is definitely their cash cow but for me this trailer is not practical as well, in addition to being superexpensive and having enormous total and hitch weights. However, as their client, I have to state that they deliver what was promised, they know physics of towing, can analyze vehicle specifications and predict its towing performance, while being able to mitigate weak TV points. Canam charges quite reasonable amount of $$, but in the end you can use your existing TV and save tens of thousands, in addition to having better and safer combo
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Old 04-27-2014, 04:45 PM   #20
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Two more questions, please.

Lets say the tongue weight is 600lbs. I need to subtract that from the tow rating, correct? So, 5200lb rating - 300 for cargo and occupants - 600 for tongue weight = 4200lbs. So the trailer and it's cargo and hitch cannot be more than that. Does this sound right?

How does all this relate to using GCWR instead? I mean, if I use the above calculation, and say I have a trailer whose loaded weight (including hitch) is 4400lbs, then that total is greater than the above adjusted tow capacity. But, the same trailer and vehicle weights don't exceed the vehicle's GCWR (10250). Is it unsafe to tow, even though I am still within the vehicles GCWR and max tire load?

Thanks again.
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Old 04-27-2014, 05:13 PM   #21
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I was just over on another thread (scfella, about tongue weight).

TXiceman said:

GCWR - loaded vehicle = max loaded trailer weight (note: not dry weight).

GVWR - loaded vehicle = max loaded trailer hitch or tongue weight. (Note: not dry weight.

Okay, then... does the "loaded vehicle" above include the tongue weight in the first formula?

So, let's say:

Loaded trailer weight: 4500 lbs
Tongue weight, @ 15%: 675 lbs
Loaded vehicle weight: 5100 lbs (not including tongue weight)
Vehicle GCWR; 10250
Vehicle GVWR: 6411

10250 - 5100 = 5150 max trailer weight, so I'm okay there.
10250 - 5775 = 4475 max trailer weight if TV weight needs to include
tongue weight, so I would need to lose 25 lbs of
trailer cargo.
6411 - 5100 = 1311 max tongue weight, so I'm okay there.

If tongue weight is more like 12.5% (560 lbs), I think I'm okay across the board, but am I missing something?

Also, while the above looks okay to me (unless I'm misunderstanding), do I still have a problem with the stated tow rating of 5200 lbs:
5200 lbs - 300 lbs cargo - 560 lbs (tongue weight at 12.5%) = 4340,
which is less than the 4500 lb trailer weight.

So which is correct? (Still trying to learn)
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Old 04-27-2014, 09:04 PM   #22
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Let me put it this way... I used to pull a 3500lbs trailer with a wdh on a vehicle rated to tow 5000lbs. I quickly sold that suv and bought a truck.

If you're calculating down to the last 25lbs...you are not going to have a pleasant driving experience.

You're on the right path with the numbers. You can't exceed any vehicle limitation (gvwr gvwr gawr). Does your vehicle have gawr limits? Most do... (you're likely to exceed the max weight on the rear axle).


Don't remove the tongue weight from the trailer when calculating gcwr.
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Old 04-27-2014, 10:26 PM   #23
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If you are towing through hills and mountains, in summer, you'll want to have tranny/oil coolers. The last thing you need is to blow that on the highway. Frontal area can also affect your vehicle's towing ability. We went to see CanAm. Awful overselling the towing ability. They wanted to weld some supports to our Venza's hitch so we could pull a 3000lb trailer. The trailer's weight was actually too low in the brochure...now corrected by the manufacturer they have upped the weight 350lbs...a big diff if you are on the edge. We did not buy from CanAm and we did buy a truck to tow our new trailer. The truck has a tow pkg.
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Old 04-28-2014, 01:58 PM   #24
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Hello Marcham, thanks for the reply. Let me see if I can say this clearly (not always easy for me)...

I was uncertain if the tongue weight, which I believe is the weight of the trailer that comes down on the hitch, has to be added to the car's overall weight to come up with the loaded vehicle weight (not the trailer's weight) in the formula, "GCWR - loaded vehicle = max loaded trailer weight." I've since looked at http://changingears.com/rv-sec-tow-vehicle-sizing.shtml, which gives the same formula towards the bottom, and it doesn't appear that I should add in the tongue weight (their definition of GVW pretty clearly, I think, doesn't add in tongue weight). If that's correct, then it is the first line above (with actual numbers) I should use ("10250 - 5100 = 5150 max trailer weight, so I'm okay there"). The second line was using a GVW that included the tongue weight, and the 25 lbs remark relates to that.

Btw, the GAWRs are 3196 front and 3527 rear, but I don't know how to figure out what the real weight will be. If the GVW is 5100, is that evenly distributed? So the weight on the rear axle would be 2550. If the tongue weight is also evenly distributed by a wdh, the the total would be 2550 + 338, which is 2888. That's under the 3257 limit. If the wdh puts more of the weight on the rear, which seems likely, I don't know what the numbers would be, or even if I am coming at the calculation correctly.


Hello LightHouse, it's my understanding that the factory tow package includes extra coolers.
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Old 04-30-2014, 07:45 AM   #25
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@MBS. The Venza (Cdnedition) came with tranny cooler. But since it's unibody and has a softer suspension I didn't want it towing anything over 3000lbs
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