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04-11-2018, 07:34 PM
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#1
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Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 5
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Trailer weights & truck capabilities for a beginner
Hi guys. I'm new to the towing business. I'm looking at TTs, and I cannot find a straight answer on how much trailer I can handle safely. It seems like everyone uses a different "formula."
The way I thought it went was:
GCWR - tow vehicle GVWR = max trailer GVWR
Tow vehicle is:
2017 Ram 1500 Crew Cab 4WD
5.7L, 8speed auto
3.92 rear end
According to Chrysler, GCWR is 15,950, truck GVWR is 6,900. That should leave 9,050 for a GVWR on any trailer.
Am I overthinking this or is this the right way to do it?
Thanks
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04-11-2018, 07:48 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,020
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Well it's a little more complicated than that.
You have three limits on your vehicle that you should keep in mind for your safety and every one else's who share the road with you.
The first is GCWR. You have that one mostly figured out.
The next is gross vehicle weight rating, GVWR. That is the maximum your vehicle can weigh. Bear in mind that a certain portion of your trailer's weight (tongue weight) will be carried by your tow vehicle: about 1/8th. This is the limiting factor for most most towable RVs. There is a sticker inside your drivers side door that tells you how much you may add to your truck (or SUV or whatever): this is people, stuff, a hitch (up to 100 lbs!), and the tongue weight. The VAST majority of vehicles will run out of this payload before ever touching GCWR so it receives the most attention by the RV world.
The third number is you rear axle weight rating, RAWR. Some vehicles are designed such that a good portion of the payload needs to be carried on the front axle which is, well, not good for trailer towing.
But mind the GVWR first and foremost and the other two will probably work out OK.
__________________
2018 ORV Timber Ridge 24rks
2017 F350 6.7 CC DRW
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04-11-2018, 07:55 PM
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#3
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Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 5
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So does the tongue weight get subtracted from your payload capacity?
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04-11-2018, 08:07 PM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,020
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supreme2005
So does the tongue weight get subtracted from your payload capacity?
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Yep!
__________________
2018 ORV Timber Ridge 24rks
2017 F350 6.7 CC DRW
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04-11-2018, 08:22 PM
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#6
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Senior Member
Winnebago Owners Club
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 14,890
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Everything gets subtracted from your carrying capacity. People, pets, some optional equipment, firewood, tool box, grill, etc.
If you can load up your truck with everything you are going to take with you camping, everything you might possibly take. Kids, neighbors kids, fill it full of fuel, throw in that firewood and grill and propane tanks, bicycles, games, etc and go to a weigh scale. The difference between the weigh and the GVWR will get you an approximate weight the trailer plus hitch can be.
__________________
Gordon and Janet
Tour 42QD/InTech Stacker
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04-11-2018, 08:59 PM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 740
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Well, the good news is with the Ram 1500, you've got about the best scenario with the 3.92 gears, and 8-speed transmission. Available payload is usually the shortfall, but if you can cover that, game on.
https://www.ramtrucks.com/assets/tow...ing_charts.pdf
Don't get too excited with the chart, it's only a guideline, your GVWR sticker will give you more accurate info for your specific truck, then a trip to the scales as above. Watch dry weights on trailers, for planning, add up to ~ 1,500 lbs of "stuff" to get you in the neighborhood of real world trailer loaded weights.
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04-12-2018, 08:09 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Palm Coast Florida
Posts: 12,995
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All the numbers matter in one way or another. If you are a farmer pulling a hay wagon out of a field, vs a truck camper, vs a travel trailer vs using some of the other contraptions used to towing. There are so many numbers because people do so many different things with their trucks.
When it comes to pure towing I think of a hay wagon that has 10,000lbs of hay sitting on it. But I can pick up the tongue up because it only weighs 60 lbs. Boats are also in this category as boats with a relatively light tongue weight. Usually around 10% of total weight.
When people see a truck that can tow 10,000lbs they think they can tow any trailer when it is only a hay wagon or maybe a boat. This is why towing capacity is important.
TT's put so much weight on trucks that weight distribution devices are used. That is why GVWR and load capacity are so important.
People put snow plows on trucks. This is why front axle rating is important.
People carry truck campers, stone, bricks, wet mulch, bags of concrete etc. which makes the rear axle rating important.
For a TT you will run out of GVWR or load carrying capacity first. So keep an eye on that.
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04-12-2018, 09:58 AM
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#9
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Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tuffr2
All the numbers matter in one way or another. If you are a farmer pulling a hay wagon out of a field, vs a truck camper, vs a travel trailer vs using some of the other contraptions used to towing. There are so many numbers because people do so many different things with their trucks.
When it comes to pure towing I think of a hay wagon that has 10,000lbs of hay sitting on it. But I can pick up the tongue up because it only weighs 60 lbs. Boats are also in this category as boats with a relatively light tongue weight. Usually around 10% of total weight.
When people see a truck that can tow 10,000lbs they think they can tow any trailer when it is only a hay wagon or maybe a boat. This is why towing capacity is important.
TT's put so much weight on trucks that weight distribution devices are used. That is why GVWR and load capacity are so important.
People put snow plows on trucks. This is why front axle rating is important.
People carry truck campers, stone, bricks, wet mulch, bags of concrete etc. which makes the rear axle rating important.
For a TT you will run out of GVWR or load carrying capacity first. So keep an eye on that.
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best explantation I have ever seen
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04-12-2018, 10:06 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Oregon
Posts: 653
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supreme2005
So does the tongue weight get subtracted from your payload capacity?
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Yes, and this is more important than the tow rating for the vehicle as you'll make this out long before you come close to the tow rating.
__________________
2015 Ram 2500 Big Horn, 6.7 cummins, Crew Cab, 4x4
Mid 2016 Outdoors RV Creekside 23DBS, w/backcountry x4 and armor options.
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04-12-2018, 10:54 AM
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#11
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Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 5
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Not trying to make a long story short, because it is important, would it be safe to say that if I don't exceed the payload capacity of my truck, even with the tongue weight factored in, and as long as I'm within the GCWR, am I good?
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04-12-2018, 11:01 AM
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#12
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: HillBilly country, Smokey Mtns
Posts: 4,171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tuffr2
For a TT you will run out of GVWR or load carrying capacity first. So keep an eye on that.
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Right. And here's how to estimate the max weight of any TT you can tow without being overloaded.
GVWR of the tow vehicle (TV) minus the weight of the wet and loaded weight of the TV = payload capacity available for hitch weight.
Payload capacity available for hitch weight divided by 13% = max weight of any TT you can tow without being overloaded with a TT that has average tongue weight.
To expand on that, the wet and loaded weight of the TV should be based on an actual scale weight of the TV when the TV is full of gas (i.e. "wet") and it's loaded with all the people, pets, tools, campfire wood, toys, jacks and jack stands and jack base, and any other weight that might be in the TV when towing. Generator? Gas for the generator? Floor jack? Don't even try to guess at what those weights will be, because most folks would under-estimate that weight. Load it up and weigh it on a CAT scale at a truck stop, then you can calculate a very good estimate of the max trailer weight you can tow without being overloaded.
And when shopping for a trailer, then use the GVWR of the trailer as the max trailer weight you can tow without being overloaded. Again, attempting to guess at weights will probably just result in an overloaded condition.
After you get it all put together, then load the trailer with everything that will be in it when towing, then weigh the wet and loaded rig on a CAT scale to see how well you did in your choices. Compare the combined GAWRs of the trailer axles to the weight on the trailer axles. Compare the weight on the rear axle of the TV to the rGAWR of the TV. Add the weights on the front and drive axles to get GVW, then compare GVW to the GVWR of the TV to determine if you exceed the payload capacity of the TV.
If you're not overloaded over any of those limits, then you done good. And then you'll know how much wiggle room you have for loading even more weight in the TV and/or trailer. For example, if DW wants to haul her heavy cast iron Dutch oven so she can make a stew over the campfire, you'll know if you can do that without being overloaded.
__________________
Grumpy ole man with over 60 years towing experience. Now my heaviest trailer is a 7'x16' 5,000-pound flatbed utility trailer, my tow vehicle is a 2019 F-150 Lariat 3.5L EcoBoost SuperCab with Max Tow (1,904 pounds payload capacity).
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04-12-2018, 11:08 AM
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#13
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: St. George, UT
Posts: 1,950
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Our TT weighs around 5,500 lbs with the same truck, and gearing. It’s smooth, handles, and tracks really nice while towing. Out here in the NW it handles 90% of the passes around 3,200 rpms at 60 mph. MPG’s are always in the 11 to 12 range.
Like others have mentioned watch your payload, but I personally wouldn’t go over 6,500 to 7,000 lbs gross.
__________________
Owners of a 2018 Lance 1995
St.George, UT
Former 02 Intrigue by Country Coach
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04-12-2018, 10:11 PM
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#14
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Senior Member
Thor Owners Club
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: South Jordan, UT
Posts: 106
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Trailer weights & truck capabilities for a beginner
I pull a 34 ft travel trailer that weighs around 8,200 lbs loaded down with a 2017 F-150 crew cab short box 3.5 liter twin turbo Ecoboost, 10-speed transmission, 3.55 gears and a class 4 hitch. Truck towing capacity is rated at 10,500lbs with this combination. I also have an Equal-i-zer brand weight distribution and sway control hitch, Hellwig overload leaf spring sets, added a Hellwig rear sway bar, and replaced the stock 4-ply tires with proper 10-ply tires to “safely” tow this much weight. With my fresh water tank full I am just under the rear axle rating for this F-150. This is what it took to give me piece of mind towing this setup with a half ton pickup truck.
__________________
The Four J’s - Josh, Jen, Jannie, Joah
2017 Keystone Cougar 29BHSWE
2021 Ford F-250 4x4 CC SB Tremor w/ 7.3L V8 Gas
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