Towing info?

[SmokeyWren]

Originally Posted by Route 66

The Ford Towing Guide should answer your questions.

No. the Ford towing guide is misleading. It tells you only the weight you can PULL without overheating something in the drivetrain, but ignores the hitch weight you can HAUL without being overloaded.

Example 1: My '99.5 F-250 diesel had a fifth-wheel tow rating over 13,000 pounds per the Ford RV and Trailer Towing Guide, but I was overloaded over the GVWR of the F-250 with my 25' 5er that weighed only 8,000 pounds.

Example 2: My current 2012 F-150 has a tow rating of 8,000 pounds per the towing guide, but I'm overloaded over the GVWR of the F-150 with my small 20' TT that weighs less than 5,000 pounds when wet and loaded on an RV trip.

[Jpdkmd]

Took the F350 to the Cat scale today,filled up with fuel,DW and myself along wit some tools weight came in at 8220. Dont have the hitch installed yet.So adding the weight suggested by previous respondent of 150 lbs the weight would be approximately 8370#. The F350 has a towing capacity of 23,200 looks like GVRW of 5th wheel has to come in under 15,000# Am I missing anything?

[justafordguy]

As long as you stay under your rear tire/axle rating you will be fine.

[SmokeyWren]

Originally Posted by justafordguy

As long as you stay under your rear tire/axle rating you will be fine.

You won't find a professional engineer (PE) certified in chassis engineering that will agree with you.

[Gordon Dewald]

Originally Posted by Jpdkmd

Took the F350 to the Cat scale today,filled up with fuel,DW and myself along wit some tools weight came in at 8220. Dont have the hitch installed yet.So adding the weight suggested by previous respondent of 150 lbs the weight would be approximately 8370#. The F350 has a towing capacity of 23,200 looks like GVRW of 5th wheel has to come in under 15,000# Am I missing anything?

Yes - you need the GCWR of the vehicle. Towing capacity is a number that the truck could tow if there was nothing else on a barebones truck.

[SmokeyWren]

Originally Posted by Gordon Dewald

Yes - you need the GCWR of the vehicle. Towing capacity is a number that the truck could tow if there was nothing else on a barebones truck.

Correct. The manufacturer's tow rating or towing capacity number is a wet dream. You need to know the actual tow rating, which is the GCWR of the tow vehicle minus the wet and loaded weight of that vehicle. "Wet and loaded" means a full tank of fuel plus all the people and stuff that will be in the vehicle when towing; toolbox, jacks, campfire wood, pets, cooler, everything, even the dog's chew toy.

But even when you know the actual tow capacity of your tow vehicle, that's only half of what you need to know if you don't want to be overloaded. You also need to know the net payload capacity available for hitch weight. That's the GVWR of the vehicle minus the weight of the wet and loaded vehicle. On most vehicles, the payload capacity will be your limiter.

The towing capacity tells you the max weight you can PULL without overheating anything in the drivetrain. The payload capacity tells you the max weight you can HAUL without overloading anything in the suspension, tires, wheels, frame, or brakes. If you exceed either the actual towing capacity or the actual payload capacity of your tow vehicle, you're overloaded.

[Cummins12V98]

The two rear tires are your limiting factor!

[justafordguy]

Originally Posted by Cummins12V98

The two rear tires are your limiting factor!

Agree 100%, stay under the rating of those two rear tires and you are fine.

[SmokeyWren]

Originally Posted by Cummins12V98

The two rear tires are your limiting factor!

Tires are rarely the limiting factor on a tow vehicle. On my F-150, the two stock rear tires can haul a max of 4,542 pounds, but my rear GAWR is only 3,850.

[genxrainman]

Tires are the limiting factor on 1/2 tons with P metric tires and here is why...
"Higher Temperature Due to Underinflation P-Metric Tires on Light Trucks Have Reduced Load Rating:
When a P-metric tire is installed as OE on light trucks, the load rating is reduced by a factor of 1.10 by the vehicle manufacturer. This load reduction is mandated by Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards (571.120). One reason for this includes the expectation that P-metric tires which are designed mainly for passenger cars, may experience more severe service on light trucks.
Example - P265/75R16 114S:
Tire and Rim Association Yearbook load tables show 2,601 lbs. Max. Load at 35 PSI. If this tire is fitted to light trucks however, the load(s) are reduced by a factor of 1.10.
For example: 2,601 lbs. Divided by 1.10 = 2,365 lbs. (rounded) at 35 PSI."
Manufacturers use a 20% safety margin to capture the federal mandates and also the fact that q customer will run the tires at 32-35 psi not the max which is where the max load rating is found. Example of my truck RGAWR: 4150, Tires with reduced weight rating at 35 psi is 4162lbs. Tire and Rim association Yearbook is a good resource for calculating tire loads.

[Jpdkmd]

Thanks to everyone for the information but you can see from all the various responses that there is no right collective answer.It would be so much easier if there was a unified standard amongst the truck and RV manufacturers.Wouldn't it be nice to say I want this unit and see what vehicles with what tires you would need to pull the unit.Also a caveat that your cargo,people etc cant exceed this weight.

[Gordon Dewald]

Originally Posted by Jpdkmd

Thanks to everyone for the information but you can see from all the various responses that there is no right collective answer.It would be so much easier if there was a unified standard amongst the truck and RV manufacturers.Wouldn't it be nice to say I want this unit and see what vehicles with what tires you would need to pull the unit.Also a caveat that your cargo,people etc cant exceed this weight.

I believe there is a standard answer - it depends. If you look at the same truck with the same equipment they will always be the same specs.

However in many cases folks will buy a truck for ride and later decide they want to tow something, and expect their car like truck to now act like a truck.

The right answer is fit the trailer to the truck you have or get a truck that fits the trailer you want.

Seems pretty uncomplicated until all of the variables are discussed. No matter what you do to the truck the numbers on the door are taken as gospel. You can change all kinds of things on the truck but the numbers remain the same. You can take the sticker off of the door but the numbers remain the same and a simple search of the VIN number will say the same.

You want a higher capacity truck - you will have to buy it.

[Cummins12V98]

Originally Posted by SmokeyWren

Tires are rarely the limiting factor on a tow vehicle. On my F-150, the two stock rear tires can haul a max of 4,542 pounds, but my rear GAWR is only 3,850.

Was not referring to 150/1500 trucks. Most of the 250/2500 350/3500 SRW trucks are limited by rear tire capacity.

[Gordon Dewald]

Originally Posted by Cummins12V98

Was not referring to 150/1500 trucks. Most of the 250/2500 350/3500 SRW trucks are limited by rear tire capacity.

Does not compute. Do you mean the GAWR is more than the capacity of the tires?